Welcome to AikiWeb Aikido Information
AikiWeb: The Source for Aikido Information
AikiWeb's principal purpose is to serve the Internet community as a repository and dissemination point for aikido information.

Sections
home
aikido articles
columns

Discussions
forums
aikiblogs

Databases
dojo search
seminars
image gallery
supplies
links directory

Reviews
book reviews
video reviews
dvd reviews
equip. reviews

News
submit
archive

Miscellaneous
newsletter
rss feeds
polls
about

Follow us on



Home > AikiWeb Aikido Forums
Go Back   AikiWeb Aikido Forums > Anonymous

Hello and thank you for visiting AikiWeb, the world's most active online Aikido community! This site is home to over 22,000 aikido practitioners from around the world and covers a wide range of aikido topics including techniques, philosophy, history, humor, beginner issues, the marketplace, and more.

If you wish to join in the discussions or use the other advanced features available, you will need to register first. Registration is absolutely free and takes only a few minutes to complete so sign up today!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 05-14-2012, 09:00 AM   #1
"Arkady Bogdanov"
IP Hash: dab28b0d
Anonymous User
Changing aikido organizations

Hello,

I currently train in a dojo which is affiliated with "Organization A", which is headed by a high level shihan. However, I have been attending many seminars with the shihan from "Organization B", and I find that I much prefer the teaching style and aikido being shown by Shihan B.

The problem is that there is no dojo affiliated with Organization B in my area that I can join to get the affiliation with the shihan. I doubt I could ever truly be his student without at least affiliating with the organization in some way.

I would also like to say that I have zero problems with the current dojo I'm training at or my immediate teachers, and I would like to continue training there, if possible.

But I fear that even raising the question of switching organizations may be viewed as a betrayal by some there. I love training there and don't desire to cause disharmony or sever the bonds which have taken years to form. On the other hand, I also feel that for me continuing to test and accept rank from Organization A would be rather insincere, if not downright dishonest, since in my heart I know that I want the transmission of my aikido to come primarily from shihan B.

I also hesitate to approach Shihan B with this question, as I feel I would be imposing on him somewhat and potentially causing political headaches for him and his organization.

I'd just like to know if other aikidoka have experienced similar issues, and how they delt with it. Has anyone ever successfully changed organization affliliations while continuing to train in the same dojo?

Sorry for being so vague, but I fear getting more specific would jeopardize my anonymity.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2012, 11:52 PM   #2
Chris Li
 
Chris Li's Avatar
Dojo: Aikido Sangenkai
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 3,079
United_States
Offline
Re: Changing aikido organizations

Quote:
Anonymous User wrote: View Post
Hello,

I currently train in a dojo which is affiliated with "Organization A", which is headed by a high level shihan. However, I have been attending many seminars with the shihan from "Organization B", and I find that I much prefer the teaching style and aikido being shown by Shihan B.

The problem is that there is no dojo affiliated with Organization B in my area that I can join to get the affiliation with the shihan. I doubt I could ever truly be his student without at least affiliating with the organization in some way.

I would also like to say that I have zero problems with the current dojo I'm training at or my immediate teachers, and I would like to continue training there, if possible.

But I fear that even raising the question of switching organizations may be viewed as a betrayal by some there. I love training there and don't desire to cause disharmony or sever the bonds which have taken years to form. On the other hand, I also feel that for me continuing to test and accept rank from Organization A would be rather insincere, if not downright dishonest, since in my heart I know that I want the transmission of my aikido to come primarily from shihan B.

I also hesitate to approach Shihan B with this question, as I feel I would be imposing on him somewhat and potentially causing political headaches for him and his organization.

I'd just like to know if other aikidoka have experienced similar issues, and how they delt with it. Has anyone ever successfully changed organization affliliations while continuing to train in the same dojo?

Sorry for being so vague, but I fear getting more specific would jeopardize my anonymity.
Why is there a burden on you to do anything at all?

For organization A, train with shihan B, and keep training with organization A if you feel like it. If someone doesn't like it then they'll tell you and then you can decide if you want to continue training under that kind of an organization (I wouldn't).

As for shihan B, just tell him straight out, and you may have the opportunity to make the same decision.

Personally, I wouldn't train with anybody who didn't leave the free choice up to me.

Best,

Chris

  Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2012, 02:39 AM   #3
Henrypsim
Dojo: Aikido Sangenkai
Location: Honolulu Hawaii
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 40
United_States
Offline
Re: Changing aikido organizations

Quote:
Anonymous User wrote: View Post
Hello,

I currently train in a dojo which is affiliated with "Organization A", which is headed by a high level shihan. However, I have been attending many seminars with the shihan from "Organization B", and I find that I much prefer the teaching style and aikido being shown by Shihan B.

The problem is that there is no dojo affiliated with Organization B in my area that I can join to get the affiliation with the shihan. I doubt I could ever truly be his student without at least affiliating with the organization in some way.

I would also like to say that I have zero problems with the current dojo I'm training at or my immediate teachers, and I would like to continue training there, if possible.

