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Old 11-24-2005, 12:13 PM   #1
Josh Reyer
 
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日本語で合気道を語りましょう

皆さん、

初めまして、ジョシュと申します。
日本語というのは、僕の趣味なんです。
趣味というか、生涯のお付き合いと言った方がいいですかね。
実は、日本語に精進するため、10年前に合気道を辞めたんです。
(完全に辞めなければ良かったのにね。)

という訳で、また合気の道を歩みだして、
今は日本語で稽古を付けて頂いてます。
なかなか面白いですね。
英語の場合と違って、日本語では
合気道用語を使っても違和感がないですね。

日本語の出来る皆さん、合気道の話題で盛り上がりましょう。

よろしくお願いします。m(_ _)m

Josh Reyer

The lyf so short, the crafte so longe to lerne,
Th'assay so harde, so sharpe the conquerynge...
- Chaucer
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Old 12-20-2005, 09:01 PM   #2
Koren Ko
 
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Re: 日本語で合気道を語りましょう

Hi Joshua Meyer,

Sorry if I write in using English X_X. I am still learning the language. May i just do a translation?

Let's use Nihon-go for Aiki-do Discussion?

To everybody,

For a start, I am Joshua.
Speaking in Japanese, has become my interest.
With interest to speak, its a lifelong joy to use the language.

Actually, my profiency in Japanese, seeded from Aikido learning since 10 years ago
(Gradually, i had improved and fully grasped the language)

という訳で、また合気の道を歩みだして、(???)解りません、ごめん!
今は日本語で稽古を付けて頂いてます。(???)解りません,ごめね!
It seems interesting.

Its non-English speaking environment, but Japanese
It doesn't feel awkward using Japanese word for the Aikido terms.

If you guys knew the language, let discussed Aikido related things(in Japanese).

Please do me this flavor m(_ _)m

Did I translated wrongly? Please tell me and I will correct it. X_X
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Old 12-26-2005, 10:04 AM   #3
Josh Reyer
 
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Re: 日本語で合気道を語りましょう

Koren,

First, my name is Reyer, not Meyer. Although it's not a common name, so I can understand if you were confused. Your translation was pretty good, especially since neither Japanese nor English is your native language!

Here's what I was saying:

皆さん、

Everyone,

初めまして、ジョシュと申します。

Nice to meet you, my name is Josh.
Lit: Being the first time (we meet), (I am) named Josh.

日本語というのは、僕の趣味なんです。

Japanese language is my hobby.

趣味というか、生涯のお付き合いと言った方がいいですかね。

Or rather than a hobby, it might be better to say a lifelong relationship.

実は、日本語に精進するため、10年前に合気道を辞めたんです。

Actually, I quit aikido 10 years ago, to devote (myself) to Japanese.

(完全に辞めなければ良かったのにね。)

(Even though I didn't need to totally quit...)

という訳で、また合気の道を歩みだして、
今は日本語で稽古を付けて頂いてます。

And so, I've started walking on the way of aiki again,
(and) now I'm training via Japanese.

なかなか面白いですね。

It's rather interesting.

英語の場合と違って、日本語では
合気道用語を使っても違和感がないですね。

Unlike in the case of English, in Japanese
there's no incongruity when using aikido terms.

日本語の出来る皆さん、合気道の話題で盛り上がりましょう。

Everyone who can speak Japanese, let's have fun with the topic of aikido!

よろしくお願いします。m(_ _)m

Untranslatable, but entirely necessary.

That was a good start. Keep practicing, and you'll pick up the various idioms that give a language its character! 頑張って下さい!

Josh Reyer

The lyf so short, the crafte so longe to lerne,
Th'assay so harde, so sharpe the conquerynge...
- Chaucer
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Old 12-28-2005, 12:41 AM   #4
Koren Ko
 
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Re: 日本語で合気道を語りましょう

Oh...It seems I translated wrongly... :P
Need to work harder then.

The middle part totally out of means.

Will you write something else in Japanese? I then may try to sort it out?

Btw, my mistake. it was a visual illusion of me to put the R as M. X_X

"という訳で、また合気の道を歩みだして、
今は日本語で稽古を付けて頂いてます。

And so, I've started walking on the way of aiki again,
(and) now I'm training via Japanese."

from this 2 lines, "今は日本語で稽古を付けて頂いてます。"
稽古を付けて頂いてます-->??? Will you care to explain word by word?

Thnx!
Koren
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Old 01-07-2006, 11:08 PM   #5
Josh Reyer
 
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Re: 日本語で合気道を語りましょう

Quote:
Koren Ko Jen Foo wrote:
Oh...It seems I translated wrongly... :P
Need to work harder then.

The middle part totally out of means.

Will you write something else in Japanese? I then may try to sort it out?
明けましておめでとうございます!
今年もよろしくお願いします!

決まり言葉だけど、知らなくてはいけないフレーズですね。
ちゃんと覚えて、毎年の今頃に使いましょう!

