Welcome to AikiWeb Aikido Information
AikiWeb: The Source for Aikido Information
AikiWeb's principal purpose is to serve the Internet community as a repository and dissemination point for aikido information.

Sections
home
aikido articles
columns

Discussions
forums
aikiblogs

Databases
dojo search
seminars
image gallery
supplies
links directory

Reviews
book reviews
video reviews
dvd reviews
equip. reviews

News
submit
archive

Miscellaneous
newsletter
rss feeds
polls
about

Follow us on



Home > AikiWeb Aikido Forums
Go Back   AikiWeb Aikido Forums > Language

Hello and thank you for visiting AikiWeb, the world's most active online Aikido community! This site is home to over 22,000 aikido practitioners from around the world and covers a wide range of aikido topics including techniques, philosophy, history, humor, beginner issues, the marketplace, and more.

If you wish to join in the discussions or use the other advanced features available, you will need to register first. Registration is absolutely free and takes only a few minutes to complete so sign up today!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 05-07-2006, 03:06 AM   #1
Hanna B
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 647
Sweden
Offline
Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

In texts about budo, is pretty commons to see all words of Japanese origin capitalised. Not only Aikido but also Budo, Uke, Shite, Tori. More seldom Ukemi though. Is this a less "reverred" word than Uke?

English is not my first language. Still, when asking people about it I have never heard anyone being able to point out where in the writing rules of English it says that budo words of Japanese origin should be capitalised. I see it done in my language also, and in both cases I just see it as... strange.

Why? How do people think when they do it?
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2006, 06:00 AM   #2
Amelia Smith
 
Amelia Smith's Avatar
Dojo: Martha's Vineyard Aikido Club
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 154
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

Hi Hanna,

I don't think it's correct to capitalize foreign words in English, if they would not be capitalized for some other reaon. Traditionally, non-English words would have been written in italics, i.e. ukemi, but as soon as the word becomes an accepted part of the English language, it should be written just like any other word. On the internet, people often use capitalization to stress a word, because it's easier than using italics or underlining, but technically that's not correct.

I should check back and see if I've fallen into the trap of Over-Capitalizing on these pages!

--Amelia
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2006, 12:36 PM   #3
Don_Modesto
Dojo: Messores Sensei (Largo, Fl.)
Location: Florida
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 1,267
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

Quote:
Amelia Smith wrote:
...Traditionally, non-English words would have been written in italics, i.e. ukemi, but as soon as the word becomes an accepted part of the English language, it should be written just like any other word. On the internet, people often use capitalization to stress a word, because it's easier than using italics or underlining, but technically that's not correct.
Succinctly, she takes the words right out of my mouth. I'd just give examples like dojo, sensei, karate, UKE (I'm too lazy for the "[i]" stuff, UKEMI, KOTE GAESHI, etc.

Don J. Modesto
St. Petersburg, Florida
------------------------
http://www.theaikidodojo.com/
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2006, 05:32 PM   #4
JAMJTX
Dojo: Aikibudo Seishinkan
Location: FORT WAYNE, IN
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 106
United_States
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

I had this discussion with an English Professor.
The first day in class he explained how he wanted to check the students grammar and punctuation and see where the class stood.
We could write about anything so I wrote abour martial arts, capitalizing Karate, Judo, etc. I had near perfect punctuation, and pretty good grammar. But the paper had big red circles around all of my capital letters.

I explained that capitalizing was correct because they are proper nouns and should be capitalized just as you would in writing the word Christianity. He changed my grade.

Jim Mc Coy
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2006, 06:46 PM   #5
Josh Reyer
 
Josh Reyer's Avatar
Location: Aichi-ken, Nagoya-shi
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 644
Japan
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

IMO, the closer analogue to aikido is "boxing", "wrestling", "fencing", and the like, rather than "Christianity". Although I tend to use a capitalized "Aikido" when talking about organized aikido, i.e., Aikikai Aikido, Yoshinkai Aikido, etc. "He's studied aikido for 12 years", vs. "There's a lot of politics in Aikido."

But, it's a personal distinction that I don't expect anyone to pick up and start using.