But I fear that even raising the question of switching organizations may be viewed as a betrayal by some there. I love training there and don't desire to cause disharmony or sever the bonds which have taken years to form. On the other hand, I also feel that for me continuing to test and accept rank from Organization A would be rather insincere, if not downright dishonest, since in my heart I know that I want the transmission of my aikido to come primarily from shihan B.

I also hesitate to approach Shihan B with this question, as I feel I would be imposing on him somewhat and potentially causing political headaches for him and his organization.

I'd just like to know if other aikidoka have experienced similar issues, and how they delt with it. Has anyone ever successfully changed organization affliliations while continuing to train in the same dojo?

Sorry for being so vague, but I fear getting more specific would jeopardize my anonymity.
Please ask yourself....what is your goal? Your goal, like most everyone else is to learn. Hell with the politics. You are not running an organization or teaching martial arts commercially to support yourself. You are your own free spirit. All things being equal, integrity to yourself and to others is always above loyalty. Concur with what Chris said. If either organization has a problem with you training on both sides, then drop that organization. However, if it actually comes to either/or, then go with what is best for your own interest and learning (which I assume would be organization B). Please keep in mind, it is what you learned that is important and not from whom you get your rank. Rank is for ego and nothing more. What you actually learned is for REAL. And only you can tell whether you have learned. Besides, any SELF CONFIDENTsensei who truly care for their students would not be upset because you train at another organization. As a caring sensei who is confident of his own ability, he would welcome it because it would broaden your (his student) horizon. Like most learning situation, there is always a chemistry between sensei and student. When the chemistry is not exactly right, it does not mean that the sensei is no good.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2012, 02:18 PM   #4
NagaBaba
 
NagaBaba's Avatar
Location: Wild, deep, deadly North
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,145
Offline
Re: Changing aikido organizations

Quote:
Anonymous User wrote: View Post
Hello,

I currently train in a dojo which is affiliated with "Organization A", which is headed by a high level shihan. However, I have been attending many seminars with the shihan from "Organization B", and I find that I much prefer the teaching style and aikido being shown by Shihan B.

The problem is that there is no dojo affiliated with Organization B in my area that I can join to get the affiliation with the shihan. I doubt I could ever truly be his student without at least affiliating with the organization in some way.

I would also like to say that I have zero problems with the current dojo I'm training at or my immediate teachers, and I would like to continue training there, if possible.

But I fear that even raising the question of switching organizations may be viewed as a betrayal by some there. I love training there and don't desire to cause disharmony or sever the bonds which have taken years to form. On the other hand, I also feel that for me continuing to test and accept rank from Organization A would be rather insincere, if not downright dishonest, since in my heart I know that I want the transmission of my aikido to come primarily from shihan B.

I also hesitate to approach Shihan B with this question, as I feel I would be imposing on him somewhat and potentially causing political headaches for him and his organization.

I'd just like to know if other aikidoka have experienced similar issues, and how they delt with it. Has anyone ever successfully changed organization affliliations while continuing to train in the same dojo?

Sorry for being so vague, but I fear getting more specific would jeopardize my anonymity.
You can't have both.
You have to move to the area where there are the dojo with right affiliation.

Nagababa

ask for divine protection Ame no Murakumo Kuki Samuhara no Ryuo
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2012, 02:57 PM   #5
hughrbeyer
Dojo: Shobu Aikido of Boston
Location: Peterborough, NH
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 653
United_States
Offline
Re: Changing aikido organizations

The problem, as you've defined it, is that you can't spend significant time with Shihan B or his organization. That being the case, you're stuck with organization and Shihan A. There's nothing wrong with sticking with them and also going to study with Shihan B when you can. Just be aware that Org A is going to judge you by their standards. There's no need to feel awkward about taking rank from Org A either--they are still your parent organization and will still have a major influence on your aikido, willy-nilly.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2012, 05:12 PM   #6
danielajames
 
danielajames's Avatar
Dojo: Brisbane Aikido Republic
Location: Brisbane
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 294
Australia
Offline
Re: Changing aikido organizations

Don't throw the baby out with the bath water. Org A is providing a dojo for you to train in and teachers for you to learn from - this is an amazing gift. Drawing inspiration from beyond these realms, like Hugh says is a great thing too but its not your day to day bread and butter.

best,
Dan

Daniel James, Brisbane Aikido Republic: AikiPhysics, Aikido Brisbane news,
ph 0413 001 844, 1593 Logan Rd, Mt.Gravatt, Brisbane, AUSTRALIA
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2012, 07:23 PM   #7
"Arkady Bogdanov"
IP Hash: 58ee7c7b
Anonymous User
Re: Changing aikido organizations

Thank you everyone for your kind replies. After reading the wisdom here and much thought, I have decided to continue to "walk two paths", that is, to continue training with Org A at home and travelling to train with both Org B and Org A. Perhaps the two paths will merge one day.

The dojo I train in, and which I have trained in since beginning Aikido, will forever be a part of me. The training I receive there is, and will continue to be, invaluable. A wonderful gift, as someone here has said. The members are like a second family to me. I don't believe I could bear parting them.

