It happens to the best of them

Greg Steckel wrote: Tohei used to hop and skip all the time..... Greg

Ah, very true. It's all to do with the hips ie: Hip-Hop..

Peace.G.

I once tripped on my hakama and went face first into the mat... while holding a sword. Life is nicer if you have Mr. Christian on your ignore list.

`Graham moving`

To be honest I thought Grahams hand flourishes were just like Osensei - ( O-sensei Harold Brosious )

Henry Ellis
Co-author `Positive Aikido`
http://aikido-bracknell.blogspot.com/

Stephen Nichol wrote: ... I tripped on a Hakama once... Yeah, I am pretty sure that does not mean I am 'doing it like Ueshiba' either though...

Look more closely ... someone is standing on the hak. Can't tell exactly but it looks like Mr. Chiba.

Richard Stevens wrote: Life is nicer if you have Mr. Christian on your ignore list.

+1

He's ruined this 'site for me.

Graham Jenkins wrote: Richard Stevens wrote: Life is nicer if you have Mr. Christian on your ignore list. +1 He's ruined this 'site for me.

No comment on individual people, but if you go to any budo site for the arts that rely on kata and forms you will find truly spaced out, bonkers, kind of people that are nothing more than entertainment. You see them in Taiji, Aikido, Karate, anywhere where they cannot be tested by people on those same forums who can offer real pressure. I have seen some that were so far gone that their videos are now famous and are frequently put up on the screen at budo parties. There is simply no end to them in arts that don't let you challenge them. Which is why you only find them in those arts. Have you ever seen them in large numbers in Judo or Bjj or MMA? Nope, they would get the S#$% kicked out of themselves for daring to use the name of those arts. Many of us just use these people to forward discussions as perfect examples of "What not to do" in real budo. As such they are productive on any forum to show all of the errors and things to avoid.

I'll leave you to discuss the who's who. I just wouldn't be worried about who habituates forums. The upside of having all types on the net is that we get to meet people with very real skills and information who will interface and share. This is leading to meet ups and real sharing. Trust me the odd balls of the internet, will NEVER...EVER, appear on a mat with those who everyone knows are the real deal. Thus they hound the forums since it is the only place they can really survive.

Think positively. Welcome them as discussion starters and entertainment. Really, no one of credibility takes any of them seriously, and the juniors who do...well, it's only a matter of time before they learn. Usually they just have to put their hands on someone with real Aikido or taiji skills and then they're on their way to good budo.

I love the IP/aiki discussion in that you just simply cannot B.S. your way out of it. Shihans and Shodans alike, fail on contact. It's over before it begins. And those getting educated in IP/aiki, are spotting the imposters as they simply walk across a room. An ever increasing number of Aikido teachers can disqualify Shihan pretenders just watching them move. And the rest of the Budo people sit there and wonder how you knew? I call it before I even touch hands, and it's over. So reading some of these peoples writings as they go on and on about what they think they know....is really amusing for many people reading.
So, cheer up. People are listening, meeting and training. They get it. George Ledyard once said,"This might be the best time to be alive in budo." Why? We are getting to meet with some interesting teachers who will ACTUALLY teach!!! And some of them are funny as hell.
And look...we're building bridges between the arts and making friends. Not bad considering their past.

Dan

Robert M Watson Jr wrote: Look more closely ... someone is standing on the hak. Can't tell exactly but it looks like Mr. Chiba.

I think so too.
It is kinda cool to see how together Ueshiba is, even during and after the fall!!
Dan

I came to this late.... out of town.

At first I was tempted to take the O-Sensei video at face value and assume that the Founder's knees were simply older than his perpetually youthful attitude about waza, i.e his knee gave out when he dropped and he tipped over. But after many viewings I can clearly see that I was wrong in this.

Clearly O-Sensei was executing a movement from the "drunken monkey" style of Aikido, not taught publicly. What appeared to be a knee collapsing was really a masterful use of the neutral pivot point or "jiku point" allowing the Founder to give the appearance of falling sideways (thereby avoiding any strike that would have been coming at his head from the rear).

The hand he put down that appeared to be supporting him as he pushed up was actually a manifestation of the vertical dimension as shown in the "aiki cross"... his ki clearly in balance out of the palm and the shoulder simultaneously. It served as an anchor to the Earth should he have chosen to project his legs up for a spinning kick.

The uninitiated might well believe that he was slightly unstable as he got up as evidenced by his back and forth motion as he got his hips underneath him again. But that would only show their low level of understanding as it is clear to anyone with deeper knowledge of internal power and the spiritual world of Shinto that the Founder was demonstrating the very advanced concept of the "floating boat on a rough sea" as described in the Kojiki. What appears to be somewhat unstable movement is in reality an extremely advanced technique for projecting a wave like energy outwards thereby making ones opponent unstable and is one of the secret techniques of Daito Ryu.

