Welcome to AikiWeb Aikido Information
AikiWeb: The Source for Aikido Information
AikiWeb's principal purpose is to serve the Internet community as a repository and dissemination point for aikido information.

Sections
home
aikido articles
columns

Discussions
forums
aikiblogs

Databases
dojo search
seminars
image gallery
supplies
links directory

Reviews
book reviews
video reviews
dvd reviews
equip. reviews

News
submit
archive

Miscellaneous
newsletter
rss feeds
polls
about

Follow us on



Home > AikiWeb Aikido Forums
Go Back   AikiWeb Aikido Forums > Language

Hello and thank you for visiting AikiWeb, the world's most active online Aikido community! This site is home to over 22,000 aikido practitioners from around the world and covers a wide range of aikido topics including techniques, philosophy, history, humor, beginner issues, the marketplace, and more.

If you wish to join in the discussions or use the other advanced features available, you will need to register first. Registration is absolutely free and takes only a few minutes to complete so sign up today!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 03-14-2005, 11:48 PM   #1
PeterR
 
PeterR's Avatar
Dojo: Shodokan Honbu (Osaka)
Location: Himeji, Japan
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 3,059
Japan
Offline
Shiodin vs Shidoin

I've gotten myself a little confused.

I used the term Shiodin in a particular situation but someone asked me if that is supposed to be Shidoin.

Now I've been wrong before and, although red faced, will happily admit to it but ....

I did a google search on both terms and they come up under identical circumstance.

So which is correct and why. What kanji are involved.

I'm inclined to think that I made a mistake.

Last edited by PeterR : 03-14-2005 at 11:50 PM.

Peter Rehse Shodokan Aikido
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2005, 11:53 PM   #2
Chris Li
 
Chris Li's Avatar
Dojo: Aikido Sangenkai
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 3,085
United_States
Offline
Re: Shiodin vs Shidoin

Quote:
Peter Rehse wrote:
I've gotten myself a little confused.

I used the term Shiodin in a particular situation but someone asked me if that is supposed to be Shidoin.

Now I've been wrong before and, although red faced, will happily admit to it but ....

I did a google search on both terms and they come up under identical circumstance.

So which is correct and why. What kanji are involved.

I'm inclined to think that I made a mistake.
"Shidoin", or "w"".

Best,

Chris

Last edited by Chris Li : 03-14-2005 at 11:58 PM.

  Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2005, 11:56 PM   #3
PeterR
 
PeterR's Avatar
Dojo: Shodokan Honbu (Osaka)
Location: Himeji, Japan
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 3,059
Japan
Offline
Re: Shiodin vs Shidoin

And what do the individual Kanji mean.

Peter Rehse Shodokan Aikido
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2005, 12:01 AM   #4
Chris Li
 
Chris Li's Avatar
Dojo: Aikido Sangenkai
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 3,085
United_States
Offline
Re: Shiodin vs Shidoin

Quote:
Peter Rehse wrote:
And what do the individual Kanji mean.
Well they look sort of garbled to me, but they should be:

"Shido": instruct (indicate, point to & guide, lead)
"in": member, person

In other words, an instructor.

Best,

Chris

  Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2005, 12:03 AM   #5
PeterR
 
PeterR's Avatar
Dojo: Shodokan Honbu (Osaka)
Location: Himeji, Japan
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 3,059
Japan
Offline
Re: Shiodin vs Shidoin

Thanks Chris - another example where I get so used to hearing a term that I don't listen.

