Why Locks Don't Work (video)

I'm starting a series of videos on why wrist locks don't work, and to give some insight into some of the mechanics needed for effective application.

Feedback appreciated on this video, and as I go along introducing other ones.

Why Wrist Locks Don't Work

The basic functionality and correct positions and angles for applying kote-geashi, you see in this video:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=1DOhGmysZyo

Do you consider Kote-geashi a wrist lock?

Peter Rehse wrote: Do you consider Kote-geashi a wrist lock?

Dear Peter,
My answer is no. Kote Gaeshi is a throw which utilises the wrist to achieve the object is to throw the person. Cheers, Joe.

Joe Curran wrote: Dear Peter, My answer is no. Kote Gaeshi is a throw which utilises the wrist to achieve the object is to throw the person. Cheers, Joe.

I'll quibble a bit.

1. Kotegaeshi is neither a lock -- nor a throw
2. Kotegaeshi is a CONTROL, whose purpose is to maintain a certain connection
3. What throws --- THROUGH that connection -- is EITHER tai-sabaki OR Aiki
4. Tai sabaki makes a throw by carrying uke's body dynamically OUTSIDE his zone of support, causing his support structure to alter irrevocably
5. Aiki makes a throw by irrevocably altering the internal support structure of uke's body while still WITHIN his (presumed) zone of support, causing his zone of support to contract and disappear

Joe Curran wrote: Dear Peter, My answer is no. Kote Gaeshi is a throw which utilises the wrist to achieve the object is to throw the person. Cheers, Joe.

I tend to be quite literal - "Small hand return/fold"

There are pins/locks that use it but it is more than likely, as you say, used in a throw. I just have trouble classing it as a wrist lock since it certainly does not do that.

I always thought the kote was actually the forearm, from the elbow forward.

Cliff Judge wrote: I always thought the kote was actually the forearm, from the elbow forward.

It is, including the hand. In Kendo the kote is the glove that covers the area.

Pretty hard to just fold the forearm.

I wouldn't chew gum on my video's if I were you.

Peter Rehse wrote: It is, including the hand. In Kendo the kote is the glove that covers the area. Pretty hard to just fold the forearm.

No, but you can return it.

Both Kote Gaeshi and Shiho Nage bridge the gap separating immobilization techniques and projection techniques. They don't fall into either category exclusively.

Ron

Cliff Judge wrote: No, but you can return it.

You can also extend it, and affect structure that way. Still Kotegaishi.

Cliff Judge wrote: No, but you can return it.

Ha! I hadn't even watched the video with sound yet, and here I was, making Richard's arguments for him.

I pretty much agree with this clip in general.

Joseph Dostie wrote: You can also extend it, and affect structure that way. Still Kotegaishi.

gaeshi = return,
kotegaeshi = forearm return

Cliff Judge wrote: Ha! I hadn't even watched the video with sound yet, and here I was, making Richard's arguments for him. I pretty much agree with this clip in general. gaeshi = return, kotegaeshi = forearm return

Gaishi can also mean reversal - kote gaeshi - wrist reversal, no?

Now if you extend the arm out and turn the palm/wrist over in the direction it does not like to turn, is that not kote-gaishi? If not, what would you call it?

Forearm - does not include the wrist or any part of the hand. Kote does. Just saying.

Joseph Dostie wrote: Now if you extend the arm out and turn the palm/wrist over in the direction it does not like to turn, is that not kote-gaishi? If not, what would you call it?

What means gaishi?

Joseph Dostie wrote: Gaishi can also mean reversal - kote gaeshi - wrist reversal, no? Now if you extend the arm out and turn the palm/wrist over in the direction it does not like to turn, is that not kote-gaishi? If not, what would you call it?

The term I am familiar with for wrist is te kubi - neck of the hand.

But I generally agree with what you are saying - the overall movement of energy in a good kotegaeshi (which is to say....I have discovered it works best in general when I do it this way) comes up from uke's back foot, into nage's hara, and then returns back to uke at some point where they aren't strong. I think what you are describing is basically that.

Interesting.

Is there going to be a clip demoing with an alive, resisting, non compliant partner not half nage's size and a bit athletic?

Dan Richards wrote: I'm starting a series of videos on why wrist locks don't work.

It is very simple - because you don't know how to do it correctly. That is why you need some kind of artificial patches trying to fill up the missing part of knowledge.

Szczepan Janczuk wrote: It is very simple - because you don't know how to do it correctly. That is why you need some kind of artificial patches trying to fill up the missing part of knowledge.

Did you watch the video? Is there something you disagree with?

Cliff Judge wrote: The term I am familiar with for wrist is te kubi - neck of the hand. But I generally agree with what you are saying - the overall movement of energy in a good kotegaeshi (which is to say....I have discovered it works best in general when I do it this way) comes up from uke's back foot, into nage's hara, and then returns back to uke at some point where they aren't strong. I think what you are describing is basically that.

It is a tekubi waza - certainly.

Cliff Judge wrote: Did you watch the video? Is there something you disagree with?

Sure thing, I watched video. In static situation (already red flag), in front of attacker (zero understanding of martial interaction) he is trying to twist a wrist (zero understanding of internal structure) on unbalanced body (zero understanding of correct biomechanics) .

Please tell me you guys aren't making arguments about how to do 'kotegaeshi' based on translating the label... Good lord...

Szczepan Janczuk wrote: Sure thing, I watched video. In static situation (already red flag), in front of attacker (zero understanding of martial interaction) he is trying to twist a wrist (zero understanding of internal structure) on unbalanced body (zero understanding of correct biomechanics) .

I don't really think you watched the video. What specific points did Mr. Richards make that you disagree with, about why some wrist locks don't work?