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Old 10-11-2004, 10:35 AM   #1
akiy
 
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"Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

http://www.news8austin.com/content/h...121527&SecID=2

-- Jun

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Old 10-11-2004, 11:21 AM   #2
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

Thanks!

I have visited there a few times when in Austin so it's interesting to
see them on the local TV.

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Old 10-11-2004, 04:35 PM   #3
shihonage
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

Quote:
Students train with a partner, playing off each other and practicing moves slowly.
Quote:
"A lot of people think martial artists go around looking for fights. Really, our highest ideal is to never get in conflict to begin with," aikido teacher Leslie Libby said.
Quote:
Most training is almost like a dance, where one person leads and the other follows.
Quote:
Aikido is the kind of martial art that's equivalent to yoga.
Oi

Also, they have a video on that page. It hurts.

I think that in MOST cases, Aikido should NOT be taught by a woman.
Sure, there are the women on "Holding up Half the Sky" DVD, who actually operate in realtime with real technique, but they appear to be the exceptions.

Aikido's cooperative approach lends itself all too well to be distilled into uselessness by a teacher who has no idea of what real aggression is like.
This especially applies to women teachers.
All too many of them just don't "get" it to the needed degree, and there's no competitive element in the art to ground them back to reality, like say, Judo would do.

Look at the mune tsuki in that video, mein gott, that is horrible.
This is the kind of dojos that give Aikido the reputation that it currently has.

If I was this "Leslie Libby" I would certainly try to show Aikido in a better light.
Show slow practice and old sedated people delivering mune tsuki which does not hurt a fly, but
at least also show energetic young people doing realtime jiyu-waza and multiple attacker drills.

You know, BOTH sides.
Not just the theoretic pseudo-pacifist side which will get your ass kicked by the geriatric old man doing tai chi in the park.

Last edited by shihonage : 10-11-2004 at 04:49 PM.
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Old 10-11-2004, 05:42 PM   #4
aikidoc
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

"I think that in MOST cases, Aikido should NOT be taught by a woman." Wow Aleksey, are you in the dark ages or what? O'Sensei had female students early on in the art and to my knowledge did not discriminate against women. You are going to get a serious a** chewing on this one and rightly deserved.

Now, I may not agree that aikido is like yoga but to make such a sexist statement is unbelieveable. Whatever trashing you get on this one is deserved.
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Old 10-11-2004, 05:56 PM   #5
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

How old are you Aleksey ?

The first comment you quoted was made by the anchorman and the forth comment was made by the reporter in voice over on the film. The third by a student who just sounds like he is attempting to describe the idea of nage-uke. The second is just like the mantra of self-defense experts.

it's a small ASU group on the south side of Austin that holds classes in a Yoga studio. Who knows how they edited. When I have been a guest there to that school, the class practice has been quite vigorous.
Leslie Libby throws quite hard and I considerably outmatch her in size. I doubt she would have much trouble laying you on your butt pretty quickly.

What I see on the video seems like pretty standard ASU practice.
I am willng to bet that the new girl that Leslie Libby is working very slowly with showing shihonage is the reporter giving the voice over.

Craig

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Old 10-12-2004, 12:26 AM   #6
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

Quote:
John Riggs wrote:
"I think that in MOST cases, Aikido should NOT be taught by a woman." Wow Aleksey, are you in the dark ages or what? O'Sensei had female students early on in the art and to my knowledge did not discriminate against women. You are going to get a serious a** chewing on this one and rightly deserved.

Now, I may not agree that aikido is like yoga but to make such a sexist statement is unbelieveable. Whatever trashing you get on this one is deserved.
Get off your righteous horse, will ya.

It is not my goal to discriminate or insult women.
I simply stated my observation, which this video only confirmed.

When I see a female Aikido student, there's less of a chance that they are actually training with attacks which are grounded in reality.
I've seen quite a few that DO, but I've also seen a whole freaking lot that don't.

The art itself does not push them to understand the timing of realtime attacks, and they have less of a chance than men to have prior LIFE experience with violence which would awaken them to the illusory nature of their training.

When such a person "graduates" to being an instructor, they continue propagating the method with which they train upon their students.