Peter Rehse Shodokan Aikido
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2005, 02:49 AM   #6
Michael Holm
Dojo: Toitsu - Ki & Aikido Dojo,Glx.
Location: Copenhagen, Gladsaxe
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 26
Denmark
Offline
Re: Shiodin vs Shidoin

Quote:
Christopher Li wrote:
Well they look sort of garbled to me, but they should be:
Chris
If the Kanji does come out as "garbled" in your brower, the "Text encoding" must be changed. In the webbrowser Safari on a Mac, its done in the menu "View" - change it to "Japanese (Shift JIS)"

Then the Kanji is there beautifully
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2005, 02:59 AM   #7
estel
Dojo: Rockhampton Yuishinkai
Location: Qld
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 9
Australia
Offline
Re: Shiodin vs Shidoin

It can't possibly be Shiodin - since there is no "di" syllable in general use in Japanese (although a katakana equivalent may exist)
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2005, 03:16 AM   #8
PeterR
 
PeterR's Avatar
Dojo: Shodokan Honbu (Osaka)
Location: Himeji, Japan
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 3,059
Japan
Offline
Re: Shiodin vs Shidoin

To make things worse I realize that 2 of the 5 hits for Shiodin with google are due to my error. I think this is some sort of justice for starting the Shinan thread.

Peter Rehse Shodokan Aikido
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2005, 04:27 PM   #9
Don_Modesto
Dojo: Messores Sensei (Largo, Fl.)
Location: Florida
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 1,267
Offline
Re: Shiodin vs Shidoin

Quote:
Peter Rehse wrote:
To make things worse I realize that 2 of the 5 hits for Shiodin with google are due to my error. I think this is some sort of justice for starting the Shinan thread.
Isn't that the one where PAG came through with his usual erudite analysis? Then it's to your credit and not at all needing of punishment. Great thread, it was.

Don J. Modesto
St. Petersburg, Florida
------------------------
http://www.theaikidodojo.com/
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2005, 04:34 PM   #10
Rupert Atkinson
 
Rupert Atkinson's Avatar
Dojo: Wherever I am.
Location: South Korea, Yongin
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 802
United Kingdom
Offline
Re: Shiodin vs Shidoin

First of all, it is three characters, shi-dou-in, and the central one has longer pronunciation.

The first two together mean to instruct, and the last means something like, personnel. So, all three together just mean instructor/guide. Aikikai takes this term and uses it to mean - something less shihan (which in itself just means teacher, but in martial arts speak means senior teacher). In other organisations, shi-dou-in will likely mean something else in real terms. (As a side note, just to show the flexibility of these terms, in Korean martial arts shihan is equivallent to the standard sensei - in Korea every sensei is a shihan).

(shihan = sabeom in Korean - in fact, in Korea they even add the polite nim to sabeom (sabeom-nim), the equivallent of saying sensei-shi in Japanese.)

Last edited by Rupert Atkinson : 03-15-2005 at 04:39 PM.

  Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2005, 05:20 PM   #11
Chris Li
 
Chris Li's Avatar
Dojo: Aikido Sangenkai
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 3,085
United_States
Offline
Re: Shiodin vs Shidoin

Quote:
Michael Holm wrote:
If the Kanji does come out as "garbled" in your brower, the "Text encoding" must be changed. In the webbrowser Safari on a Mac, its done in the menu "View" - change it to "Japanese (Shift JIS)"

Then the Kanji is there beautifully
Unfortunately, changing the text encoding didn't work for me, either in Safari or in Firefox, although Japanese isn't normally a problem in either. Anyway, I know what they look like already .

Best,

Chris

  Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2005, 05:25 PM   #12
Chris Li
 
Chris Li's Avatar
Dojo: Aikido Sangenkai
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 3,085
United_States
Offline
Re: Shiodin vs Shidoin

Quote:
Rupert Atkinson wrote:
Aikikai takes this term and uses it to mean - something less shihan (which in itself just means teacher, but in martial arts speak means senior teacher).
Generally speaking, "shihan" generally refers to a fairly high level of teacher - in or out of martial arts. "Shidoin" is a specific level in the Aikikai (but just outside of Japan, normally), but in general refers to your basic generic instructor type. "Shido" by itself is often used as well in day-to-day affairs, as in "who's teaching tonight?".

