Mike Patterson and Chris Parkerson's Thread

Pardon me fellas... I know this is not my forum, first time I have ever been here and I am not looking to get into any sort of discussion about this subject. It was forwarded to me and I simply do not like people making obvious mistatements about my methods or by implication, that of Hsu Hong Chi.

So below I have made a few comments within the text of Mr. Parkerson as it relates to me/us. I have always been about efficiency of fighting more than anything else. Mr. Parkerson is trying to paint me in a way that does not equate with my perspectives.

Chris Parkerson wrote: Mike, You have said: Mike Patterson, Sr. (Hsu Hong Chi's Hsing-I) 1976-1978?? I began training under Mike Patterson Sr. somewhere around 1976 if I remember correctly. A buddy who had lived in Taiwan and trained with Hung I Shiang had taken me to him. A case of Corona in hand and a willing spirit, I was accepted into his garage-dojo.

This would be difficult, given that my father never taught in California. It was always me and always my school only. My father only visited from time to time. At most, all that any of my actual students could have done is drink tea with him and talk. I did indeed start teaching in my garage and this is pretty public knowledge by now in the San Diego area.

Chris Parkerson wrote: Mike Patterson used aggressive perineum puckering to literally drive (or suck) sexual energy, earth energy and heavenly energy through the microscopic orbit.

I think I read this in a book somewhere too. But we definitely DO NOT teach this. We don't practice any methods "aggressively", especially this.

Chris Parkerson wrote: It was a blending of hard and soft. We focused on Fa Ging as developed through Tien Kan (Heavenly Stem Linear Pa Kua) exercises, White Crane exercises, bouncing ourselves off a vertical post to feel the coordinations needed for fa Ging, and doing a strange form of Pi Chen by pulling a karate belt that was tied to a large spring and suspended in his garage's ceiling.

Some of this is true??? (hard to say by the terminology, as I speak only Mandarin) Some of it definitely is not!

Chris Parkerson wrote: We breath packing ( 2 directions) and mental imagery to guide our chi up and out the hands with each movement in our linear forml. We would pucker the perineum before and after each move.

The image conjured by this is making it difficult to type and I can't imagine what this would do to your movement. Solidification of what we call the lower lock is always present in motion, but I would hardly describe what we do in the manner used above.

Chris Parkerson wrote: Often, we would train our "Iron Vest" by striking our solar plexus while advancing in a Hsing-I stance while exhaling and doing the perineum pucker. We used mental imagery to attack the attacking fist with our torso.

I sometimes allowed students to strike me in the solar plexus to demonstrate that it could be done. I never had students do this to each other in any way. This sounds like something you saw in a movie or maybe Ron Sarkanowski's(sp?) group?

Chris Parkerson wrote: A real Tuff-guy training method.

This statement is an absolute truth.

Chris Parkerson wrote: I can still take a pretty good shot in the solar plexus. Of course, cleansing meditations followed these kind of practices.

Maybe you do this. But you did not do it while under me, if you were ever under me. And since I don't remember you, that would tend to mean that if you ever were, it was for a very very brief time.

Chris Parkerson wrote: I also did iron palm with him using a bathtub, a cinderblock and a wet towel. We used our internal breathing as meditation before, during and after the iron palm. We did our training at the same time of morning every day and used sexual abstinence to assist. I was told how to perform a Nei Gung that included hanging weights around my scrotum while performing my breathing exercises. I was warned not to do it longer than 4 months at a time and do it at the same time of day in the early mornings (4:00 am). The weights would swing as I breathed. Slippage was painful, but the internal pulling, stresses and stretching was certainly good Nei Gung and more aligned to the young testosterone-driven ways of youth. Of course, celibacy was mandatory. I was a fan of Patterson's Chi development style as late as 1986.

You would have had to have been with me a very long time to learn either of these things. I do not have a record of ever training you in either our method of iron palm or in Shi Swei. I will not discuss the actual methods one way or another in this forum. But much of what has been said by Chris could have been taken from overhearing conversations amongst my older students.

