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Old 03-24-2002, 01:28 AM   #1
nikonl
Join Date: Feb 2001
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Ai symbol Steven Seagal a true Aikidoka?

Hi, i've recently read a news article about Steven Seagal and it reminded me of something.

Why is Steven Seagal regarded as a reputable 'Aikidoka'?

His movies conveys violent messages and is totally the opposite of what O-sensei or Aikido is teaching.

Even if 'it is just a movie'. If he were a true aikidoka, he could have made movies which shows how aikido can control a villian through non-violent means, and not just go, "Its time to die", and crack goes the neck.

Also, i've heard reports that he's not very nice in real life too.

Where has his Ai spirit gone to?

I have friends whose only knowledge of Aikido is Steven Seagal, and they think Aikido is a deadly violent art which is totally the opposite of what it is.

So, i am wondering why is everyone 'supporting' him? Should he be the 'black sheep' and not be related to aikido at all, although he has really trained in it. Maybe he should call it another name, Seagal-do? So that people won't associate it with what actually Aikido is actually teaching.

Just my thoughts. Sorri if i have offended any of his fans.
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Old 03-24-2002, 02:53 AM   #2
shihonage
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Re: Steven Seagal a true Aikidoka?

Quote:
Originally posted by nikon

I have friends whose only knowledge of Aikido is Steven Seagal, and they think Aikido is a deadly violent art which is totally the opposite of what it is.
It is what you want it to be.
Seagal wants it to be this, you want it to be that... having freedom is great.
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Old 03-24-2002, 04:38 AM   #3
Edward
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No matter what, Steven Seagal has contributed largely in making Aikido so famous. The guy is 7th dan after all. Of course the ones looking for a deadly art get quickly disappointed and leave soon. Some others completely misunderstand it too and try to make it a religion of peace and love
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Old 03-24-2002, 05:16 AM   #4
guest1234
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First, I would agree with those who have pointed out that, whether what they are seeking is really there, or not, many students first show up at an Aikido dojo because of Seagal Sensei's films. So he is doing, in a certain way, a service by spreading the word that Aikido exists.

In his films, his charater is often portrayed as a gentle person who would rather not fight (despite references to a shadowy past) and only does so to protect himself or often others. While some end up maimed, many do not die, and most are those you wouldn't shed many tears over---the film's villians are usually without any redeeming qualities.

Also has been said, and what I've posted several times before in other threads, we each have what we consider 'true' Aikido in our minds, and it is OK for us to differ.

Finally, I try no to question, for the above reason and a few others, anyone's true motivation in his pursuit of Aikido, lest I be questioned in mine.
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Old 03-24-2002, 05:27 AM   #5
guest1234
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As for his personal life:

a. I doubt many of us know him personally; we know only what we read or hear. I know I have been misquoted in print, and a video-taped interview edited not to my liking. And I am not even famous. I believe about a person what I personally know, from actual interaction and observation.

b. As I've posted before, I think a sensei's personal life is just that, personal, and unless he involves me in it, none of my business (providing he is not breaking any laws). If I find out something I don't like, and don't like it enough, I can always leave his dojo. Senseis are not priests or therapists, and at most role models only in the children's classes.
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Old 03-24-2002, 09:47 AM   #6
brian northrup
Dojo: aikido of central new york
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steven seagal

hi in reply to steven seagal's aikido
first and foremost aikido is a martial art
osensei had a severe reputation for his training, as a matter of fact his dojo used to be called hell dojo, for good reason, dislocated joints and broken bones were very commom.

and if you go to steven seagals website you can buy a video called the path beyond thought that would greatly clarify his aikido

that being said i can appreciate the spiritual aspects of aikido but it isnt a religion, it is taught for self defense purposes, i do hope i havent offended any one who sees aikido as a religion, i too love the spiritual side of aikido but it is hard training that cultivates mind body spirit
not an idea.

brian
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Old 03-24-2002, 10:19 AM   #7
Edward
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Re: steven seagal

Quote:
Originally posted by brian northrup
it is hard training that cultivates mind body spirit
AMEN!
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Old 03-24-2002, 11:11 AM   #8
Carl Simard
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Quote:
Originally posted by ca
As for his personal life:

a. I doubt many of us know him personally; we know only what we read or hear. I know I have been misquoted in print, and a video-taped interview edited not to my liking. And I am not even famous. I believe about a person what I personally know, from actual interaction and observation.
I agree with you. What we see in the movies is not the "real life". Well, if someone was ready to give me millions of $ to do some aikido in a film, I would gladly agree, even if the script doesn't really reflect what aikido is all about... We shouldn't think that Seagal's aikido is good or not basing on what we see on the movies. They are run by a script and commercial goal, not by MA spirit or some noble goal...

As many people posted, no matter if Seagal's aikido is good or not, he contribute largely to make aikido known to many peoples and made them show up at the dojo to try it. So, it think we should at least give it some respect for that: he made our martial art (particularly true in North America) known more than anybody else...