Josh Reyer

The lyf so short, the crafte so longe to lerne,
Th'assay so harde, so sharpe the conquerynge...
- Chaucer
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2006, 04:08 AM   #6
Hanna B
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 647
Sweden
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

Quote:
Jim McCoy wrote:
I explained that capitalizing was correct because they are proper nouns and should be capitalized just as you would in writing the word Christianity. He changed my grade.
They are not proper names... no more so than boxing, fencing or football. That he accepted your view on the matter since he did not know anything about it is poor support for your opinion.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2006, 04:58 AM   #7
Hanna B
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 647
Sweden
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

I think Jim McCoy's reasoning is probably a common one, though. Aikido and Budo should be capitalized because they are kind of "holy".
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2006, 06:21 AM   #8
Peter Goldsbury
 
Peter Goldsbury's Avatar
Dojo: Hiroshima Kokusai Dojo
Location: Hiroshima, Japan
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 2,308
Japan
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

Quote:
Joshua Reyer wrote:
IMO, the closer analogue to aikido is "boxing", "wrestling", "fencing", and the like, rather than "Christianity". Although I tend to use a capitalized "Aikido" when talking about organized aikido, i.e., Aikikai Aikido, Yoshinkai Aikido, etc. "He's studied aikido for 12 years", vs. "There's a lot of politics in Aikido."

But, it's a personal distinction that I don't expect anyone to pick up and start using.
I think a better analogy would be 'judo' or 'karate'. Are the first letters of these names capitalized? I think not. So why should aikido be different? It is not a 'proper' name.

Best wishes to all,

P A Goldsbury
_______________________
Kokusai Dojo,
Hiroshima,
Japan
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2006, 07:53 AM   #9
Hanna B
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 647
Sweden
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

Quote:
Peter A Goldsbury wrote:
I think a better analogy would be 'judo' or 'karate'. Are the first letters of these names capitalized? I think not.
You find plenty of examples of Karate, Iaido and Kendo on the net - it is exactly the same phenomenon. I have seen a couple of instances of Judo also, although quite possibly fewer than regarding karate and aikido since judo often is viewed as mere sport, like wrestling and boxning etc.

Last edited by Hanna B : 06-03-2006 at 07:57 AM. Reason: a forgotten word
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2006, 12:11 PM   #10
JAMJTX
Dojo: Aikibudo Seishinkan
Location: FORT WAYNE, IN
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 106
United_States
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

Quote:
Hanna Björk wrote:
I think Jim McCoy's reasoning is probably a common one, though. Aikido and Budo should be capitalized because they are kind of "holy".
Not so much Holy, but "a way of life". Although not religion, they are practiced and applied to life "religiously". Therefore, capitalization is proper. I should have expanded more in the first post.

Jim Mc Coy
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2006, 02:59 PM   #11
Don_Modesto
Dojo: Messores Sensei (Largo, Fl.)
Location: Florida
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 1,267
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

Quote:
Jim McCoy wrote:
Not so much Holy, but "a way of life". Although not religion, they are practiced and applied to life "religiously". Therefore, capitalization is proper. I should have expanded more in the first post.
Ya think?!

Let's see...religiously, church, shrine, temple, priest, sacrament...

Nope, no capitalization.

Don J. Modesto
St. Petersburg, Florida
------------------------
http://www.theaikidodojo.com/
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2006, 04:56 PM   #12
Hanna B
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 647
Sweden
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

Quote:
Don J. Modesto wrote:
Let's see...religiously, church, shrine, temple, priest, sacrament...
<devil's advocate>
Aiki jinja (the Aiki shrine), yearly ceremony with priests, o-senseis religios vision about creating a martial art for life and not for death... but more importantly, all this gibberish about aikido making you a better person
</devil's advocate>

IMHO JAMJTX's reasoning makes it understandable why many people choose to capitalize the word aikido. It will still not make it correct from the eyes of mainstream society, though.

(Geee! I started a thread on language usage, and it has gotten kind of popular! I am kind of a language usage nerd, although it does not show when I have to use my clumsy second language... and so I am very happy :-)

EDIT: Note that the Aiki shrine is capitalized above because it is the name of a building, not because I think aiki should be capitalized.

Last edited by Hanna B : 06-03-2006 at 04:58 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2006, 08:43 PM   #13
ESimmons
Location: Birmingham, AL
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 66
United_States
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

There's really no need to debate this. Look up judo, aikido, or karate in a dictionary and see if they are capitalized there; they are not.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2006, 09:00 PM   #14
JAMJTX
Dojo: Aikibudo Seishinkan
Location: FORT WAYNE, IN
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 106
United_States
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

In this case, the dictionary is wrong.