Look at that shomen, look at those mune tsuki in that video.
Those are not attacks.
They would not upset a toddler if they landed.
There's no intent, the students are not getting used to real-time timing, leading their skillset to be uncalibrated for the real world.

Quote:
Leslie Libby throws quite hard and I considerably outmatch her in size. I doubt she would have much trouble laying you on your butt pretty quickly.
I would be only glad to find out that she can work with actual _attacks_ and not lazy fly-swatting shown in the video.
But if she can, why isn't it shown ?!
It's not a beginner's class, most of those people are shodans and above.

I'm not asking to start throwing hooks and jabs, but how about just plain Aikido stylized attacks, being actually executed with some intent ?

Isn't it a responsibility of an Aikido teacher to propagate an honest, balanced image of Aikido ? Yin and yang ?
That video report made it look like "self improvement dancing yoga workshop".

Quote:
The first comment you quoted was made by the anchorman and the forth comment was made by the reporter in voice over on the film.
And those comments were born out of their observation of what they were shown as "Aikido".
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Old 10-12-2004, 12:59 AM   #7
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

there is both a woman and a man teaching classes there so whatever problems you think there are based on that TV spot, jumping to the conclusion that the cause is soley due to a female teacher doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Quote:
Leslie Libby Sensei began her aikido career at Montana State University in Bozeman, Montana in 1982 training under Greg Olson Sensei.  After two years of training, Libby Sensei moved to Japan to study aikido at the Hombu dojo in Tokyo, Japan.  Originally intending to stay for six months, Libby Sensei remained in Japan training daily for 5 years.  

Quote:
Jay Lindholm Sensei began his martial arts training in 1981. Following two years of training in a street fighting system "Kajukenbo", he then spent eight years training in Tae Kwon Do.  Jay Lindholm, Sensei taught at his own Tae Kwon Do school in Dallas, for two years prior to moving to Austin, Texas in 1989.  

Lindholm Sensei started his aikido career in 1989 which has continued through today encompassing 14 years of consistent aikido practice.  Lindholm Sensei regularly attends training seminars with both Ikeda Sensei and Saotome Sensei to bring ideas and training methods back to the dojo.  His motto is "just start wherever you are and get better from there."

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Old 10-12-2004, 01:04 AM   #8
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

from dojo website...

Quote:
Hill Country Aikido on Television - Friday, October 8th 2004

That's right, we were fortunate to have Amy Hadley from News 8 Austin do a segment on our dojo.  The segment is called "Fit for Friday" and airs each week throughout the day on Fridays on local cable channel 8.  

The filming took place on Monday at noon and again on Friday from 6 to 8 am when we aired several live segments on aikido from our dojo.  Amy and Brandy (her intern from my old alma mater Texas State) came and allowed us to show them a little about aikido and why we love it so much.  It was amazing to think the once "little dojo" could get 12 people on the mat at 6 am to practice.  

It was a lot of fun practicing with the newscast and all of our aikido buddies who were courageous enough to venture out into the darkness to join us.  Amy and Brandy were pretty adventurous as well attempting break falls at their first lesson.  We will post a video stream of the training and interviews from this segment in the near future.  Check back soon to see us in action.

Special thanks to every one at News 8 for considering us for this segment and doing such a wonderful job of spotlighting aikido.  Thank you Chadwick for setting up this opportunity and Hats off to all our members for supporting this event in the early hours, which turned out to be a blast!!

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Old 10-12-2004, 01:11 AM   #9
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

Quote:
Jay Lindholm Sensei began his martial arts training in 1981. Following two years of training in a street fighting system "Kajukenbo", he then spent eight years training in Tae Kwon Do. Jay Lindholm, Sensei taught at his own Tae Kwon Do school in Dallas, for two years prior to moving to Austin, Texas in 1989.

Lindholm Sensei started his aikido career in 1989 which has continued through today encompassing 14 years of consistent aikido practice. Lindholm Sensei regularly attends training seminars with both Ikeda Sensei and Saotome Sensei to bring ideas and training methods back to the dojo. His motto is "just start wherever you are and get better from there."
It would be interesting to see what the news footage would've been like if on that day it was Jay Lindholm and the students that attend his classes.
Hopefully a little more energetic.
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Old 10-12-2004, 01:50 AM   #10
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

What makes you think he wasn't one of the black belts in the background that you were criticizing ?

