Do Aikidoka fight? Or manage conflict?

"Aikido's main contribution to the enrichment of individual lives lies not in the mechanics of techniques but rather in its ability to transform and elevate spirits beyond the plane of dualistic thinking. I genuinely believe that those seeking "the ultimate fighting system" are destined to forever pursue an illusion."

The above is an excerpt of an article by Stanley Pranin which was mentioned in another thread. I was very impressed by this statement and would like to hear the opinion of the forum members. A large part of the article is dedicated to competition in Aikido and thus not related to this thread. However, if you wish to read the whole thing: http://www.aikidojournal.com/article...?ArticleID=768

Hi Edward,

Originally posted by Edward "Aikido's main contribution to the enrichment of individual lives lies not in the mechanics of techniques but rather in its ability to transform and elevate spirits beyond the plane of dualistic thinking."

Whoah! Thats a bit high-brow for my tastes, I think. For the time being at least, I'd say aikido mainly enriches my life by getting me out of the house to enjoy training among friends. I'm really not looking to have my spirit elevated above the plane of dualistic thinking at the moment thanks. (In fact I have no idea what that even means.)

"I genuinely believe that those seeking "the ultimate fighting system" are destined to forever pursue an illusion."

On this part, though, I agree with Mr Pranin. Such people are destined to pursue an illusion, and stand a good chance of wasting a lot of time and money at some very dodgy dojos doing so. (You know, the kind of dojos that claim to offer "the ultimate fighting system")
I wouldn't say forever, though, its always possible for such people to come to their senses and look for some good solid budo instead.

The above is an excerpt of an article by Stanley Pranin which was mentioned in another thread. I was very impressed by this statement and would like to hear the opinion of the forum members.

Sean
x

Originally posted by deepsoup I'm really not looking to have my spirit elevated above the plane of dualistic thinking at the moment thanks. (In fact I have no idea what that even means.)

Hello Sean,

Well, thanks for pointing out the article in the first place

Actually, I don't understand it either but I think it must be a typo. It must surely mean duelistic or something like that, from the context.

Cheers,
Edward

Originally posted by Edward Actually, I don't understand it either but I think it must be a typo.

I dont think its a typo. I looked up the word 'dualistic' and it means 'consisting of two' or 'relating to dualism'. And my dictionary (Chambers 1994) defines 'dualism' as:

"that view which seeks to explain the world by the assumption of two radically independent and absolute elements, eg (1) the doctrine of the entire separation of spirit and matter <snip> and (2) the doctrine of two distinct principles of good and evil, or of two divine beings of these characters"

Maybe what he means by 'dualistic thinking' is seeing spirit and matter as two completely different things, or maybe he just means seeing the world in terms of pairs of opposites, like good/evil, winner/loser, us/them etc..

Then again, maybe 'dualistic thinking' in this context means regarding yourself as separate from the rest of the universe, and having your spirit elevated above that plane means a kind of zen enlightenment, where you see yourself at one with the universe. (The ultimate expression of 'keeping one point', perhaps?)

Still a bit highfalutin' for me though, I'm happy enough just trying to learn the techniques.

Regards
Sean
x

Originally posted by Edward Actually, I don't understand it either but I think it must be a typo. It must surely mean duelistic or something like that, from the context. Cheers, Edward

I don't think its a typo - He mean going beyond thinking
in terms of winner and loser, attacker and defender, good
and bad etc. , which is dualism (pairs of opposites). Isn't
this one of the often-touted points of aikido philosophy?

'Duelistic' is a nice pun, though.

Tim

Originally posted by Tim Griffiths I don't think its a typo - He mean going beyond thinking in terms of winner and loser, attacker and defender, good and bad etc. , which is dualism (pairs of opposites). Isn't this one of the often-touted points of aikido philosophy? 'Duelistic' is a nice pun, though. Tim

That's my opinion too. I didn't know that dualistic could have this meaning, that's why I came up with duelistic

Thanks,
Edward

hmmm.

Maybe it's to do with Batman.

Dynamic Duo-listic.

(Sorry, I've just read a lot of argumentative stuff on other threads)

But I did make a pun

Right, but the real question is ... what's an aikidoka? An aikidokist on steroids?

Hey Mark, how's it hanging? Punny joke.

Jim23

Hi there!
I don't really know what all of you were talking about, but I liked the qoute at the begining of the thread.
As I see it (and I'm not checking any typos ideas!), the sentence is very true for me.
I'm training for 2 years now, I'm not a tall girl not built too well etc. So I don't imagine myself to ever be the greatest fighter etc. I never started Aikido for that either. The techniques are great for the training, maybe after years of training I might be able to use them, if I ever needed to (hope not!), but Aikido has had it's influence on the way I think and behave.
And that's what I like about the qoute "...transform and elevate spirits...".
I know that since I started doing Aikido I have changed. I am much more relaxed, I tend to except people and ideas that are different from mine better than I did before.
And the one thing I think really changed is that I learned to settle arguements before they begun, or "fight" with speech, leaving the other person confused since they were building up for a high voiced arguement.
For example, I had a boss that felt he had to be "better" than me and make me aware of it all the time. He would never say he was wrong even if he was, nor apologize if he blamed someone else for his mistakes...
So whenever he would come to tell me I didn't do something right, that I didn't finish some project I would "blend in" and answer:
1. If I was really wrong, I'd agree, apologize and promise to make emmends immidiately. That used to leave him standing totaly confused after he had been building up how he would fight and argue with me from thinking I would not except his comments on my work.
2. If he was wrong since I didn't do something because he didn't give me all the information to work on or so, I would just "enter straight into his center" which means, I would just ask him back if he gave me the information, asked me at all to do the job etc. This would also leave him unbalanced because he was faced with the truth and would stuter to find an answer.
This is just big examples without all the concept of each case. It's not likle this always works, some people just can't feel good if they didn't run down someone else. But I've learned to deal with that too.
This is for me the other part that Aikido gives me. I'm able to stand on my own, express myself, in ways I never knew of before.
And I believe it happened because by training in Aikido, you train your mind and it learns to "flow" and "blend" also
There was this sentence that isn't exactly related to this, but I liked it:
"The tongue is the only edged weapon that grows keener (or sharpens) with constant use"
Anyway, that's my opinion.
Anat