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Old 03-01-2006, 01:31 AM   #1
vsm712
Dojo: Makati Aikido Club
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shinwakai

Hi,

What's the meaning of Shinwakai in English?

I would appreciate if you can provide me with KANJI character for Shinwakai as well. Thanks.
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Old 03-01-2006, 02:54 AM   #2
nekobaka
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Re: shinwakai

any context?

真和解?

true reconciliation?
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Old 03-02-2006, 08:41 PM   #3
vsm712
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Re: shinwakai

what do you mean?
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Old 03-02-2006, 08:44 PM   #4
vsm712
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shinwakai

Hi,

What's the meaning of Shinwakai in English?

I would appreciate if you can provide me with KANJI character for Shinwakai as well. Thanks.
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Old 03-02-2006, 09:16 PM   #5
Josh Reyer
 
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Re: shinwakai

He means we can't help you unless you give us more information. First of all, there's no "shinwakai" in the dictionary. It's undoubtedly a compound. So we need context: how was it used, where was it used, who was using it? Ani then offered a guess: shin - 真, true, and wakai 和解, reconciliation. We can't say for sure that that's what you're looking for, though, because you've given us no other information.

Josh Reyer

The lyf so short, the crafte so longe to lerne,
Th'assay so harde, so sharpe the conquerynge...
- Chaucer
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Old 03-03-2006, 01:00 AM   #6
Dirk Hanss
 
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Re: shinwakai

Hi Van,
do you think the answer in General would be different from those in Language?
What is the idea behind asking the same question twice?

Regards Dirk
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Old 03-03-2006, 01:04 AM   #7
batemanb
 
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Re: shinwakai

Hi Van,

I'm not a fluent Japanese speaker, which is why I didn't add anything to your post in the language thread. I don't think it's that easy to determine the English translation without knowing the kanji since it is the kanji that would determine this.

There are a number of kanji and meanings for Shin, the two that are frequently used in budo terms are kokoro (heart) 心 and makoto (true, honest, sincere) 真. As for wakai, I don't know the kanji, but the word can mean young, I don't know if there are any other translations although I suspect there are (I got four different kanji combinations on my IME when I tried it).

Sorry I couldn't be more help, maybe Peter Goldsbury or some of the other Japanese residents will be able to help further.

rgds
Bryan

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Old 03-03-2006, 01:38 PM   #8
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Re: shinwakai

Just discussing this a bit with my wife, who is native Japanese, ignore my last post completely . She thinks that it is more likely to be shinwa kai. Shinwa being like close family/ close friends, and kai being association/ organisation. Told you it was difficult to translate without the kanji , don't have the kanji to hand at present.

rgds

Bryan

Last edited by batemanb : 03-03-2006 at 01:42 PM.

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Old 03-03-2006, 03:50 PM   #9
siwilson
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Re: shinwakai

Why don't you contact the Shinkakai?

aikidoshinwakai@onetel.net.uk

Osu!
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Old 03-04-2006, 01:23 AM   #10
batemanb
 
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Re: shinwakai

My wife came back to me with more. Shinwa literally translated means friendship/ affinity, the kanji is 親和. Kai is association, the kanji is 会.

親和会

Of course, that is assuming that this is the kanji and translation that they took it from. Simon's advice is good, but, the shinwakai in the UK may not use the same translation or kanji as the shinwakai in any other country, they may not be related <shrugs shoulders>.

rgds
Bryan

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Old 03-09-2006, 12:12 AM   #11
vsm712
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Re: shinwakai

thanks all for your reply...appreciate all your inputs... to give you a bit of background, we're thinking of using this name for our aikido dojo/club as suggested by a certain japanese..you're right with all your translation as it depends entirely on the kanji character to be used... well we don't want the shin character related to Godly meaning but rather the heart...while we don't want the WA character to be peace as aikido itself signifies such meaning already...we are more looking into circle or core character..while kai would be the association..the thing is, if we put all these intended meaning in a more sensible meaning in english, what would be the best translation you can describe "shiw-wa-kai"?

again thanks for all you replies..
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Old 03-09-2006, 02:13 AM   #12
daverun
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Re: shinwakai

from what i understand of it... "Shin" can mean: heart, mind; core; truth, reality; fact; faith; fidelity; trust..... and "wa" can mean: circle; ring; wheel....... and "kai" can mean (as you know): meeting, assembly; association; society; times; cycle; oar, paddle; shellfish; shell..... i dont speak but a little Japanese myself, these translations are from a Japanese to English and English to Japanese book, so maybe in your case Shinwakai could mean "truth circle association" or "heart/mind ring society" or something of that nature

i hope this helped

dave




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Old 03-09-2006, 05:37 AM   #13
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Re: shinwakai

[quote=Van Mirandawhat would be the best translation you can describe "shiw-wa-kai"?.[/QUOTE]

Aren't you doing this @rse about face? Wouldn't it be better to say we are looking for a good Japanese name with kanji for our dojo. We'd like the name to be a translation or representation of.........


rgds
Bryan

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Old 03-09-2006, 09:46 AM   #14
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Re: shinwakai

Quote:
Van Miranda wrote:
thanks all for your reply...appreciate all your inputs... to give you a bit of background, we're thinking of using this name for our aikido dojo/club as suggested by a certain japanese..you're right with all your translation as it depends entirely on the kanji character to be used... well we don't want the shin character related to Godly meaning but rather the heart...while we don't want the WA character to be peace as aikido itself signifies such meaning already...we are more looking into circle or core character..while kai would be the association..the thing is, if we put all these intended meaning in a more sensible meaning in english, what would be the best translation you can describe "shiw-wa-kai"?

again thanks for all you replies..
That is exactly the kind of context that would have helped in the beginning.