And just one more thing I wanted to address:

Robert John wrote: Mike Patterson's record is impressive, he definitely had some skills, but watching the vids, its pretty apparent he's missing some stuff. Fighting skill and body skills are separate. So it's possible to have a guy that has a full repetoire of qi/jin skills but can't fight worth crap Doesn't mean that there's nothing to learn.

Damn Robert John! You talk as if I was dead! "had some skills" indeed!

Not sure if the last part of that paragraph was directed at me or not. But I assure you I can do both. And those videos are nearly 20 years ago.. just imagine what 20 years of practice (and yes Mike, I am STILL obsessed with regular hours of practice each day). I'm just kidding, Mike. Couldn't resist... inside joke that... if he even remembers, so long ago. Don't even try baiting me Mike, I swore off you long ago!

Now, I am going to leave this forum. I only wanted to set the record straight as I truly do hate being dragged into things as "support" when I was not involved in the first place. Be well all of you. Wish I could have seen the videos in question... the thread may have been more interesting knowing the source material that started it all.

Mike Patterson wrote: And those videos are nearly 20 years ago.. just imagine what 20 years of practice (and yes Mike, I am STILL obsessed with regular hours of practice each day). I'm just kidding, Mike. Couldn't resist... inside joke that... if he even remembers, so long ago. Don't even try baiting me Mike, I swore off you long ago!

Hi Mike:

I probably should have forwarded that junk to you myself, but I just wasn't sure enough about some of the who or what that you *may* have gotten into over the years. So I think you did exactly the right thing to come up on AikiWeb after someone used your name for some BS. Good to see you again.

Best.

Mike Sigman

mike Patterson's father taught us (3-4 folks) in his garage at his home. Mike was about 19 years old.

This was score he obtained the racquet ball court.

mike Patterson's father taught us (3-4 folks) in his garage at his home. Mike was about 19 years old.

This was score he obtained the racquet ball court.

Chris Parkerson wrote: mike Patterson's father taught us (3-4 folks) in his garage at his home. Mike was about 19 years old. This was score he obtained the racquet ball court.

I'm afraid you have your "facts" mixed up.

Mike Sigman wrote: Hi Mike: I probably should have forwarded that junk to you myself, but I just wasn't sure enough about some of the who or what that you *may* have gotten into over the years. So I think you did exactly the right thing to come up on AikiWeb after someone used your name for some BS. Good to see you again. Best. Mike Sigman

Thanks Mike. It has been along time. Good to see you too.

mike

I am sorry you were offended if I misrepresented you or your teachings in any way. I spoke from memory from about 33 years ago.

I began training with you and your father when I was a green belt in Kenpp under Parker Linekin. After a few months of 2 times a week in your garage in La Mesa, the two of you came out to Ocean Beach to visit our Kenpo class.

By the end of the first year your father tested me on several forms and issued me a green belt. My second year, I came less often as life got in the way

I am sure you would remember me if you saw an old photo. Look at My Space under my martial arts pix. I have an old one there.

Chris Parkerson wrote: mike I am sorry you were offended if I misrepresented you or your teachings in any way. I spoke from memory from about 33 years ago. I began training with you and your father when I was a green belt in Kenpp under Parker Linekin. After a few months of 2 times a week in your garage in La Mesa, the two of you came out to Ocean Beach to visit our Kenpo class. By the end of the first year your father tested me on several forms and issued me a green belt. My second year, I came less often as life got in the way I am sure you would remember me if you saw an old photo. Look at My Space under my martial arts pix. I have an old one there.

Chris,

I have by now taught thousands of students. If you were around a brief time, I would not necessarily remember you.

But you speak of things in a manner that appears more to be a pieced together story from things heard third party rather than an account of actual memory. So I have severe doubts.

For example, my school was eventually located in La Mesa... but the garage phase took place in LAKESIDE!

You stated in your previous post that you and a few others were trained in said garage prior to the Raquetball business we owned in Chula Vista, but that is impossible. My father did not return to the U.S. until just before that business opened and there WAS NO TEACHING going on prior.