I am continually appalled at the low level of discussion on the forums by people who profess to know better. How Dan could have thought that this man, the greatest martial artist of all time had merely fallen down is a testament to the infinite subtlety of the Founder's aiki.

George S. Ledyard wrote: I came to this late.... out of town. At first I was tempted to take the O-Sensei video at face value and assume that the Founder's knees were simply older than his perpetually youthful attitude about waza, i.e his knee gave out when he dropped and he tipped over. But after many viewings I can clearly see that I was wrong in this. Clearly O-Sensei was executing a movement from the "drunken monkey" style of Aikido, not taught publicly. What appeared to be a knee collapsing was really a masterful use of the neutral pivot point or "jiku point" allowing the Founder to give the appearance of falling sideways (thereby avoiding any strike that would have been coming at his head from the rear). The hand he put down that appeared to be supporting him as he pushed up was actually a manifestation of the vertical dimension as shown in the "aiki cross"... his ki clearly in balance out of the palm and the shoulder simultaneously. It served as an anchor to the Earth should he have chosen to project his legs up for a spinning kick. The uninitiated might well believe that he was slightly unstable as he got up as evidenced by his back and forth motion as he got his hips underneath him again. But that would only show their low level of understanding as it is clear to anyone with deeper knowledge of internal power and the spiritual world of Shinto that the Founder was demonstrating the very advanced concept of the "floating boat on a rough sea" as described in the Kojiki. What appears to be somewhat unstable movement is in reality an extremely advanced technique for projecting a wave like energy outwards thereby making ones opponent unstable and is one of the secret techniques of Daito Ryu. I am continually appalled at the low level of discussion on the forums by people who profess to know better. How Dan could have thought that this man, the greatest martial artist of all time had merely fallen down is a testament to the infinite subtlety of the Founder's aiki.

+1

Best,

Chris

George S. Ledyard wrote: I came to this late.... out of town. At first I was tempted to take the O-Sensei video at face value and assume that the Founder's knees were simply older than his perpetually youthful attitude about waza, i.e his knee gave out when he dropped and he tipped over. But after many viewings I can clearly see that I was wrong in this. Clearly O-Sensei was executing a movement from the "drunken monkey" style of Aikido, not taught publicly. What appeared to be a knee collapsing was really a masterful use of the neutral pivot point or "jiku point" allowing the Founder to give the appearance of falling sideways (thereby avoiding any strike that would have been coming at his head from the rear). The hand he put down that appeared to be supporting him as he pushed up was actually a manifestation of the vertical dimension as shown in the "aiki cross"... his ki clearly in balance out of the palm and the shoulder simultaneously. It served as an anchor to the Earth should he have chosen to project his legs up for a spinning kick. The uninitiated might well believe that he was slightly unstable as he got up as evidenced by his back and forth motion as he got his hips underneath him again. But that would only show their low level of understanding as it is clear to anyone with deeper knowledge of internal power and the spiritual world of Shinto that the Founder was demonstrating the very advanced concept of the "floating boat on a rough sea" as described in the Kojiki. What appears to be somewhat unstable movement is in reality an extremely advanced technique for projecting a wave like energy outwards thereby making ones opponent unstable and is one of the secret techniques of Daito Ryu. I am continually appalled at the low level of discussion on the forums by people who profess to know better. How Dan could have thought that this man, the greatest martial artist of all time had merely fallen down is a testament to the infinite subtlety of the Founder's aiki.

Priceless. Thanks George!
Dan

Everyone makes mistakes, it is how you recover that counts. At a high skill level the mistakes are harder to see because nage transitions to something that works and everyone thinks that the technique was simply more sophisticated. The less idealized and more realistic the attack the greater the likelihood of your initial technique going south. My sensei often has us working off of the second and third strikes to allow for centered ukes (have to draw them out because experienced fighters are not going to give you their center easily). Getting off topic so I'll quit.

That having been said holey mackerel if you can fight in a hakama you can fight in anything (I have big feet, always getting caught).

Richard Stevens wrote: I once tripped on my hakama and went face first into the mat... while holding a sword. Life is nicer if you have Mr. Christian on your ignore list.