Jim Mc Coy
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2006, 09:08 PM   #15
ESimmons
Location: Birmingham, AL
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 66
United_States
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

Quote:
Jim McCoy wrote:
In this case, the dictionary is wrong.
American Heritage, Merriam-Webster, Cambridge, etc. are all mistaken, eh?
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2006, 09:21 PM   #16
JAMJTX
Dojo: Aikibudo Seishinkan
Location: FORT WAYNE, IN
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 106
United_States
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

Yes. And it's not just with this.
Especially over the last few years, the dictionaries have been adding ridiculous "words" in order to be politically correct.
For this reason, they can no longer be eaccepted as a final authority on anything.

In the case of Aikido, Judo, etc. they likely do not have the proper understanding of the arts to make the proper determination. It's not a case of them being mistaken, it's a combination of ignorance and elitism on thier part.

Jim Mc Coy
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2006, 10:18 PM   #17
JAMJTX
Dojo: Aikibudo Seishinkan
Location: FORT WAYNE, IN
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 106
United_States
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

From, Merriam-Webster Dictionary On-Line
Main Entry: im·pres·sion·ist
Pronunciation: im-'pre-sh(&-)nist
Function: noun
1 often capitalized : one (as a painter) who practices or adheres to the theories of impressionism
2 : an entertainer who does impressions

Main Entry: ai·ki·do
Pronunciation: "I-ki-'dO, I-'kE-(")dO
Function: noun
Etymology: Japanese aikidO, from ai- match, coordinate + ki breath, spirit + dO art, way
: a Japanese art of self-defense employing locks and holds and utilizing the principle of nonresistance to cause an opponent's own momentum to work against him

M-W seems to think it is ok to write
"I paint in the Impressionist style of art"
but not proper to write
"I train in the Aikido style of martial art".

Sorry, but I have to insist that they are wrong. And my English Professor agreed with me.

Jim Mc Coy
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2006, 10:58 PM   #18
ESimmons
Location: Birmingham, AL
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 66
United_States
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

Quote:
Jim McCoy wrote:
M-W seems to think it is ok to write
"I paint in the Impressionist style of art"
but not proper to write
"I train in the Aikido style of martial art".
M-W on impressionism:

"1 often capitalized : a theory or practice in painting especially among French painters of about 1870 of depicting the natural appearances of objects by means of dabs or strokes of primary unmixed colors in order to simulate actual reflected light"

When referring to the Impressionist movement, it is grammatically correct to capitalize the words impressionist, impressionism, etc. It is a naming convention. When using the word impressionist to describe something other than the Impressionist art movement, capitalizing it is incorrect.

With regards to the capitalization of martial arts, you are certainly entitled to dissent, but what precedent do you have for doing so? For starters, Wikipedia, NY Aikikai (USAF HQ), and IYAF don't seem to have a problem with not capitalizing aikido.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2006, 11:07 PM   #19
JAMJTX
Dojo: Aikibudo Seishinkan
Location: FORT WAYNE, IN
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 106
United_States
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

M-W says "often capitalized" not "never capitalized".
So the precedent for Aikido to be properly and acceptibly capitalized is there, not only with this word, but others - such as Christianity as used before.

Wikipedia should not be accepted as an authoritative source for anything since anyone with an internet connection can post anything they want.
As for the others, I think they are as wrong as M-W and the others for not capitalizing it.

Jim Mc Coy
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2006, 01:03 AM   #20
Peter Goldsbury
 
Peter Goldsbury's Avatar
Dojo: Hiroshima Kokusai Dojo
Location: Hiroshima, Japan
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 2,308
Japan
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

Quote:
Jim McCoy wrote:
Not so much Holy, but "a way of life". Although not religion, they are practiced and applied to life "religiously". Therefore, capitalization is proper. I should have expanded more in the first post.
Not in Japan. Of course, you cannot capitalize the word in Japanese.

Best wishes,

P A Goldsbury
_______________________
Kokusai Dojo,
Hiroshima,
Japan
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2006, 12:29 PM   #21
JAMJTX
Dojo: Aikibudo Seishinkan
Location: FORT WAYNE, IN
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 106
United_States
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

I sent an email to Merriam Webster asking them to correct thier error, or atleast add the same statement re: capitalizing.

I was not too surpised by thier response, which further supports my previous statement that a dictionary can not be accepted as an authoratative source.

The M-W representative said that they look at the common usage of the word to make these decisions and go with that. They said that the only sources they have found where words like Aikido and Judo are capitalized are martial arts journals. So rather than go with authoratative sources and be correct, they chose the more common usage.

Jim Mc Coy
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2006, 07:11 PM   #22
Mike Hamer
 
Mike Hamer's Avatar
Dojo: Shinki Rengo, Mt. Pleasant MI
Location: Alma, MI
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 244
United_States
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

Quote:
Hanna Björk wrote:
Why? How do people think when they do it?