Quote:
from this 2 lines, "今は日本語で稽古を付けて頂いてます。"
稽古を付けて頂いてます-->??? Will you care to explain word by word?
稽古 - keiko, practice
付ける - tsukeru, attach
稽古を付ける - keiko wo tsukeru, to rehearse, to give (someone) lessons, to put (someone) through their paces
頂く - itadaku, receive
~て頂く - (verb)te itadaku, to have (someone) verb, e.g. して頂く, "have someone do".
頂く is a much politer version of もらう, which makes the same construction: してもらう, "have someone do". 頂く is 謙譲語 "humble speech", that places the giver on a higher level than the receiver.

So, 稽古を付けて頂いている means literally, "I'm having someone train (me)," or, in more natural English, "I'm being trained," or even "I'm training". The nuance in the Japanese sentence, though, is that I respect the people training me, in that I put the focus on them, and use the highly polite word 頂く.

Perhaps the most accurate idiomatic English would be, "I'm having the pleasure of being trained..." but it's a little wordy.

Josh Reyer

The lyf so short, the crafte so longe to lerne,
Th'assay so harde, so sharpe the conquerynge...
- Chaucer
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Old 01-15-2006, 12:10 AM   #6
Koren Ko
 
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Re: 日本語で合気道を語りましょう

Quote:
Joshua Reyer wrote:
明けましておめでとうございます!
今年もよろしくお願いします!

決まり言葉だけど、知らなくてはいけないフレーズですね。
ちゃんと覚えて、毎年の今頃に使いましょう!
今年もよろしくお願いします!
Let us have a pleasant year ahead too!

決まり言葉だけど、知らなくてはいけないフレーズですね。
Although I am fluent with daily/common speech, there are still phrases I don't know.
** いけない=Phrase Connector
A. Oh my god!
B.Hopeless/Useless
C. Has problem/feel bad
D. Use with[ 。。。ては~], Refuse/Don't Want
E. Use with[。。。と~から], Be Prepared/So that
F. I don't drink (Sake)!!!
Which one is your definition?

**決まり言葉, is it you are saying "the daily/common phrases/speech"???

ちゃんと覚えて、毎年の今頃に使いましょう!
Just reliasized that, I use them every year this time!
(Err...Did not comprehend fully...)

**ちゃんと覚えて=Just reliasized?

Quote:
Joshua Reyer wrote:
稽古 - keiko, practice
付ける - tsukeru, attach
稽古を付ける - keiko wo tsukeru, to rehearse, to give (someone) lessons, to put (someone) through their paces
頂く - itadaku, receive
~て頂く - (verb)te itadaku, to have (someone) verb, e.g. して頂く, "have someone do".
頂く is a much politer version of もらう, which makes the same construction: してもらう, "have someone do". 頂く is 謙譲語 "humble speech", that places the giver on a higher level than the receiver.

So, 稽古を付けて頂いている means literally, "I'm having someone train (me)," or, in more natural English, "I'm being trained," or even "I'm training". The nuance in the Japanese sentence, though, is that I respect the people training me, in that I put the focus on them, and use the highly polite word 頂く.

Perhaps the most accurate idiomatic English would be, "I'm having the pleasure of being trained..." but it's a little wordy.
OIC, this is a very extensive explanation. Thnx!!!

It seems when 謙譲語 pop-up, it will become somehow awkward to translate the whole phrase. Do we go using plain English, or puff it with elegant, bombastic word just to show how respectful it is???


Btw, Just scrapped my whole archive of various important songs, mangas, animes, movies, shortcut links, pictures,projects, mods and other data accidentally...and lost another hardisc in the process... I say, I am 祸不单行。。。
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Old 02-06-2006, 02:43 AM   #7
Mato-san
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Re: 日本語で合気道を語りましょう

Hi Josh,
Your Japanese is far to advanced for me to hold a conversation in Japanese, I will ask、 m( )m
こりわなんですか?See I am limited to hirogana and katakana at the moment but I do enjoy a little practise.

Before you drive or steer your vehicle, you must first start the engine, release the brake and find gear!
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Old 02-06-2006, 04:28 AM   #8
Mato-san
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Re: 日本語で合気道を語りましょう

see I can`t even get that right. これわなんですか?I have so much to learn, but I am really enjoying the path, tell me something will it get easier? Sorry about the english.
わたしの名前輪 まとです Australia 殻来ました 2005ねん 3がつ 18にち Australia かららいにち
いま ちばとぎんざで えいごをおしえています とてもたのしです いじょうです どぞゆろしくおにがいします
Tats as good as it gets.

Before you drive or steer your vehicle, you must first start the engine, release the brake and find gear!
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Old 02-06-2006, 06:13 AM   #9
Josh Reyer
 
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Re: 日本語で合気道を語りましょう

Quote:
Koren Ko Jen Foo wrote:
今年もよろしくお願いします!
Let us have a pleasant year ahead too!
Actually, this is a set phrase used during the New Year. As I mentioned above よろしくお願いします is really tough to translate, but one common way 今年もよろしくお願いします is translated is "Please give me your consideration this year, too."

The whole sequence, seen on 年賀状, Japanese New Years cards, goes as follows:

新年明けましておめでとうございます。
Happy New Year! (Literally, Congratulations on the opening of the New Year!)