I once had to do an Iai technique (a vertically leaping technique with a change of feet) in front of everyone. I drew...leaped up...and was firmly planted to the earth with my back foot on my own Hakama. I was forth with -and rather promptly- planted on my own ass...with a sword in my hand!!
Cough....
It was a very looong time before everyone stopped laughing.
Dan

George S. Ledyard wrote: I came to this late.... out of town. At first I was tempted to take the O-Sensei video at face value and assume that the Founder's knees were simply older than his perpetually youthful attitude about waza, i.e his knee gave out when he dropped and he tipped over. But after many viewings I can clearly see that I was wrong in this. Clearly O-Sensei was executing a movement from the "drunken monkey" style of Aikido, not taught publicly. What appeared to be a knee collapsing was really a masterful use of the neutral pivot point or "jiku point" allowing the Founder to give the appearance of falling sideways (thereby avoiding any strike that would have been coming at his head from the rear). The hand he put down that appeared to be supporting him as he pushed up was actually a manifestation of the vertical dimension as shown in the "aiki cross"... his ki clearly in balance out of the palm and the shoulder simultaneously. It served as an anchor to the Earth should he have chosen to project his legs up for a spinning kick. The uninitiated might well believe that he was slightly unstable as he got up as evidenced by his back and forth motion as he got his hips underneath him again. But that would only show their low level of understanding as it is clear to anyone with deeper knowledge of internal power and the spiritual world of Shinto that the Founder was demonstrating the very advanced concept of the "floating boat on a rough sea" as described in the Kojiki. What appears to be somewhat unstable movement is in reality an extremely advanced technique for projecting a wave like energy outwards thereby making ones opponent unstable and is one of the secret techniques of Daito Ryu. I am continually appalled at the low level of discussion on the forums by people who profess to know better. How Dan could have thought that this man, the greatest martial artist of all time had merely fallen down is a testament to the infinite subtlety of the Founder's aiki.

That gave me a chuckle on a very wet Tuesday morning!

Robert M Watson Jr wrote: Look more closely ... someone is standing on the hak. Can't tell exactly but it looks like Mr. Chiba.

So, this begs the question: "Did he do it on purpose"

Greg

George S. Ledyard wrote: I came to this late.... out of town. At first I was tempted to take the O-Sensei video at face value and assume that the Founder's knees were simply older than his perpetually youthful attitude about waza, i.e his knee gave out when he dropped and he tipped over. But after many viewings I can clearly see that I was wrong in this. Clearly O-Sensei was executing a movement from the "drunken monkey" style of Aikido, not taught publicly. What appeared to be a knee collapsing was really a masterful use of the neutral pivot point or "jiku point" allowing the Founder to give the appearance of falling sideways (thereby avoiding any strike that would have been coming at his head from the rear). The hand he put down that appeared to be supporting him as he pushed up was actually a manifestation of the vertical dimension as shown in the "aiki cross"... his ki clearly in balance out of the palm and the shoulder simultaneously. It served as an anchor to the Earth should he have chosen to project his legs up for a spinning kick. The uninitiated might well believe that he was slightly unstable as he got up as evidenced by his back and forth motion as he got his hips underneath him again. But that would only show their low level of understanding as it is clear to anyone with deeper knowledge of internal power and the spiritual world of Shinto that the Founder was demonstrating the very advanced concept of the "floating boat on a rough sea" as described in the Kojiki. What appears to be somewhat unstable movement is in reality an extremely advanced technique for projecting a wave like energy outwards thereby making ones opponent unstable and is one of the secret techniques of Daito Ryu. I am continually appalled at the low level of discussion on the forums by people who profess to know better. How Dan could have thought that this man, the greatest martial artist of all time had merely fallen down is a testament to the infinite subtlety of the Founder's aiki.

Hold the fort! Everyone knows that super secret techique comes from drunken monkey style (Yang familiy - not that Chen garbage) - a style only known to exist on the eastern slopes of Wudan mountain deep in China. There is your chinese origin link right in plain sight! Even more notable is that in drunken monkey there are no hakamas so Ueshiba is once again seen to be a great innovator in combining ancient secret chinese arts with contemporary japanese fashion. We should all be glad he chose the hakama instead of fundoshi. I look great in fundoshi but I'm not so sure about the rest of youse guys. Drunken monkey in fundoshi is really quite wrong no matter what bridge spans heaven and earth. Plain wrong ... unless fundoshi is pink and tied 'gangsta' style then it is ok. Except on Tuesdays. I believe there is a doka on this matter - I'll have to check my notes.

Nvm, my serious question regarding ueshiba's raised rear heel at the end of technique had been overtaken by comedy

David McNamara wrote: Nvm, my serious question regarding ueshiba's raised rear heel at the end of technique had been overtaken by comedy

David, I can tell you that I know of one high ranking aikidoka, the late Kanai Sensei, who specifically taught this as proper stance.

Thank you Janet, I think most of my teachers would have pulled me up on that as an error so it was interesting to see. I can see it relates to a well planted front foot, possibly sending energy down into the ground, but he also does a little pop up at times.

Dan Harden wrote: No comment on individual people, but if you go to any budo site for the arts that rely on kata and forms you will find truly spaced out, bonkers, kind of people that are nothing more than entertainment. You see them in Taiji, Aikido, Karate, anywhere where they cannot be tested by people on those same forums who can offer real pressure...

Hey i resemble that accusation !!