As for me, I don't think it's a exactly a "reputable" aikidoka. I would rather say that it's the most known one, which is a big difference... There is much more reputable and knowledgeable aikidoka in this world, but they are not the most known. Stop anybody on the street and ask if they know "Steven Seagal", you will have no problem finding someone knowing. Try the same thing with the name of a shihan, Tamura, Ueshiba, Yamada... Probaly none will know who they are... Popularity and reputation are two different things...

Last edited by Carl Simard : 03-24-2002 at 11:14 AM.
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Old 03-24-2002, 09:23 PM   #9
Irony
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There needs to be somewhat a seperation between Seagal's movie aikido and his true life aikido. I remember going to Exit Wounds and saying, "wait, that's not aikido!" But nowhere in the movie did he claim that his character was an aikidoka. Much like those who believe that since he played a brilliant mathematician in "A Beautiful Mind" Russell Crow must be some kind of math genius.

Steven Seagal doesn't make movies to be the "aikido rolemodel". No one criticizes other action stars from straying from their path in a film. Seperate character and person.

Chris Pasley
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Old 03-25-2002, 12:03 AM   #10
darin
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So would you also say an actor who happens to play roles as a serial killer, rapist, racist or child molester is bad too? Or how about actors who do roles that involve homosexual scenes? I think Seagal's roles have been rather tame, maybe due to his limited acting ability, compared to some other actors. He is more famous for his bad acting than anything else.
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Old 03-25-2002, 11:52 PM   #11
shadow
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Re: Steven Seagal a true Aikidoka?

Quote:
Originally posted by nikon

I have friends whose only knowledge of Aikido is Steven Seagal, and they think Aikido is a deadly violent art which is totally the opposite of what it is.
How is aikido in anyway not deadly? The good thing about it is it's up to the practitioner to decide wether it's going to be a devastating technique, or simply a gentle way of neutralising someone. If we didn't learn ukemi in aikido, in every class I'm sure there would be more than one person not leaving, or at the very least in the back of an ambulance.
Besides, who really takes movies like that at face value? The easily impressionable...who cares what they think. I happen to quite like seagal and I watch his movies in the way they are presented...FICTIONAL!

happiness. harmony. compassion.
--damien--
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Old 03-28-2002, 11:28 AM   #12
sleepyshark
Dojo: Loveland Aikido
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seagal

Who cares whether or not he's a "good" aikidoka, I'm glad that there's even aikido IN a movie!
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Old 03-28-2002, 02:10 PM   #13
Steve
Dojo: Salina Aikido Club
Location: Salina, Kansas, USA
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Quote:
Originally posted by ca
First, I would agree with those who have pointed out that, whether what they are seeking is really there, or not, many students first show up at an Aikido dojo because of Seagal Sensei's films. So he is doing, in a certain way, a service by spreading the word that Aikido exists.

SNIP

Granted, I've only seen a few Segal films but I had no idea at all that he was displaying aikido until an aikidoka told me. So how does the general public know that Segal practices aikido? It's not in his films some place, is it? Maybe it is. I don't know. Or are we just assuming that a lot of people new to aikido were inspired by Segal?

Steve Hoffman
+++++++++++
That's going to leave a mark.
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Old 03-28-2002, 02:24 PM   #14
Arianah
Dojo: Aikido of Norwalk
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Quote:
Originally posted by Steve
Granted, I've only seen a few Segal films but I had no idea at all that he was displaying aikido until an aikidoka told me. So how does the general public know that Segal practices aikido? It's not in his films some place, is it? Maybe it is. I don't know. Or are we just assuming that a lot of people new to aikido were inspired by Segal?
In Above the Law, there is a whole little introduction about Ueshiba Morihei and aikido (though I can't remember if he actually says "aikido") I just love how in the dojo scene at the beginning of that movie, every uke that gets thrown lets out a shouting groan of pain: "Uagh!" That had me laughing for quite some time.

Sarah

By the way, I never even saw a Seagal movie until after starting aikido, and then, only fast-forwarding to the fight scenes to see if I can recongnize anything.
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Old 03-28-2002, 02:28 PM   #15
bujin
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For me it really doesnīt matter whether he was awarded with the 4th or 7th dan. After all the most important is, what he is presenting on tatami. Have you ever seen Seagal doing irimi nage on uke, who was taller than 1,60m?