I doubt they have that sort of cliquish behavior there.

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Old 10-12-2004, 06:45 AM   #11
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

Quote:
Aleksey Sundeyev wrote:
...But if she can, why isn't it shown ?!
It's not a beginner's class, most of those people are shodans and above...
Just an aikido newbie here, but I will put in my $ .02. I think you have to look at what the purpose of the newscast was. A segment called "fit for friday", seems to me like a weekly piece designed to get couch potatoes to try new things for fitness. If you show people going at it like a bat outta hell, taking huge breakfalls and being hurled across the mat. The people you are trying to reach are going to think, "I can't do that; aikido must not be for ordinary people." That is the misconception I had about aikido until 5 yrs of BJJ practice made me think, heck how bad could it be? I'll give it a try.

FWIW
Bill
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Old 10-12-2004, 09:15 AM   #12
aikidoc
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

I agree with Bill-how do you know what the newscast was trying to show. Do you think a little blood would have made you feel better? To make such a sexist statement based on a clip about which you know little other than what you see. Generally, teaching the art and teaching self defense require a different set of circumstances. To teach "realistic" attacks and I assume you mean "realistic" responses one would have to assume someone is going to get hurt or will have to wear a lot of padding to prevent injury-not realistic.

Your "not politically correct" statement about women in general is disrespectful and of little value in discussing the street worthiness of a video-which may have been put together for totally different reasons. Not everyone takes aikido, or other martial arts for learning to kick someone's a**. If that is their purpose there are combat arts designed to creat maximum damage as fast as possible.

I don't know Sensei Libby personally, I had the opportunity to take a single class from her once about 1995 while visiting Austin and found her aikido to be like that of any other aikikai affiliated dojo I have ever trained in or visited.

This is not about being on a high horse. I feel your comments are out of context with the situation-a lot like the politics of today-distorted based on your personal belief system. You could have made your point effectively without making such remarks.
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Old 10-12-2004, 09:30 AM   #13
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

By the way Jun...

Thanks for posting the link! Despite the detour this thread took, it is always a good thing for aikido get get air time on the news!

Domo!

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Old 10-12-2004, 10:13 AM   #14
GaiaM
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

I am not insulted easily, but I am disappointed that an aikido student would make such a blatent disciminatory comment about senseis and students of my gender. I have heard several very experienced aikidoists say the opposite in fact, that women often learn aikido more easily because we are less prone to use force and more likely to move from center and not give in to anger or agression.
Several other ideas in response to your insensitive comment:
1. There are really hard core female aikidoists out there that throw hard and, in addition, have GREAT technique. My sensei took ukemi for a fabulous nidan test by a female (he is a yondan and has some of the best ukemi in the USAF). He said that it was some of the hardest ukemi he had ever taken because her movements were so solid and strong.
2. Not everyone takes aikido with the goal of being proficent in real-life self defence. I personally like to train fast and push myself, but this is not for everyone and one of the best things about aikido is that many people of many ages and persuasions can practice it with success for their own personal goals. I also would like that video to show some more action, but is it so bad for people to see another side of the art? Like someone said, perhaps it will encourage viewers to give aikido a try, and improve their lives and add to the community...
Please see sides other than your own. Choose the dojo you like but don't critisize others and don't make such blatent assumptions about the female gender.
Gaia

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Old 10-12-2004, 11:14 AM   #15
Kevin Masters
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

If you're talking about the Nidan I think you're talking about, she's one of my sempai.

I can vouch for the fact that she's quite able and willing to toss all 195 pounds of me around like a freaking car-wreck.
Owie.

And don't even bring any of the weak attacks to her, she'll just punish you more for it.
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Old 10-12-2004, 11:20 AM   #16
Karen Wolek
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

I'm just going to ditto Kevin here. She is one of my favorite training partners and has no qualms about tossing me (or any of the guys) around like a ragdoll.