Best,

Chris

  Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2005, 06:32 PM   #13
Charlie
 
Charlie's Avatar
Location: Elgin, IL
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 165
Offline
Re: Shiodin vs Shidoin

Yoshinkan Honbu Dojo Instructors (titles)
  1. Inoue Kancho
  2. Chida Dojo-cho
  3. Shioda Shihan
  4. Sanada Shihan
  5. Chino Shihan
  6. Oyamada Kyoshi
  7. Itoh Jokyo
  8. Sakano Jokyo
  9. Murata Jokyo
  10. Takashima Shidoin
  11. Noriki Shidoin
  12. Nakano Itaku Shidoin
  13. Friend Itaku Shidoin
  14. Murray Itaku Shidoin
  15. Woo Itaku Shidoin
  16. Ballares Itaku Shidoin

Charles Burmeister
Aikido Yoshinkan Yoseikai

"Calmness is trust in action"
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2005, 09:19 AM   #14
adriangan
 
adriangan's Avatar
Dojo: Jitsuyo Bugei
Location: Manila
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 61
Philippines
Offline
Re: Shiodin vs Shidoin

Quote:
Charles Burmeister wrote:
Yoshinkan Honbu Dojo Instructors (titles)
  1. Inoue Kancho
  2. Chida Dojo-cho
  3. Shioda Shihan
  4. Sanada Shihan
  5. Chino Shihan
  6. Oyamada Kyoshi
  7. Itoh Jokyo
  8. Sakano Jokyo
  9. Murata Jokyo
  10. Takashima Shidoin
  11. Noriki Shidoin
  12. Nakano Itaku Shidoin
  13. Friend Itaku Shidoin
  14. Murray Itaku Shidoin
  15. Woo Itaku Shidoin
  16. Ballares Itaku Shidoin
hi guys,

can someone tell me what Itaku means?

"Masakatsu Agatsu"
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2005, 12:15 AM   #15
eyrie
 
eyrie's Avatar
Location: Summerholm, Queensland
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,126
Australia
Offline
Re: Shiodin vs Shidoin

Depending on the school/style/system, shidoin usually refers to someone 3rd dan or above, but below shihan, which is 6th-7th dan.

Ignatius
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2005, 12:41 AM   #16
Chris Li
 
Chris Li's Avatar
Dojo: Aikido Sangenkai
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 3,085
United_States
Offline
Re: Shiodin vs Shidoin

Quote:
Adrian Gan wrote:
hi guys,

can someone tell me what Itaku means?
A part-time, or contract instructor (as opposed to the regularly employed teaching staff).

Best,

Chris

  Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2005, 12:41 AM   #17
estel
Dojo: Rockhampton Yuishinkai
Location: Qld
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 9
Australia
Offline
Re: Shiodin vs Shidoin

I not one of the teachers there has the title "kyoshi"
I thought kyoshi was the humble form of sensei, why would an instructor use that title, unless referring to themself?
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2005, 01:57 AM   #18
Chris Li
 
Chris Li's Avatar
Dojo: Aikido Sangenkai
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 3,085
United_States
Offline
Re: Shiodin vs Shidoin

Quote:
Chris Hudson wrote:
I not one of the teachers there has the title "kyoshi"
I thought kyoshi was the humble form of sensei, why would an instructor use that title, unless referring to themself?
"Kyoshi" is another form of the word "instructor". "Sensei" is a generic honorific used for just about anyone who teaches anything - from nursery school teachers to the teacher of your local pottery class.

Best,

Chris

  Reply With Quote

Please visit our sponsor:

Budo Bear Patterns - Sewing pattern for Women's (and Men's) dogi.



Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Shidoin & Fukushidoin cbiazak General 10 11-13-2007 03:43 AM
Irv Faust Shidoin to Potomac Aikikai, VA, 1/6-1/7 AikiWeb System AikiWeb System 2 01-10-2007 01:46 PM
"Shihan" again Don_Modesto General 13 05-26-2005 05:58 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:11 AM.



vBulletin Copyright © 2000-2014 Jelsoft Enterprises Limited
----------
Copyright 1997-2014 AikiWeb and its Authors, All Rights Reserved.
----------
For questions and comments about this website:
Send E-mail
plainlaid-picaresque outchasing-protistan explicantia-altarage seaford-stellionate