去年はお世話になりました。
Thank you for last year! (Literally, I was obligated to you for last year.)

今年もよろしくお願いします。
Please give me your consideration this year, too.

In Japan, when you see a friend or acquaintance for the first time in January, you should say, 明けましておめでとうございます。今年もよろしくお願いします。

Quote:
決まり言葉だけど、知らなくてはいけないフレーズですね。
Although I am fluent with daily/common speech, there are still phrases I don't know.
"It's a set phrase, but one you should know."

Quote:
** いけない=Phrase Connector
A. Oh my god!
B.Hopeless/Useless
C. Has problem/feel bad
D. Use with[ 。。。ては~], Refuse/Don't Want
E. Use with[。。。と~から], Be Prepared/So that
F. I don't drink (Sake)!!!
Which one is your definition?
First, let's look at 知る. If you connect いけない to the て form, you get 知ってはいけない, which means "bad/wrong to know", or more colloquially, "must not know". If you turn 知って into its negative 知らなくて, you get "bad/wrong to not know", or colloquially "must know". This is how you get the "must" construction.

Examples:
行かなくてはいけない - I have to go.
しなくてはいけない - I have to do.

In English, we modify nouns with clauses after the noun, with an optional "that".

a phrase
a phrase (that) you have to know

In Japanese, the modifying clause comes before the noun.

フレーズ
知らなくてはいけないフレーズ

Quote:
**決まり言葉, is it you are saying "the daily/common phrases/speech"???
"set phrase", like greetings and phrases like "Thanks for coming," or "Make yourself at home."

Quote:
ちゃんと覚えて、毎年の今頃に使いましょう!
Just reliasized that, I use them every year this time!
(Err...Did not comprehend fully...)

**ちゃんと覚えて=Just reliasized?
ちゃんと - properly, correctly

使いましょう is not "I use" but "let's use". So the full sentence is, "Let's properly remember (learn) it, and use it every year!"

Quote:
It seems when 謙譲語 pop-up, it will become somehow awkward to translate the whole phrase. Do we go using plain English, or puff it with elegant, bombastic word just to show how respectful it is???
I'm a believer in translating into a natural idiom. So if the sense of the Japanese is stiff and formal, then it should be translated into stiff and formal English. If the Japanese is polite but relaxed, so should be the English. Unfortunately, you have to accept a certain loss of nuance.

Quote:
see I can`t even get that right. これわなんですか?I have so much to learn, but I am really enjoying the path, tell me something will it get easier? Sorry about the english.
わたしの名前輪 まとです Australia 殻来ました 2005ねん 3がつ 18にち Australia かららいにち
いま ちばとぎんざで えいごをおしえています とてもたのしです いじょうです どぞゆろしくおにがいします
Tats as good as it gets.
Mat, actually what you want is " これはなんですか?" When "wa" is used as a particle, it's written with the kana for "ha". So, "Konnichi wa" is こんにちは.

Your sentence written in kana would look like this:

わたしの なまえは マトです。オーストラリアから きました。 2005ねん 3がつ 18にちに オーストラリアから らいにち(しました)。
いま ちばと ぎんざで えいごを おしえています。 とても たのしいです。  いじょうです。 どうぞ よろしく おねがいします。

In natural Japanese it would look like this:

私の名前はマトです。オーストラリアから来ました。2005年3月18日にオーストラリアから来日しました。
今、千葉と銀座で英語を教えています。とても楽しいです。以上です。どうぞよろしくお願いします。

Incidently, in a recent post you made some comments about "san", which, I'm fear, are a bit incorrect (although I see where you're coming from). PM or email me if you'd like to talk about it!

Josh Reyer

The lyf so short, the crafte so longe to lerne,
Th'assay so harde, so sharpe the conquerynge...
- Chaucer
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Old 02-16-2006, 06:40 AM   #10
Koren Ko
 
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Re: 日本語で合気道を語りましょう

Ah! Been Away from Keyboard for a long time...

I heard it the JPE result is almost out this month end. I hope I got a good grade on both the 3rd and 4th grade.
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Old 04-16-2006, 12:50 PM   #11
Koren Ko
 
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Re: 日本語で合気道を語りましょう

Just answering to myself in reply of previous thread...

Pass my 4th grade (Which is consider 7years old child start talking Japanese by Japanese)
Failed my 3rd grade by less than 55%...(Trying out the feel, test out how hard it is...)

hahaha, whatever the result is. It won't stop me from learning it.
Anyway, Considered I accomplished my original goal of understanding Basic Japanese language system and reading basic material.

Next, get my ass to work up more on the basic. Plus, get a proper Japan language class to learn.
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Old 04-21-2006, 03:22 PM   #12
Richard Langridge
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Re: 日本語で合気道を語りましょう

Hi guys, great to hear you passed 4th level Koren Ko, that's just a distant hope for me! Anyway, here goes...

リチャド と もします。 にほんご お ならいます。 いま、 ぼく の じゅくれん は だめ です が、 まもなく しんぽ します よ!
これ は しつれい しました が...
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