While the Aikido at my dojo does not resemble the Aikido in that news clip, I agree that since the aim is to get people off the couch....they might not have wanted to scare anyone. I dunno, sometimes I think my sensei LIKES to scare people..... <grin>

Karen
"Try not. Do...or do not. There is no try." - Master Yoda
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Old 10-12-2004, 11:46 AM   #17
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

I think they just slowed down for the filming really, or it was nerves, cameras can really screw up your concentration.
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Old 10-12-2004, 12:16 PM   #18
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

Alexsey was making a point, that the technique in the video wasn't the best, but the means in which he said it was off the mark to say the least.

If you go look at Libby Sensei's bio, everyone can see she trained in Hombu, under the then second Doshu among many others... for five YEARS.

Now, knowing that, if he wants to stand by his comment on the technique demonstrated, I wouldn't fault him for that. But I do believe he owes Libby Sensei and ALL women of aikido an apology.

Gender should have never entered into his equation, imho.

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Old 10-12-2004, 01:16 PM   #19
shihonage
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

Ok, let's establish two things here.
a) Before making a kneejerk reply, please actually do read what was previously said.
When you raise points that have already been addressed in a post you're replying to, you're only wasting time.

b) See a). This is not a "women are less capable than, or somehow inferior to, men" statement.
Saying something like that would be absurd.

Now, to the individual replies:

John:

Quote:
Do you think a little blood would have made you feel better? To make such a sexist statement based on a clip about which you know little other than what you see. Generally, teaching the art and teaching self defense require a different set of circumstances. To teach "realistic" attacks and I assume you mean "realistic" responses one would have to assume someone is going to get hurt or will have to wear a lot of padding to prevent injury-not realistic.
See point a).
This was addressed in my previous post.
All I ask for is honest practice of stylized Aikido attacks, not the movie "Bloodsport".

Quote:
Your "not politically correct" statement about women in general is disrespectful
I did not make a statement about women in general.
Once again, see a).
Given my observations about women in Aikido, I simply try and find the most logical explanation that makes sense.

If you take a random sample of women students from Judo or Boxing, I am CONFIDENT that their skill levels will be no different from men.
Thats because in arts with competition, they can't pat someone on the shoulder and ask them to attack slower or to be "more flowing".
Its very simple there - what you do works, or what you do doesn't.

Aikido allows a lot of leeway. If a person chooses to continuously ignore proper training methods, they can.
Is it not true that on average, women go through less fights and scuffles than guys, as they grow up?
I'm not talking about mental bullying, which can be even more devastating than that between guys, but of pure physical attacks.

Given their less exposure to physical attacks, when they go into Aikido, they have a tendency not to have an imprint of what a proper attack is. The art itself does not make them find out, and so they continue like this, on autopilot.

Gaia:

Quote:
I am not insulted easily, but I am disappointed that an aikido student would make such a blatent disciminatory comment about senseis and students of my gender. I have heard several very experienced aikidoists say the opposite in fact, that women often learn aikido more easily because we are less prone to use force and more likely to move from center and not give in to anger or agression.
Yes, and I think that women instructors on "Holding up Half the Sky" DVD show exemplary technique. I also encountered several women who's technique feels like getting my arm caught in heavy machinery.
I only wish there was more of them.

Quote:
Several other ideas in response to your insensitive comment
Yes, truth hurts.
Do you think I don't wish I was wrong ?

Quote:
Not everyone takes aikido with the goal of being proficent in real-life self defence. I personally like to train fast and push myself, but this is not for everyone and one of the best things about aikido is that many people of many ages and persuasions can practice it with success for their own personal goals.

See a).
Even with honest attacks, Aikido, interpreted literally, is a far cry from actual self-defense training.
That is not the point.

Whether you want to defend yourself or not, is irrelevant.
You train in Aikido to forge your spirit, yes ?
In order for your spirit to grow, you must be aligned with Truth, not Lies.
Truth, as in, honest attacks that give your partner honest feedback, and make them develop TRUE technique.

There's a certain balance where you develop communication with your partner.
This does not mean that you always resist, but it means a balanced behavior where you give ukemi that is appropriate at your partners level without downright lying to them with your body feedback during the _entire_ practice.

Yes, this may involve your partner not "feeling nice" sometimes.
I hope it doesn't come as a surprise that self-improvement, spiritual development requires actual work.