I personally did not arrive in California until I was in my early 20's... and again, for the record, I did ALL the teaching in the U.S. My father has never taught in this country, only abroad.

Now, you are entitled to your own perspectives, whatever they may be but kindly leave me, and my father, out of them. If you did study with me at one time, you did not pay attention while there.

You can keep stating that you were once associated with me if you desire. I can't stop you from doing that. But I can say you are incorrect... Incorrect about our teachings, incorrect about dates, times, incidents and details, etc. And I will just leave it at that.

Mike Patterson wrote: Damn Robert John! You talk as if I was dead! "had some skills" indeed! Be well all of you. Wish I could have seen the videos in question... the thread may have been more interesting knowing the source material that started it all.

Hi Mike P,

Just wanted to say, a) nothing but respect for you and your kuoshu team! Props, especially for some nice KOs you have posted on Youtube

and b) I was referring to some vids that you used to have up a long time ago on the Hsing-i site. ( I don't know if you still do). I got my own personal thoughts on the vids posted then, but then again everyone's got opinions (like armpits).

20 years is a long time though, hell even 3 years is a long time and produces significant change.

I run my mouth off, so don't worry too much about me

Mike, again, I am sorry you got drug into this thing. Someone is calling me a liar and it just ain't the case. But neither do I want to get bullied here.

The guy that introduced us was a Shorin Ryu Matsumora Orthodox student who spent time with Hung I Shiang in Taiwan. A second student who attended less frequently was a guy who had trained in Taiwan who was, I believe, a local policeman. The third student was your girlfriend. We trained in your garage. Your father was there and he issued me the test. Lakeside, next to La Mesa. Garage attached to the house. Enter the foyet and turn left.

In the second year, classes moved to the racquetball court. I eventually had to move to New Jersey.

I have had many teachers and indeed I was training with 3-4 during our time together. You guided me through iron palm. You told me about how Nei Gung was to be performed. I did it on my own- the follows of youth.

Later

Chris Parkerson wrote: Mike, again, I am sorry you got drug into this thing. Someone is calling me a liar and it just ain't the case. But neither do I want to get bullied here. The guy that introduced us was a Shorin Ryu Matsumora Orthodox student who spent time with Hung I Shiang in Taiwan. A second student who attended less frequently was a guy who had trained in Taiwan who was, I believe, a local policeman. The third student was your girlfriend. We trained in your garage. Your father was there and he issued me the test. Lakeside, next to La Mesa. Garage attached to the house. Enter the foyet and turn left. In the second year, classes moved to the racquetball court. I eventually had to move to New Jersey. I have had many teachers and indeed I was training with 3-4 during our time together. You guided me through iron palm. You told me about how Nei Gung was to be performed. I did it on my own- the follows of youth. Later

Absolutely amazing how a person can keep telling me about my own life and events within it, be completely wrong, yet continue to say that my life lived is incorrect and his version is true. The mind boggles.

Robert John wrote: Hi Mike P, Just wanted to say, a) nothing but respect for you and your kuoshu team! Props, especially for some nice KOs you have posted on Youtube and b) I was referring to some vids that you used to have up a long time ago on the Hsing-i site. ( I don't know if you still do). I got my own personal thoughts on the vids posted then, but then again everyone's got opinions (like armpits). 20 years is a long time though, hell even 3 years is a long time and produces significant change. I run my mouth off, so don't worry too much about me

Thanks for the comment about the Kuoshu clips, Robert. I was just sorry to find that I had only a bit of footage still surviving. There were some really great moments in other events that seem to have disappeared over the years.

And I just had to rib you a bit because of the "had" (past tense) in your original comment. It made me smile, and that is a precious thing, so thanks. And don't give it a second thought, I'm used to that by now.

the first year was a year of an el nino. So it was probably 1979.
You even gave me the Jow to train iron palm from your stock at your home.
if your father was not in charge, that was probably my misprrception. He was at most all classes and interacted. I interviewed with both of you. Your father took the case of beer as an intoductory gift. I have no idea if you drank it.

You told us a story about a confrontation at Bellmont Park when you introduced us to stomach strength. I remember the story well.

