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roadster
11-14-2007, 07:49 AM
What is the relationship between Chiba Sensei and the current structure of the USAF?

Call me dumb, I know. But in researching it for myself it appears that he was or still is affiliated with the USAF but branched off at some point to form Birankai in San Diego?

I ask because his dojo isn't listed as a USAF affiliated dojo. I get some what confused :hypno: when researching the different styles and affiliations here in America and the relationship here is not clear at all in my eyes.

Ron Tisdale
11-14-2007, 08:14 AM
I know that they were part of the USAF until recently, and have now gone off on their own. I believe the split was cordial, but am not a member of either group, so I don't really know.

I have had a great deal of fun training with some of his instructors though! Good bunch...

Best,
Ron

Chris Farnham
11-14-2007, 08:19 AM
My understanding is that Chiba Sensei and Biranakai no longer have any official connection to the USAF except mutual friendship. He does, however, still teach seminars at USAF dojos. I have been to two seminars taught by Chiba Sensei in the past 6 months that were hosted by USAF dojos, and I believe that he will be at the New England Aikikai spring seminar.

trailbuster530
11-14-2007, 10:48 AM
I am currently studying at Grassvalley Aikiki which is an affiliate of Birankai. I have not had the discussion as to the exact affiliations with the USAF. From the discussions regarding various seminars that there is not a feeling of us vs them attitude. The discussions are more of a oneness rather than being separate.

This is a good topic and I will have to strike up this conversation with Sensei when we have a free moment.

ramenboy
11-14-2007, 11:44 AM
hey erik

like everyone else mentioned above, the birankai became an independent organization from usaf last year, but both still maintain a close relationship.

say hi to christine sensei from us in chicago

trailbuster530
11-14-2007, 11:55 AM
Jarome,

Thanks for the response and I will make sure to say Hi from your group when I see Sensei again later this week.

roadster
11-14-2007, 05:19 PM
What are the suttle differences in style? There is obviously something since he split off.

And Ramenboy, were you talking to this Erik or the other Erik? My Sensei is named Christine as well.

ramenboy
11-14-2007, 08:06 PM
...were you talking to this Erik or the other Erik? My Sensei is named Christine as well.

hahaha either one!!!!!

although, i just recently saw your sensei chris wong at our yudansha seminar in april.

Janet Rosen
11-14-2007, 08:13 PM
I am currently studying at Grassvalley Aikiki which is an affiliate of Birankai

Oh! Is Cecilia Ramos still the instructor there? Please tell her Janet sends her fond regards (we roomed together at USAF-WR summer camp in 1997, and I learned cool stuff like taping shoulder separations from her).

roadster
11-14-2007, 09:51 PM
Well I asked my Sensei about it today. She is on the board of directors of USAF and explained the whole situation. :)

ramenboy
11-15-2007, 06:10 PM
Well I asked my Sensei about it today. She is on the board of directors of USAF and explained the whole situation. :)

cool! now you can explain it to us!!!

roadster
11-15-2007, 09:23 PM
It is a very long story. But the short version goes like this.

The USAF was at once broken up into three sections in the USA. The East, Mid West, and the West. When the three decided to merge into the East, then to just the USAF, there were a few who decided to just start their own associations. Chiba Sensei was one of them. He remains friendly to USAF. He still teaches at USAF seminars once in a great while but from what I understand, he didn't really teach many seminars int he first place.

David Yap
11-15-2007, 09:52 PM
It is a very long story. But the short version goes like this.

The USAF was at once broken up into three sections in the USA. The East, Mid West, and the West. When the three decided to merge into the East, then to just the USAF.

This probably relates to the International Aikido Federation (IAF) rule - one country, one representative. In the case of the US of A, the USAF is the sole official representative.

My 2sen.

Dvid Y

raul rodrigo
11-15-2007, 09:56 PM
This probably relates to the International Aikido Federation (IAF) rule - one country, one representative. In the case of the US of A, the USAF is the sole official representative.

My 2sen.

Dvid Y

The Hombu Dojo websites lists six US organizations that have Hombu recognition: Aikido Association of Northern California; Aikido Tenshinkai Federation; California Aikido Association; Makoto Aikido Kyokai; Takemusu Aikido Association; United States Aikido Federation.

SmilingNage
11-15-2007, 11:03 PM
"The Hombu Dojo websites lists six US organizations that have Hombu recognition: Aikido Association of Northern California; Aikido Tenshinkai Federation; California Aikido Association; Makoto Aikido Kyokai; Takemusu Aikido Association; United States Aikido Federation."

That doesnt have anything to do with with IAF. Each country can only have one representative organization in the IAF. The USAF is the current organization representing USA in the IAF. Our own Mr Goldsbury is the president of the IAF. He would be the one to go to about questions about the IAF.

As for Birankai, Chiba Sensei started his own international organization independent of Hombu and USAF. Where as all testing grades are given thru Birankai. But Birankai will assist members wishing to receive Hombu certifications as well.