Quote:
I also would like that video to show some more action, but is it so bad for people to see another side of the art?
See a). I already mentioned the balance, showing BOTH sides, not just one.
Unfortunately the slow meditative dance side is the one that prevails in public view.
Thanks to such "demos", Aikido is a laughingstock of martial arts and it hurts me to see such TV newscasts.

Quote:
I can vouch for the fact that she's quite able and willing to toss all 195 pounds of me around like a freaking car-wreck.
Owie.

And don't even bring any of the weak attacks to her, she'll just punish you more for it.
That is good to hear

John B.:

Quote:
But I do believe he owes Libby Sensei and ALL women of aikido an apology.
Let's assume for a moment that I am entirely wrong in my observations of women in Aikido (and I really wish I was !).
Indeed, they all are capable of delivering and dealing with honest Aikido attacks.

Then, wouldn't you think that women who make such one-sided "yin" demos of Aikido on public TV owe all OTHER women of Aikido an apology for only perpetuating an unneeded, outdated stereotype ?

P.S.
Man, I am having a deja vu.
I think you and I had exactly the same argument over "Kiai Golf".

Last edited by shihonage : 10-12-2004 at 01:25 PM.
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Old 10-12-2004, 02:16 PM   #20
suren
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

1. I don't think women deliver less sincere attacks than men when they are asked to and if they are trained properly.
2. I agree with Aleksey that if this video is presenting Aikido, it should show all it's sides, no matter what the intension of the program is. Maybe that will make people come to dojo and observe, but if reality is not what they saw on the video, they will just leave. Is that the intension of that program? If so, it's waste of time and efforts.
They could show old people training in very peaceful manner and a randori session with younger practitioners. That would target both young and old audiences and give a better understanding what Aikido is.

Last edited by suren : 10-12-2004 at 02:18 PM.
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Old 10-12-2004, 02:59 PM   #21
GaiaM
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

Quote:
You train in Aikido to forge your spirit, yes ?
In order for your spirit to grow, you must be aligned with Truth, not Lies.
Truth, as in, honest attacks that give your partner honest feedback, and make them develop TRUE technique.

There's a certain balance where you develop communication with your partner.
This does not mean that you always resist, but it means a balanced behavior where you give ukemi that is appropriate at your partners level without downright lying to them with your body feedback during the _entire_ practice.
Connection/communication is important - I'm sure we agree on that. However, "honest" attacks can occur at different speeds, not neccessarily aimed at simulating an attack in a "real life" situation. Not everyone's body can handle the fast ukemi that comes from a fast, "realistic" attack. So as long as the attack is "honest" ie. not stopping before contact and with power and committment, Aikido can be practiced at any speed. In fact, good, connected ukemi is often harder at slower speeds and this is great way to practice.
We might be in agreement here, but I just want to put that out there.

Hi Karen W... Yes, I expect you know the nidan I was speaking of - she took her test in Montreal last spring. Were you there? I thought she had the best test of anyone that day. Oh, and I visited your dojo with a friend of mine from Bard a few weeks ago and we trained together... Hi

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Old 10-12-2004, 03:38 PM   #22
aikidoc
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

True you are entitled to your observations. This is not a knee jerk reaction by the way. However, your statements come across as being very sexist-you put them this way and put the emphasis in them not me: "I think that in MOST cases, Aikido should NOT be taught by a woman. Sure, there are the women on "Holding up Half the Sky" DVD, who actually operate in realtime with real technique, but they appear to be the exceptions." Your are essentially stating in your opinion women should not be aikido instructors. Yes, I realize you attempt to address this in a laterl post-however the "way" you state this is what caused my comments. Basically, that is a very sexist statement, which is interesting given your organization has at least two dojo cho that are females.

"Aikido's cooperative approach lends itself all too well to be distilled into uselessness by a teacher who has no idea of what real aggression is like. This especially applies to women teachers.
All too many of them just don't "get" it to the needed degree, and there's no competitive element in the art to ground them back to reality, like say, Judo would do." I realize men have a long history of testosterone induced aggressive behavior and are more likely to get into fisticuffs and other senseless altercations. However, women are also exposed to violence, often at the hands of men, in such cases as assault, abuse and domestic violence. Because they don't seek it out due to hormonal reasons (i.e., lack of testosterone) does not make them any less aware of the implications or issues of violence nor less capable of participating and instructing. In fact, women instructors in my opinion are more likely capable of learning to cope with such behaviors since their male students frequently like to test them.

