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Old 01-14-2005, 11:13 AM   #1
John Boswell
 
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Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

Over on another thread, we've established that the Klingon race of Star Trek fame have their own martial arts weapons, style and even got a book on the subject!

So I, in my infinite wisdom, have created a thread over here for the Star Wars fanatics out there with regard to THOSE martial arts and weapons!

The Klingon "Mok'bara" has been compared to Tai Chi as well as Koren ma's. Anyone have input on the origination of the Jedi arts?

Domo arigato... and may the force be with you!

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Old 01-14-2005, 11:52 AM   #2
Niamh Marie O'Leary-Liu
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

Clearly, the Jedi Order was heavily influenced by, if not based upon, the teachings of O-Sensei, both his techniques and philosophy.

I mean, just look at the uniforms, they are obviously modified aikido gi, humble garb made suitable for an intergalactic range of body types and in a practical dingy color, for those times when the nearest laundromat is light years away.

Jedi Masters spend considerable time in mokuso (meditation), contemplating the nature of the Force. A true shihan (Jedi Master) will be able to use the Force in a telekinetic way, from performing simple household tasks to levitating a ship, clearly derived from Ki energy and kokyu ryoku.

And there is the lightsaber kumitachi, as John pointed out. The only difference between Jedi weapons techniques and Aikido techniques is there can be no tachitori (sword taking) with the lightsaber, unless one either has substantial mastery of the Force or else does not mind losing a hand.

Speak softly and carry a big jo.
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Old 01-14-2005, 12:00 PM   #3
Niamh Marie O'Leary-Liu
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

PS- almost forgot. Throughout the eons, the real name of Obi-Wan Kenobi has been adulterated by time, foreign language, and misunderstanding. His real name was Obi-san Kendo Gi, as he was known by acquaintances in distant galaxies who had not yet heard about aikido.

Speak softly and carry a big jo.
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Old 01-14-2005, 12:28 PM   #4
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

Ah, but there IS tachitori! Through good extension of ki, the weapon can be stripped from the opponents hands or knocked away. These are truly higher level techniques, but were made obvious from Darth Tyrannus and Darth Vader's techniques.

Actually reaching in to make a grab for the weapon, that that would be foolhearty! Not saying it can't be done, but practice would be a b*tch!

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Old 01-14-2005, 12:38 PM   #5
MaryKaye
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

I've done the blindfold "trust your feelings, use the Force" exercise in Aikido, admittedly not with a weapon; it's darned cool.

Tried all the ushiro throws in my repetoire on someone who had both of my wrists from behind; none of them worked at all. Finally I leaned forward and ran my head into him; of course he had both of my wrists from in front....

Mary Kaye
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Old 01-14-2005, 12:40 PM   #6
Paul Melsness
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

Let's not forget the term Aikido itself:

Ai: Harmoney, or to become one with ...
Ki: Energy; Spirit; Force
Do: Way

Thus: Aikido is the "Way of becoming one with the force"
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Old 01-14-2005, 12:46 PM   #7
John Boswell
 
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

AH HA! Well done, Paul! Two jedi cookie treats for you!

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Old 01-14-2005, 12:49 PM   #8
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

Quote:
Niamh Marie O'Leary-Liu wrote:
Clearly, the Jedi Order was heavily influenced by, if not based upon, the teachings of O-Sensei, both his techniques and philosophy.
I don't know about this. After seeing Yoda bounce around in "Send in the Clones", I'd have to say the Jedi style is a MMA that includes but not limited to, some of O'Sensei's teachings, Wu Shu, Tai Chi, Shaolin and some buddhism thrown in for good measure. That or "Medaclorians" are really just a space age blend of meth and angle-dust.

Carl Bilodeau
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"Yield to temptation it may not pass your way again." - Robert Heinlein
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Old 01-14-2005, 01:30 PM   #9
Kevin Masters
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

heh, funny. I didn't think you guys would actually start up this thread.

Ok, where does the "send Kevin some money so he can train for free" thread start?


Hello?
*listening to sounds of crickets...*
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Old 01-14-2005, 01:42 PM   #10
John Boswell
 
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

*cricket cricket*

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Old 01-14-2005, 01:43 PM   #11
John Boswell
 
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

Medaclorians: Could these be the physical manifestation of the Kami that influenced O'Sensei's training and teaching?