I drove a white Datsun pick up with a camper on it. I parked it twice a week at your home for a year, Tues. And Thurs. If I remember correctly. I introduced you to Parker Linekin. I am sorry you do not remember these things. I will now bow out of this conversation as I do not wish to pry open your privacy over an issue neither you nor I initiated.

Apologies for mispellings. An I-phone does not allow for scrolling reviews or spell check on this site.

Chris Parkerson wrote: the first year was a year of an el nino. So it was probably 1979. You even gave me the Jow to train iron palm from your stock at your home. if your father was not in charge, that was probably my misprrception. He was at most all classes and interacted. I interviewed with both of you. Your father took the case of beer as an intoductory gift. I have no idea if you drank it. You told us a story about a confrontation at Bellmont Park when you introduced us to stomach strength. I remember the story well. I drove a white Datsun pick up with a camper on it. I parked it twice a week at your home for a year, Tues. And Thurs. If I remember correctly. I introduced you to Parker Linekin. I am sorry you do not remember these things. I will now bow out of this conversation as I do not wish to pry open your privacy over an issue neither you nor I initiated. Apologies for mispellings. An I-phone does not allow for scrolling reviews or spell check on this site.

There is nothing I would like more than to "bow out" of this inane conversation, Mr. Parkerson. But you won't let me.

I was not in California in 1979.

I know of no story about Bellmont Park nor do I even know of a Bellmont Park.

I "introduced" MYSELF to Parker Linekin as I did many of the folks in San Diego county once I arrived there. I actually walked into his school late one night all by myself on my own two legs.. Imagine that?!

As for all else you say... again, it reads like someone piecing together stories told about me by others. The names, dates, facts, details, etc. are either all mixed up or completely false.

The rest of your statements I have already addressed. Now can we please get off this merry-go-round? Your perspectives about our methods are incorrect. If you were trained at one time by us, you do not remember what was taught. Let's just leave it at that.

Mr. Patterson,

Please pardon me for interjecting in this conversation. Chris, is an internet friend, who has shown me a bit of kindness. As such, out of a bit of loyality, I am coming to his defense.

First, I have seen your tapes. You are very good in your form and application. At least, that is my opinion. I make this opinion as someone who has studied for over 45 years.

Second, I'm sure Chris probably worked out at your studio once or twice. And I think, he is somewhat playing tribute to your abilities as a teacher. Certainly, over my past 45 years, in the martial arts I have also had many people who claim to know me or to have studied with me.

Unfortunately, I can't recount many of them. I think it is a matter of old age. At any rate, my belief, is that the adept's abilities speak for themselves. It really doesn't matter who attaches themselves to us. Our reputation is not tarnished.

Certainly, any of us who says we haven't exaggerated is bit, or "white-lied" is either a saint or an even bigger liar. Again, you skill speaks for itself, in physicality, intellect and spirituality.

I'm sure Chris wishes you the best and still admires "whatever" skills he came away with in his limited association with you.

Best wishes,
Joseph T. Oliva Arriola

Joseph Arriola wrote: Mr. Patterson, Please pardon me for interjecting in this conversation. Chris, is an internet friend, who has shown me a bit of kindness. As such, out of a bit of loyality, I am coming to his defense. First, I have seen your tapes. You are very good in your form and application. At least, that is my opinion. I make this opinion as someone who has studied for over 45 years. Second, I'm sure Chris probably worked out at your studio once or twice. And I think, he is somewhat playing tribute to your abilities as a teacher. Certainly, over my past 45 years, in the martial arts I have also had many people who claim to know me or to have studied with me. Unfortunately, I can't recount many of them. I think it is a matter of old age. At any rate, my belief, is that the adept's abilities speak for themselves. It really doesn't matter who attaches themselves to us. Our reputation is not tarnished. Certainly, any of us who says we haven't exaggerated is bit, or "white-lied" is either a saint or an even bigger liar. Again, you skill speaks for itself, in physicality, intellect and spirituality. I'm sure Chris wishes you the best and still admires "whatever" skills he came away with in his limited association with you. Best wishes, Joseph T. Oliva Arriola

Joseph,

I thank you for the kind words regarding my respective skills.