Here is the link for that info http://www.birankai.org/BirankaiInternational.htm

As for the USAF a lot of growing pains and secessions in the past year. It will be interesting to see what becomes of it all.

http://www.aikidoeast.com/aikidoeast/2007/1/index.shtml

raul rodrigo
11-15-2007, 11:22 PM
[QUOTE=William Oakes;194129]"The Hombu Dojo websites lists six US organizations that have Hombu recognition: Aikido Association of Northern California; Aikido Tenshinkai Federation; California Aikido Association; Makoto Aikido Kyokai; Takemusu Aikido Association; United States Aikido Federation."

That doesnt have anything to do with with IAF. Each country can only have one representative organization in the IAF. The USAF is the current organization representing USA in the IAF. Our own Mr Goldsbury is the president of the IAF. He would be the one to go to about questions about the IAF.

My mistake.

best,

R

Chris Farnham
11-16-2007, 06:09 AM
I am not sure that the three truly merged. I don't think that too many dojos that were formally USAF-WR stayed in the USAF. Chiba Sensei's students tend to be very loyal to him. The East-West division in the old USAF had somewhat less to do with geography and more to do with which Shihan's lineage a particular dojo came from.

I was under the impression that the one representative per country rule had changed. I recall reading something written by Yamada Sensei, that stated that he had lobbied to change the rule for some time and that it was finally being changed. Of course I could be wrong on that point.

SmilingNage
11-16-2007, 07:18 AM
"Membership

Membership of the IAF is open to national organisations which have Recognition from the Aikikai Hombu.
There are currently some 53 organisations which have Recognition from the Hombu, but not all of these organisations can be members of the IAF.

At present the IAF has a rule that only one organisation from each country may be a member.
It is important to recognise that Recognition by the Aikikai Hombu is quite different from Membership of the IAF."

http://aikido-international.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=15&Itemid=35

Quote from the Mr Goldsbury's letter About the IAF march 1 2007.

"I was under the impression that the one representative per country rule had changed. I recall reading something written by Yamada Sensei, that stated that he had lobbied to change the rule for some time and that it was finally being changed. Of course I could be wrong on that point."

I am not sure if Yamada Sensei lobbied for this, but I am sure either it will be in the IAF minutes and/or Mr Goldsbury would know know more about that. I do recall Yamada Sensei pulling the USAF out of the IAF over the dispute of Yamada Sensei being the representative for 2 organizations in the IAF itself. One being the USAF, the other a South American organization.

And my bad Mr Goldsbury is the chairman of the IAF not the President

roadster
11-16-2007, 07:21 AM
I am not sure that the three truly merged. I don't think that too many dojos that were formally USAF-WR stayed in the USAF. Chiba Sensei's students tend to be very loyal to him. The East-West division in the old USAF had somewhat less to do with geography and more to do with which Shihan's lineage a particular dojo came from.



As I stated, there is much more to the story than what I wrote. I am a third party to knowledge here and a novice Aikidoka to boot so it's not my place to say anything more than I did. Those of you who know more about the history of the USAF know why.

When it comes to the spirit of Aikido, I think most of us would agree that the affiliation or style doesn't matter. Call me naive, but although lineage is important to me it wouldn't stop me from training if I didn't have access to an Aikido dojo that had a direct connection to the Hombu dojo.

Nick P.
11-16-2007, 07:37 AM
When it comes to the spirit of Aikido, I think most of us would agree that the affiliation or style doesn't matter. Call me naive, but although lineage is important to me it wouldn't stop me from training if I didn't have access to an Aikido dojo that had a direct connection to the Hombu dojo.

OK, if you insist: your naive. ;)

I agree completely, and am therefore equally naive.

trailbuster530
11-16-2007, 10:22 AM
Janet - Yes Sensei Ramos is still there. I jumped when I saw a reply to say Hi. Just trying to help others keep in contact when ever possible.

I will talk to her tonight and extend your warm hello to her.

Erik - I will also talk with Sensei Ramos regarding this if I get a chance as she is integrated into the Birankai Board in some fashion. Might help get a different perspective.

I am also going to side with you on being nieve but the overall feel to me has been very positive. I have visited a dojo in Walnut Creek while on a business trip and was welcomed with open and warm arms.

BC
11-16-2007, 01:50 PM
It is my understanding that the Birankai was formed prior to the USAF collapsing the three regions into one organization. In addition to having a large number of dojo in the USA affiliated with him, Chiba Sensei has a significant number of followers outside of the USA as a result of his travels and his previous position overseeing Aikikai dojo in the United Kingdom. I have also been told that relations between the USAF and Birankai remain amicable.

rachmass
11-19-2007, 01:41 PM
yes Robert, I believe that the Birankai was formed @ 2001- 2002 or there abouts. http://www.birankai.org/BirankaiInternational.htm

The organizations are very friendly to each other. I train at a Birankai dojo and belong to a USAF dojo and value both tremendously. Both are great organizations and the friendship that remains is a tribute to the heads of both groups.