Umm.... or should I be looking for lightning to strike me at any moment for mentioning this on the Humor Forum?

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Old 01-14-2005, 02:31 PM   #12
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

It is my understanding that some of the authors of Star Wars novels have at times interviewed Aikidoka and studied Aikiken for the purpose of making the swordsmanship in their texts more authentic. Furthermore Yoda is clearly an allusion to Osensei, which I believe is largely the fault of Old Joe Campbell's influence. Now that Lucas has changed the Jedi into a fascist order, I fear that Aikido and the Jedi are no longer related. Joe told me that anyone can follow the hero path, now I find out that my Midichlorian count is not high enough.
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Old 01-14-2005, 04:34 PM   #13
kironin
 
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

Quote:
Benjamin Edelen wrote:
It is my understanding that some of the authors of Star Wars novels have at times interviewed Aikidoka and studied Aikiken for the purpose of making the swordsmanship in their texts more authentic. Furthermore Yoda is clearly an allusion to Osensei,

Actually Yoda is supposed to have been modeled on Masao Shoji Sensei who was the Ki Society Chief instructor in the L.A. area at the time (70's and 80's, S. Cal. actually). George Lucas did know of him. Yoda looks a lot like Shoji Sensei. He was a tiny Hawaiian guy with droopy earlobes that could pin your head with his thumb (he pinned mine and I still haven't figured that one out). Shoji Sensei was the only non-policeman in the first group of students in the first class Tohei Sensei had in Hawaii in 1953. Unfortunately, he passed away last year.


However, the Lightsaber kumitachi lineage in the movies is clearly connected back to Grandmaster Errol Flynn !

http://www.errolflynn.net/Filmography/cb.htm
http://www.errolflynn.net/Filmography/rh.htm

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Old 01-14-2005, 04:35 PM   #14
Demetrio Cereijo
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

Hi,

Some time ago, i found the "Jedi Budo" webpage, with things like:

"Jedi Budo is more than a system of techniques to control the Force (ki, chi, qi). It is a mystical journey of Light, a means to integrate body, heart, mind and soul in one focused release in keeping with the Four Quadrants (Physical, Mental, Emotional and Spiritual Realms). Because of this, it brings with it the wisdom of the ages, and a means to address conflict forthrightly while setting the feet squarely upon a path to Inner Wholeness and Resolution, Light, and Illumination.

Although Jedi Budo covers a broad curriculum including some of the best and most effective techniques found within many of the best martial arts - Kenpo, Kung Fu, Ju Jitsu, Judo, Aikido, Karate, Tae Kwon Do, T'ai Chi Ch'uan - it also includes within it the disciplines encompassing mental clarity, emotional solidity, and spiritual awareness. Three of these disciplines can be found in Jediism. Jedi Budo integrates the fourth discipline - the physical quadrant - in a full marriage with the other three quadrants for a more complete course in the journey towards wholeness and balance, addressing the physical needs of the students, and eventual integration with the Inner Jedi and therefore one's highest most optimum path of service to the Light."
http://www.jedibudo.com/about.html


I posted it in another MA related forum, to general enjoyment, but today the page isn't available.

Howhever, the website where the "Jedi Budo" page was located still exists, so if you are interested in the Jedi Religion, go here

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Old 01-14-2005, 04:49 PM   #15
kironin
 
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

Quote:
Demetrio Cereijo wrote:
Although Jedi Budo covers a broad curriculum including some of the best and most effective techniques found within many of the best martial arts - Kenpo, Kung Fu, Ju Jitsu, Judo, Aikido, Karate, Tae Kwon Do, T'ai Chi Ch'uan - it also includes within it the disciplines encompassing mental clarity, emotional solidity, and spiritual awareness.

I heard a rumor that the Soke Council (tm) is planning to bring a lawsuit against the Jedi for illegal infringment of their proprietary methods and marketing.