And I agree with you, and have already conceded, that there have been countless students under my tutelage in all these decades (I was teaching in San Diego for 25 years) and if Mr. Parkerson had left it at that, we would not be here now. But he did not. Instead, he chose to attach perspectives, methods and teaching parameters to me that are not my own. This is where the difference lies.

The study of, and teaching of, Internal Martial Arts is my chosen life path. I look at these arts from a very realistic perspective and this is what I am known for in the martial community. When a man decides to publicly proclaim something about my teaching methods that is completely askew, I have no choice but to address the statements made lest they be entered into public record as "this is what Mike Patterson teaches" and henceforth damage my reputation and credibility.

A long term student of mine read what was said about me, alerted me to this thread, and now here we are. Hopefully, we are now through.

Mike,

I agree. I look forward to seeing your posts, your opinions regarding IMA.

Best wishes,
Joseph T. Oliva Arriola

Mike Patterson,
I for one am certainly glad that you started posting here. As a result I am now aware of a reputable IMA teacher near me. I am in Barstow, Ca which isn't to far from Vegas.

Mike Patterson wrote: Joseph, I thank you for the kind words regarding my respective skills. And I agree with you, and have already conceded, that there have been countless students under my tutelage in all these decades (I was teaching in San Diego for 25 years) and if Mr. Parkerson had left it at that, we would not be here now. But he did not. Instead, he chose to attach perspectives, methods and teaching parameters to me that are not my own. This is where the difference lies. The study of, and teaching of, Internal Martial Arts is my chosen life path. I look at these arts from a very realistic perspective and this is what I am known for in the martial community. When a man decides to publicly proclaim something about my teaching methods that is completely askew, I have no choice but to address the statements made lest they be entered into public record as "this is what Mike Patterson teaches" and henceforth damage my reputation and credibility. A long term student of mine read what was said about me, alerted me to this thread, and now here we are. Hopefully, we are now through.

Hello Mr Patterson,

I certainly dont have a dog in this fight, but I am interested in the way you are handling yourself.

You seem to be taking this way too personal. Chris said that he trained with your father, not you. Yet, you seem determined to take Chris's statements about your father's training methods as yours.

I wonder if you even read what Chris wrote or if you saw that he mentioned the name Patterson and you had a knee-jerk reaction.

I would hate to see this as standard M.O. for Mike Patterson (didnt you try to discredit James McNeil also?) since I like your videos so much.

-Blake

Well, Blake, I don't have a dog in this fight either. But just for some perspective, please remember that Mike P. discounted his father leading ANY teaching in the US. Not only that, but the nature of what was relayed was not ACCURATE.

I don't think he is trying to discredit anyone...more like being very clear about some bad information, and who was or was not an "inside the door" student. Characterizing Mike's response as "knee jerk" etc. seems a bit unecessary to me.

Best,
Ron

Blake Holtzen wrote: Hello Mr Patterson, I certainly dont have a dog in this fight, but I am interested in the way you are handling yourself. You seem to be taking this way too personal. Chris said that he trained with your father, not you. Yet, you seem determined to take Chris's statements about your father's training methods as yours. I wonder if you even read what Chris wrote or if you saw that he mentioned the name Patterson and you had a knee-jerk reaction. I would hate to see this as standard M.O. for Mike Patterson (didnt you try to discredit James McNeil also?) since I like your videos so much. -Blake

Blake,

Mr. Tisdale is correct. For anyone to make a statement that they trained with my father in this country at any time would be incorrect. Moreover, he made statements about our teaching methods that are also incorrect.

As for my "M.O."... if I see statements made about myself, or my martial arts family, that are incorrect I do indeed try to set the record straight. I am a firm believer that reticence is tantamount to agreement.

I am sorry if I offend your sensibilities in trying to make sure that an error is not the only version of a story circulating.

Thank you for the comment about our videos. We do try to continue improving the content and presentation.