I don't know your age but the issue of real time attacks is not necessarily relevant. How many male instructors have been involved in real time incidents. I feel good about the fact that I have not. Does that mean my aikido is any less relevant?
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Old 10-12-2004, 04:12 PM   #23
CNYMike
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

Hey, Jun, thanks for the link.
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Old 10-12-2004, 04:17 PM   #24
shihonage
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Question Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

Well John, to be frank, that article and video pissed me off.
My first reply may have been a little over the top given my emotional state.
I have attempted to balance it out later on.

The issues you address however are the matter of exception vs. the rule.
I never said "never", I said, "less likely".
If you keep portraying my arguments as black-and-white, you can of course continue throwing your "but there are exceptions !" statements, well, forever.
Because there ARE exceptions. No one is arguing with that.

Quote:
I don't know your age but the issue of real time attacks is not necessarily relevant.
I think you are using a differentinterpretation of the term "realtime" which is cause for some misunderstanding.
I think that slow practice is very important in Aikido but realtime practice is just as important and cannot be neglected.
And by realtime, I mean delivering stylized Aikido attacks, in dojo environment, at actual realtime speed.

Slow practice helps get a sense for finer aspects of movement - where to take out the slack, where are the weak balance points and what not - but realtime practice gets you used to spontaneous reaction to a speed at which an attack may actually be delivered outside the dojo.

Realtime practice ALSO answers questions that slow practice cannot.
"Why does the uke hold on here ? Why can't uke do this or that here ? Why can't I hold him in this pin for more than a few seconds ?" - many of such questions can only be answered by delivering a realtime attack at a higher rank and having them "answer" with that follows.
Aikido techniques were invented FROM the interaction of human bodies with realtime physics.
No matter how good you are, you can't simulate the realtime physics accurately during slow practice.

A balance of both is needed.
This balance was not shown in the video.

Quote:
Because they don't seek it out due to hormonal reasons (i.e., lack of testosterone) does not make them any less aware of the implications or issues of violence nor less capable of participating and instructing.
Once again, see a).
This is not about women having "less" capability or potential to do something than men.

This is about the way life TYPICALLY shapes them - they are less likely to get in scuffles or even playfight than guys in school - , that makes them less predisposed to understanding proper attacks - and training in a martial art which typically neglects focusing on training the attacks, does not serve to further their understanding.

If a man gets raised in a same way, he will have the same problems.

Last edited by shihonage : 10-12-2004 at 04:32 PM.
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Old 10-12-2004, 04:20 PM   #25
CNYMike
Dojo: Finger Lakes Aikido
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Re: "Attacks and Throws" - Aikido in Austin

Quote:
Aleksey Sundeyev wrote:
..... Aikido's cooperative approach lends itself all too well to be distilled into uselessness by a teacher who has no idea of what real aggression is like.
This especially applies to women teachers.
All too many of them just don't "get" it to the needed degree, and there's no competitive element in the art to ground them back to reality, like say, Judo would do.
Given that there are women who have done things like Thai Boxing, I sincerely doubt that women teachers wouldn't "get" aggression. In fact, the proliferation of women's self defense courses seems top show they are all too worried about it.

Quote:
..... at least also show energetic young people doing realtime jiyu-waza and multiple attacker drills.
First off, AFAIK, jiyu waza and randori are upper level things anyway, not what you want raw beginners to see/worry about.

Second, what held me back from resuming aikido was going to a demonstration by the Cornell Aikido Club ( http://www.lightlink.com/markr/aikido.htm -- BTW, that dojo is run by a woman) and the way those "energetic young kids" through each other around seemed more intense than Seidokan, and beyond what I was up to.

So showing that stuff might be a bad idea if you want to attract people.



Quote:
..... You know, BOTH sides.
Not just the theoretic pseudo-pacifist side which will get your ass kicked by the geriatric old man doing tai chi in the park.
Well, since I am doing Aikido AND Tai Chi, I'm covered.
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