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Old 01-14-2005, 05:37 PM   #16
Demetrio Cereijo
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Smile Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

More Jedi fun:
Sokaku Takeda
Vs.
O Sensei

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Old 01-14-2005, 06:06 PM   #17
ryujin
 
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Talking Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

Quote:
Demetrio Cereijo wrote:
However, the website where the "Jedi Budo" page was located still exists, so if you are interested in the Jedi Religion, go here
Man, after looking at that site, I can see why some would go over to the dark side.

Carl Bilodeau
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"Yield to temptation it may not pass your way again." - Robert Heinlein
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Old 01-14-2005, 06:57 PM   #18
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

Quote:
Craig Hocker wrote:
Actually Yoda is supposed to have been modeled on Masao Shoji Sensei who was the Ki Society Chief instructor in the L.A. area at the time (70's and 80's, S. Cal. actually).
According to one source, Yoda was modeled on Tsenzhab Serkong Rinpoche, tutor to the Dalai Lama.





You make the call.
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Old 01-14-2005, 10:40 PM   #19
Jerry Miller
 
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

I had always heard that Yoda's eyes were base on Albert Einsteins. There is substance to this if you do a web search.

Jerry Miller
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Old 01-14-2005, 11:36 PM   #20
justinc
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

So let me express my inner geekness:

In the Jedi books, as well as the D20 RPG, they do go through a listing of the various lightsabre "forms". Forms here is a term for styles. There's 7 styles described, imaginatively enough, Form I through Form VII. From the basic writeups, they seem to correspond a lot to the different sword fighting styles - everything from simple hack and slash to grace, spinning, water-like movements. There are also several different unarmed martial arts styles, most of them are non-jedi. Tera Kasi is the most well known one as these people where known to be the only ones to be able to go one-on-one with a Jedi and have a fairly decent chance of winning (ie killing). The other well known style is Enchai, which is the style taught to the Emporer's guards (the scary guys in red cloaks and hoods). These people were all darkside force users, so somewhat jedi related.

Ok. I've shown my true colours. Time to run away and hide again :P
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Old 01-15-2005, 05:58 AM   #21
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

Quote:
Mike Gallo wrote:
According to one source, Yoda was modeled on Tsenzhab Serkong Rinpoche, tutor to the Dalai Lama.

You make the call.
"was a massive man..." not quite.

it's a little vague on the details about Westerners seeing him in North India.

Shoji sensei was in L.A.

probably the truth is there was no one single source.

however if it comes to sources I know vs. a website reference,
the sources I know wins.

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Old 01-15-2005, 07:22 AM   #22
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

hmm... which one to pick for kumitachi practice ...
http://www.buystarwarsstuff.com/lightsabers.shtml

Jedi vs. the Bride
http://svr01.thump.net/640408/images/killbill/steel.jpg


I am in a Bubble of Light.

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Old 01-15-2005, 03:51 PM   #23
Lan Powers
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

Our Sensei actually trained for a time with Shoji Sensei and has made the image comparison to us many times.... He was very respectfull of him as well, just thought it was funny that there was such a likeness to Yoda.
It is a blast to see this come up without all the negative stuff that humor often brings in..(people get so offended, so easily)
Joyfull training, all
Lan

Play nice, practice hard, but remember, this is a MARTIAL art!
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Old 01-17-2005, 10:55 AM   #24
John Boswell
 
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

Quote:
Joyfull training, all
Lan
What the hell do you mean by THAT??? I'm OFFENDED!!

Just kidding, Lan!

BY THE WAY... does anyone have a picture, or link to a picture, of Shoji Sensei? All this talk of him, his look and his ability... have gotten me curious. What is even more curious is the fact that he is so highly regarded, but in my googling... I could find little to nothing on him.

I'd be very greatful for any articles or pictures or both with regard to Sensei Shoji.

Thanks,

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Old 01-17-2005, 11:43 AM   #25
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Re: Lightsaber Kumitachi thread

Has anyone else seen the book "The Shimmering Sword" in the stores? It's supposed to be a book on lightsaber technique (assuming they actually existed)...I just can't bring myself to buy it

Bronson

"A pacifist is not really a pacifist if he is unable to make a choice between violence and non-violence. A true pacifist is able to kill or maim in the blink of an eye, but at the moment of impending destruction of the enemy he chooses non-violence."
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