Perhaps one day, I will be able to begin giving back to both groups that which they have given me over many years, as I believe this is in the spirit of sensei's efforts (and also Jun's) of connecting the entire aikido community together through the organizational barriers that exist today.

Thank you all very much!
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2012, 06:06 PM   #8
Basia Halliop
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 711
Canada
Offline
Re: Changing aikido organizations

Nothing to add to the conversation, but I noticed you posted in the anonymous forum, and your username is 'Anonymous User', however your full name is listed above... if you wanted to be anonymous you might want to contact the moderator and see if that info can be hidden.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2012, 06:11 PM   #9
"Arkady Bogdanov"
IP Hash: 58ee7c7b
Anonymous User
Re: Changing aikido organizations

Quote:
Basia Halliop wrote: View Post
Nothing to add to the conversation, but I noticed you posted in the anonymous forum, and your username is 'Anonymous User', however your full name is listed above... if you wanted to be anonymous you might want to contact the moderator and see if that info can be hidden.
This is not my full name. Arkady Bogdanov is a fictional character from the Mars Trilogy books. Good reading, if you're into hard sci-fi
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-22-2012, 11:53 PM   #10
danielajames
 
danielajames's Avatar
Dojo: Brisbane Aikido Republic
Location: Brisbane
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 294
Australia
Offline
Re: Changing aikido organizations

Quote:
Anonymous User wrote: View Post

Perhaps one day, I will be able to begin giving back ...
You may already be there! There is no greater gift than the day in day out honest giving of your mind and body to the practice. Probably no teacher desires more than this, well a little something for the rent helps too

all the best,
dan

Daniel James, Brisbane Aikido Republic: AikiPhysics, Aikido Brisbane news,
ph 0413 001 844, 1593 Logan Rd, Mt.Gravatt, Brisbane, AUSTRALIA
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-2012, 10:57 AM   #11
Edgecrusher
 
Edgecrusher's Avatar
Dojo: Tampa, FL
Location: Tampa, Florida
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 76
United_States
Offline
Re: Changing aikido organizations

You should never feel like you cannot approach Shihan B and express your feelings. Especially if you are having doubts or being hassled by someone. I had a situation at my dojo some years ago when I was the only mudansha. There was my Shihan (Hachidan in Tomiki) and several other black belts ranked at the respective dojos in their respective styles. A couple of these gentlemen would put me through the ringer and what did not kill me made me stronger. I felt for a while that I had nobody to talk to or hear me. These other black belts by the way would come and go and never stuck around too much. When I finally opened up to my Shihan, he was floored and that kind of thing never happened again. He has told me that if I ever experience anything remotely close to that, to inform him immediately. I am now the senior student and I have made it my personal goal to reach out to every new student and make them feel comfortable. I know this might be an extreme version of what you have gone through but, I think you owe it to yourself and Shihan B a face to face meeting of how you feel.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2013, 10:52 PM   #12
OwlMatt
 
OwlMatt's Avatar
Dojo: Milwaukee Aikikai
Location: Wisconsin
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 401
United_States
Offline
Re: Changing aikido organizations

You like the club you're at, and there's no opportunity to join Shihan B's organization where you are? In that case, the obvious answer seems to be to stay at your current club and train under Shihan B whenever you get the chance.

  Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2013, 04:23 PM   #13
Krystal Locke
Location: Phoenix, Oregon
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 387
United_States
Offline
Re: Changing aikido organizations

I like zombies.

Anyway, you like shihan B's seminar teaching style and his aikido. Great. I would suggest looking at shihan B not as a seminar teacher, but just as sensei B. That's to say, are you certain that the aikido and instruction you experience at a seminar from this person is indicative of the organization's aikido and pedagogy, the shihan's seminar specific behavior, or of the person's day to day teaching skill? Finding a org B dojo may not help. Finding shihan B's dojo may help.

Sounds like you have too small and limited a sample size on the one side to jump ship. Kinda like wanting to move to wherever you just went for vacation. Life (on vacation) is great in Vegas......
  Reply With Quote

Please visit our sponsor:

Aikido DVDs and Video Downloads - by George Ledyard Sensei & other great teachers from AikidoDVDS.Com



Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Yoshinkai - Beyond the "Hard Style" Label Susan Dalton Columns 8 11-16-2011 06:53 AM
Transmission, Inheritance, Emulation 18 Peter Goldsbury Columns 187 09-08-2011 02:41 PM
I'm Leaving Aikido Daniel Ranger-Holt General 122 10-07-2010 08:01 PM
How I Met Aikido rulemaker General 2 06-29-2010 10:02 PM
Transmission, Inheritance, Emulation 10 Peter Goldsbury Columns 200 02-04-2009 06:45 AM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:53 AM.



vBulletin Copyright © 2000-2014 Jelsoft Enterprises Limited
----------
Copyright 1997-2014 AikiWeb and its Authors, All Rights Reserved.
----------
For questions and comments about this website:
Send E-mail
plainlaid-picaresque outchasing-protistan explicantia-altarage seaford-stellionate