Itīs ridiculous. Besides all that I heard that he has stopped teaching aikido. He went to Berlin this year and I didnīt hear then of any seminar with S.Seagal sensei. So?
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Old 03-28-2002, 02:30 PM   #16
Arianah
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Oh, and I've also read on here (aikiweb) that the description on the back of one of his movies says, "Using his deadly aikido . . ."
(Hope that wasn't already said in this thread.)
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Old 03-28-2002, 02:57 PM   #17
guest1234
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Quote:
Originally posted by Steve


Granted, I've only seen a few Segal films but I had no idea at all that he was displaying aikido until an aikidoka told me. So how does the general public know that Segal practices aikido? It's not in his films some place, is it? Maybe it is. I don't know. Or are we just assuming that a lot of people new to aikido were inspired by Segal?
I don't know how they knew, perhaps through the few references already mentioned, or word of mouth. I had seen his films before I started, but didn't know he was doing Aikido... but I've heard more than one visitor (usually a younger male category) ask about Seagal Sensei and Aikido (as in 'this is what Seagal does, right?') so the word seems to be out there somewhere...

I don't understand the question on irimi nage, nor have I seen him doing Aikido (other than his movie stuff, which we all know is not like actually teaching). But if the question implies it is easier for him to do an impressive irimi nage due to his size, I wouldn't fault him for being big...those same big senseis (and I've had a few) have to do shiho nage, and sudori techniques, which are definately more difficult for big guys, so it all evens out in the end. In fact, irimi nage is about the only technique I can think of that give taller nages an easier time.
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Old 03-28-2002, 08:21 PM   #18
zoobie
Dojo: aikido of madison
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second doshu gave Seagal his 7th dan.
I thought his randori movement was fine in his aikido film "path beyond thought".

Last edited by zoobie : 03-31-2002 at 07:08 PM.

masakatsu agatsu


We do not rise to the level of our expectations, we fall to the level of our training
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Old 03-30-2002, 11:02 PM   #19
njnoexit
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They are movies, they are not real. They are used to entertain people, not to influence.

He is an actor, that is his job. What he acks as does not protray what he is. And once again movies are not real, unless it is a historical or bassed of a true story...

mostly what he acts in are action movies.... He is a bad actor and all he can do is aikido. and people like to watch action movies. Now aikido is pritty boring to watch in a movie if you do not know what it is. so he has no choice but to act the way his director tells him too.. if the director wants him to punch the guy in the face instead of throwing him on the ground he can not do anything about it... he is a working man trying to make a living... and that is no reason to judge him, or label him otherwize.

sorry if that sounded offensive it did not intend to be. That is not directed twards you it is directed to all the kids out there who think movies are real.
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Old 07-19-2005, 07:14 PM   #20
Sanshouaikikai
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Re: Steven Seagal a true Aikidoka?

About Seagal Sensei being a good Aikidoka or whatever this thread is about,lol...one of my senseis at my dojo studied under him when she was in Japan teaching at a college there or something like that. She had heard about his dojo because he was the only white guy teaching Japanese martial arts in Japan...so...I guess she went over to his Tenshin Dojo and studied under him. This was of course way before he became a jerk movie star. He's still sweet though! I love his early movies. My favorite is "Marked by Death". That movie has the best Aikido choreography I think...it was sweet!!!
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Old 07-19-2005, 08:19 PM   #21
aikigirl10
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Re: Steven Seagal a true Aikidoka?

Quote:
Leslie Lee wrote:
Why is Steven Seagal regarded as a reputable 'Aikidoka'?


DUH! Hes famous
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Old 07-19-2005, 11:20 PM   #22
Roy
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Re: Steven Seagal a true Aikidoka?

Seagal is awesome!!!!!!! Here is a link to see an mpeg of his, http://www.aikijujitsu.ca/. Just go under "Multymedia," and you will see Saka Sensei (Seagal) just click and enjoy. Afterwords you will understand why he is considered a true Aikidoka. Before his career as an actor, for years he owned a dojo in Japan.

Last edited by Roy : 07-19-2005 at 11:25 PM.
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Old 07-20-2005, 03:23 AM   #23
Aikilove
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Re: Steven Seagal a true Aikidoka?

Saka sensei? I believe he goes under "Take" Sensei when he teach.

Jakob Blomquist
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Old 07-20-2005, 09:02 AM   #24
dan guthrie
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Re: Steven Seagal a true Aikidoka?

Quote:
Roy Leclair wrote:
Seagal is awesome!!!!!!! Here is a link to see an mpeg of his, http://www.aikijujitsu.ca/. Just go under "Multymedia," and you will see Saka Sensei (Seagal) just click and enjoy. Afterwords you will understand why he is considered a true Aikidoka. Before his career as an actor, for years he owned a dojo in Japan.

It's nice to finally see him doing Aikido instead of whatever it is he's been doing in his movies.

At the end of the tape he threw a few ukes off the mat and he ended up off as well. Is that a big mistake?
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Old 07-20-2005, 12:08 PM   #25
Ron Tisdale
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Re: Steven Seagal a true Aikidoka?

Quote:
because he was the only white guy teaching Japanese martial arts in Japan...
That is NOT a true statement. There were and are more than one or two others as well.

Ron

Ron Tisdale
-----------------------
"The higher a monkey climbs, the more you see of his behind."
St. Bonaventure (ca. 1221-1274)
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