心輪会 - Circle of Hearts Association.

Personally, it leaves me a bit cold. And under no linguistic argument could "aiki" or "aikido" signify "peace".

I like 真和会, myself. "True Peace Association". Fits in more with Ueshiba's vision of aikido bringing balance to the universe, a "truer" peace than simply a temporary cessation of hostilities.

Josh Reyer

The lyf so short, the crafte so longe to lerne,
Th'assay so harde, so sharpe the conquerynge...
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Old 03-13-2006, 07:25 PM   #15
vsm712
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Re: shinwakai

Quote:
Bryan Bateman wrote:
Aren't you doing this @rse about face? Wouldn't it be better to say we are looking for a good Japanese name with kanji for our dojo. We'd like the name to be a translation or representation of.........

we have that name chosen already by our japanese friend..thing is, he can't really provide us the best way to translate it in english...so i was hoping to get some inputs from you all...


rgds
Bryan
Personally, it leaves me a bit cold. And under no linguistic argument could "aiki" or "aikido" signify "peace". ---yes you're correct...but in general sense, the ai can be harmony or in other wordscan be at peace with the universe.

again, appreciate all your inputs...i guess now have better idea on the word itself...thanks.
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Old 03-14-2006, 01:23 AM   #16
batemanb
 
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Re: shinwakai

Hi Van,

The second paragraph in my quote above didn't come from me!!

rgds
Bryan

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Old 03-14-2006, 01:50 AM   #17
vsm712
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Re: shinwakai

yup...it's my reply actually..sorry for that..
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Old 03-14-2006, 08:54 AM   #18
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Re: shinwakai

Quote:
Van Miranda wrote:
but in general sense, the ai can be harmony or in other wordscan be at peace with the universe.
No, it can't. 合, ai, means meeting, matching, or joining. It is, in fact, used in several expressions that represent antagonism. For example: 言い合い, iiai, "an argument, a quarrel".

If you want harmony or peace, you have to go with 和, wa.

Josh Reyer

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Th'assay so harde, so sharpe the conquerynge...
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Old 03-14-2006, 09:07 AM   #19
aikispike
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Re: shinwakai

doesnt shinwaki mean new armpit?

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Old 03-16-2006, 08:28 PM   #20
vsm712
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Re: shinwakai

Quote:
Joshua Reyer wrote:
No, it can't. 合, ai, means meeting, matching, or joining. It is, in fact, used in several expressions that represent antagonism. For example: 言い合い, iiai, "an argument, a quarrel".

If you want harmony or peace, you have to go with 和, wa.

oh yeah...correct...wa for peace...so that's why we don't want to sound redundant if we get the peace context for the wa in "shinwakai"
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Old 03-17-2006, 10:07 PM   #21
aikispike
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Re: shinwakai

Quote:
Michael Kimeda wrote:
doesnt shinwaki mean new armpit?
whoops. that would have been shinwaki

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Old 03-18-2006, 04:14 AM   #22
siwilson
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Re: shinwakai

Quote:
Bryan Bateman wrote:
....the shinwakai in the UK may not use the same translation or kanji as the shinwakai in any other country, they may not be related <shrugs shoulders>.
Very true, and I like your wife's translation. I know the head of Shinwakai in the UK, but I probably will not see him until July (busy life), but we have mutual friends, so I can ask them to ask, as I am seeing them to ask.

The Shinwakai is an group in itself, with a number of affiliated associations. The Shinwakai teach both Yoshinkan and Aikikai "styles", and are affiliated to IYAF, although I must admit I have no idea if they have any other affiliation.

Osu!
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Old 03-18-2006, 04:21 AM   #23
siwilson
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Re: shinwakai

Quote:
Joshua Reyer wrote:
No, it can't. 合, ai, means meeting, matching, or joining. It is, in fact, used in several expressions that represent antagonism. For example: 言い合い, iiai, "an argument, a quarrel".

If you want harmony or peace, you have to go with 和, wa.
So are you saying "Shin-Wa" could be "Peaceful Heart?

Sounds good.

Osu!
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Old 03-18-2006, 07:45 AM   #24
Josh Reyer
 
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Re: shinwakai

Quote:
Si Wilson wrote:
So are you saying "Shin-Wa" could be "Peaceful Heart?

Sounds good.
If I wanted to say "peaceful heart/mind", I'd say "Heishin" 平心.

Japanese compounds (following Chinese grammar) put an adjectival element ahead of the substantive. So "shinwa" 心和 would not be "peaceful heart", but rather something to the effect of "Peace of the Heart".

Incidently, there is an Aikikai aikido dojo in Tokyo called Shinwakai 心和会. Here is their website (in Japanese).

Josh Reyer

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Th'assay so harde, so sharpe the conquerynge...
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Old 06-28-2006, 09:02 PM   #25
vsm712
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Re: shinwakai

Incidently, there is an Aikikai aikido dojo in Tokyo called Shinwakai 心和会. Here is their website (in Japanese).[/quote]

Yes that's exactly the KANJI of the shinwakai I'm referring to...so I would appreciate if you can provide me with the most appropriate English translation in terms of proper phrasing or context if we would be using it as a name for our dojo. appreciate inputs.. thanks.
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