Wow, as English being my first language.....only language, I never thought about that. In kindergarten I was tought to capitalize words that were important. Perhaps it is ingrained into the general soceity's mind that words that are asccociated with martial arts need to be capitalized, because it is common knowledge that alot of respect is involved with many martial arts, and would be in a way, subconsiously dissrespectful.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2006, 10:35 AM   #23
M. McPherson
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 39
United_States
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

The convention (I use this word deliberately) with the words in question is not to capitalize when used as common nouns. The Shorter OED, 5th edition, echoes the Merriam Webster dictionary, i.e., no capitalization for aikido, judo, karate, kendo, etc), so unless there's some kind of linguistic cabal taking place between publishers - and even between various English-speaking cultures - this is the rule to follow.
Yes, dictionaries are technically descriptive in nature, but their use as linguistic/semantic/orthographic reference materials gives them a proscriptive function, too. That's why it's helpful to own two or three; the reputable ones provide alternatives in spelling and pronunciation for entries, where applicable.
As far as "authoritative sources" in English, there certainly isn't any agreement. Not according to any of the books on my shelf, in any event (books by Amdur, Draeger, Lowry, Skoss - all aikido practitioners - as well as those of R.W. Smith, and Karl Friday do not capitalize it. Nor do the Kodansha translations of Ueshiba Morihei. John Stevens' books do, on the other hand. Those that I have of his are/were Weatherhill publications). Still, the overwhelming majority of authors do not capitalize the gendai arts in their writing.
Websites are the same. Few of the fora dedicated to aikido - Aikido Journal, this site - capitalize, although most of the aikido organization sites do. As a side note, many of them, including the Aikikai's English web pages, have forgotten to capitalize "budo." So much for that argument.
Part of the problem is that these words are, in many ways, neologisms that are still taking root, so who knows what the convention will become over time (and will it be the same in England as in the States? And what will the usage be in other cultures that write in roman script?).
Interestingly, many of the foremost writers of the budo have already given this matter some thought, and they came up with the Koryu Books Japanese Stylesheet, which can be requested here:
http://koryu.com/email.html
Most of the aforementioned writers with aikido experience contributed to it, as did Larry Bieri and Stan Pranin. It gives considerable weight to the argument against capitalizing.

Regards,
Murray McPherson

Last edited by M. McPherson : 06-25-2006 at 10:42 AM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2006, 05:43 PM   #24
graham
 
graham's Avatar
Dojo: Northampton Ki Aikido Club
Location: Northampton
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 134
United Kingdom
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

Quote:
Eric Simmons wrote:
There's really no need to debate this. Look up judo, aikido, or karate in a dictionary and see if they are capitalized there; they are not.
You don't describe how a word is used by discovering its definition.

IMHO, it's not really possible to give a straight answer to the question "Should the 'a' in aikido be capitalised?" It depends how the word if being used and - after all - what we mean by 'should'.

It's impossible to give an authoritative answer to a question like this because that's not how language functions. Just pick up an English (not American-English) Dictionary and note how many words can now be spelt with a 'z' when that would have been "wrong" 15 years ago.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2006, 09:28 AM   #25
Ron Tisdale
Dojo: Doshinkan dojo in Roxborough, Pa
Location: Phila. Pa
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 4,615
United_States
Offline
Re: Capital letters in Aikido, Budo, Uke etc

Well, I think this thread has convinced me to no longer capitalize. Actually, I've done it both ways at different times, and not always consistantly either.

Thanks for the opinions here, learned something.

Best,
Ron

Ron Tisdale
-----------------------
"The higher a monkey climbs, the more you see of his behind."
St. Bonaventure (ca. 1221-1274)
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Steven Seagal Interview ad_adrian General 45 01-15-2010 03:34 PM
Mixing Aikido with other martial arts Guilty Spark General 146 05-04-2008 10:10 AM
Women and Everybody Else in Aikido George S. Ledyard Teaching 113 03-16-2008 07:27 PM
For Ted Ehara - Boundary of your aikido? billybob General 123 12-18-2006 04:52 AM
Article: Aikido Now in Brunei AikiWeb System AikiWeb System 3 09-20-2005 06:22 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:11 PM.



vBulletin Copyright © 2000-2024 Jelsoft Enterprises Limited
----------
Copyright 1997-2024 AikiWeb and its Authors, All Rights Reserved.
----------
For questions and comments about this website:
Send E-mail
plainlaid-picaresque outchasing-protistan explicantia-altarage seaford-stellionate