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Old 03-07-2006, 01:38 PM   #51
bratzo_barrena
Dojo: Aikido Goshin Dojo
Location: Doral
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 97
United_States
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Re: What's in a belt?

Quote:
Nick Simpson wrote:
Shodans a relatively lowly rank isnt it? Beggining and all that?
Ok, If you ask me what I a shodan means for me, well means nothing. I don't believe in ranks/degrees/belts or whatever one wants to call it. though I respect any association/dojo that uses this systems and respect their grades. I just don't agree with that methodology.
Now Shodan is considered in most association (as far as I know) a 'begining level', which means having the basic knowledge of principle, movements, techiniques, and so on, so you can 'really' begin to learn. But a lot of shodans or higher ranks don't even have this basic knowledge to be shodan. But they passed the test anyway. That's a big problem.

Quote: "Shodans a relatively lowly rank";
If what you mean by this statement, is that it's ok that shodans don't have proper basic knowledge or should just be consider closer to a beginner, then what's the point of being a shodan if you are as good or bad as any other lower level?
If you're gonna use a ranking system then each rank must mean and reflect something, that's common sense. But saying that because shodans are low rank anyway, and use that affirmation to justify that one should not expect much from them, is sutpid.

What's the meaning of using a ranking system and then say ranks doesn't mean anything? That's nonesence.

If one consider ranks don't mean anything, then don't use the rank system. if one consider ranks means something, then each rank must show and reflect what they mean.

Just a thought

Bratzo Barrena
instructor
Aikido Goshin Dojo
Doral, FL
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Old 03-07-2006, 04:32 PM   #52
daverun
Dojo: Chudokai Yoshinkan - Retsushinkan Dojo
Location: Birmingham, AL
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 9
United_States
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Re: What's in a belt?

Quote:
Bratzo Barrena wrote:

If one consider ranks don't mean anything, then don't use the rank system. if one consider ranks means something, then each rank must show and reflect what they mean.
Very well put. In the Chudokai Yoshinkan style of Aikido, the style which I train under, at the Retsushinkan Dojo, we use a the color belt ranking system as follows:

8th kyu - white (this is the starting belt)
7th kyu - gold
6th kyu - orange
5th kyu - green
4th kyu - blue
3rd kyu - purple
2nd kyu - brown
1st kyu - red
Shodan and up - black with Hakama (only black belt wear Hakama)

Even in our organization this may change from dojo to dojo, but it stays basically the same. As for the meaning for the belts it is to let others know where you are in your training, not for you really, but that is not to say it does not give some encouragement and a sense of accomplishment. As for becoming shodan, all that means in our organization is that you know and understand the basics of the techniques and you are ready to start learning the more advanced aspects of the techniques and Aikido itself. Shodan, in my opinion, is a big steping stone on your life long journey down the path of enlightenment, but it is just one of many steping stones that make up that path.

Masakatsu Agatsu - True Victory is Victory Over Oneself

Dave
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Old 03-08-2006, 07:50 AM   #53
justinmaceachern
Dojo: St. george
Location: new Brunswick
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 98
Canary Islands
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Re: What's in a belt?

Your absolutly right Chris. You should just be there to train. Stop worrying about your rank or the rank of the guy next to you. I train in bjj and i told the sensei that i wasnt interested in moving up the ranks i just wanted to know a little bit about ground fighting in case i ever find my self in a situation where I need some of those skills. Plus it is an exellent workout.
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Old 03-08-2006, 07:55 AM   #54
justinmaceachern
Dojo: St. george
Location: new Brunswick
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 98
Canary Islands
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Re: What's in a belt?

Hi dave, In goshin Aikido we have
7th kyu white
6th kyu yellow
5th kyu orange
4th kyu green
3rd kyu blue
2nd kyu brown
1st kyu recomended
Shodan.
I think it is pretty interesting to see the sifference in ranking systems
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Old 03-08-2006, 01:16 PM   #55
daverun
Dojo: Chudokai Yoshinkan - Retsushinkan Dojo
Location: Birmingham, AL
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 9
United_States
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Re: What's in a belt?

Quote:
Justin MacEachern wrote:
I think it is pretty interesting to see the sifference in ranking systems
i agree it is very interesting, but like you said in your preveous post, it really doesn't matter, just as long as you train, the art (whatever art it may be, and i'm not just talking MAs, i.e. the art of writeing, or the art of math, ect.) the training is for yourself, not others; once again just as long as you train.

-dave




Masakatsu Agatsu - True Victory is Victory Over Oneself
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Old 03-08-2006, 01:23 PM   #56
Nick Simpson
Dojo: White Rose Aikido - Durham University
Location: Gateshead
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 916
United Kingdom
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Re: What's in a belt?

Im sure I've said it before, but your always gonna find people of certain grades that dont live upto/deserve that grade in your opinion. Tough. It's got nothing to do with you, if you dont like it, dont take it out on them, go tell their sensei that you think he was wrong in grading them when they are obviously incompetant...

I admit that it is frustrating/annoying/disheartening to see *insert whichever grade here* be not upto scratch but at the end of the day, the only thing that matters is that you are happy with what you are doing and who you are doing it with. God I've mellowed.

They're all screaming about the rock n roll, but I would say that it's getting old. - REFUSED.
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Old 03-08-2006, 01:33 PM   #57
Ron Tisdale
Dojo: Doshinkan dojo in Roxborough, Pa
Location: Phila. Pa
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 4,614
United_States
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Re: What's in a belt?

Hi Nick. Strongly agree. If you have a problem, talk directly to the person who gave the rank. In my opinion, the rank represents the relationship between student and teacher as much as all the other things.

Best,
Ron

Ron Tisdale
-----------------------
"The higher a monkey climbs, the more you see of his behind."
St. Bonaventure (ca. 1221-1274)
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Old 03-08-2006, 02:07 PM   #58
MaryKaye
Dojo: Seattle Ki Society
Location: Seattle
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 522
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Re: What's in a belt?

It's also worth noting that if an instructor gives someone a particular rank a bit too soon--and everyone makes mistakes--they can sigh and plan for a long gap before giving the next rank. In the long term, it won't have made much difference.

Mary Kaye
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Old 03-08-2006, 06:49 PM   #59
Nick Simpson
Dojo: White Rose Aikido - Durham University
Location: Gateshead
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 916
United Kingdom
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Re: What's in a belt?

Quote:
It's also worth noting that if an instructor gives someone a particular rank a bit too soon--and everyone makes mistakes--they can sigh and plan for a long gap before giving the next rank. In the long term, it won't have made much difference.
Word. Hi Ron, Im right again, surprise huh?

They're all screaming about the rock n roll, but I would say that it's getting old. - REFUSED.
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Old 03-08-2006, 07:00 PM   #60
giriasis
Location: Ft. Lauderdale, Florida
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 819
United_States
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Re: What's in a belt?

If you choose to make an issue that something really is nothing then maybe that nothing really is something.

Anne Marie Giri
Women in Aikido: a place where us gals can come together and chat about aikido.
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