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Old 10-21-2003, 04:16 PM   #1
akiy
 
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Aikido Fifty Years from Now

Hi everyone,

So, what do you think aikido will be like in fifty years?

-- Jun

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Old 10-21-2003, 05:30 PM   #2
shihonage
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A means for me to win all wrestling competitions in the retirement home.
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Old 10-21-2003, 05:57 PM   #3
MikeE
 
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Better.

As long as their are great instructors and dedicated students, the students will be able to "stand on the shoulders of giants". As long as the Founder's principles are adhered to, I think it will be great and I hope I'm around to enjoy it.

Mike Ellefson
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Old 10-21-2003, 06:02 PM   #4
Chris Li
 
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Quote:
Michael Ellefson (MikeE) wrote:
As long as the Founder's principles are adhered to, I think it will be great and I hope I'm around to enjoy it.
What would you say the Founder's principles are?

Best,

Chris

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Old 10-21-2003, 08:17 PM   #5
sanosuke
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there will be traditional aikido, modern aikido, police aikido, street defense aikido, grappling aikido, women aikido, aikido for special forces, anti-rapist aikido, real life aikido, etc, etc.
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Old 10-21-2003, 09:50 PM   #6
Jeanne Shepard
 
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If I'm still alive, I will be in Old-Aiki-Folks Home, where the mats are really deep and cushy. Hopefully, iwill have escaped osteoporosis.

Jeanne
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Old 10-21-2003, 10:11 PM   #7
Nacho_mx
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Remember an episode of the first season of Star Trek the Next Generation? The security officer (Tasha Yar, played by Denise Crosby) is asked to give a self defense demonstration to an alien leader. Her choice? Aikido
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Old 10-21-2003, 10:22 PM   #8
Abasan
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Aikido will then be one of those really obscure arts that everyone watches in the movies and buys on merchandise but no one really practices except those older generation ppl who are dying anyway.

Of course in 50 years time there would be no need for martial arts for self defence since everyone who can afford it would have nano implants that allows them to move at great speed and reflexes with above human strength and also come equipped with muscle memory of the greatest martial artists alive/dead. Then, anyone who attacks them would be severely crippled unless those guys have even more nano implants maybe even military issue ones.

Only old coots still interested in harmony and musubi would be going to the dojo. Much good it'll do them.

Draw strength from stillness. Learn to act without acting. And never underestimate a samurai cat.
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Old 10-21-2003, 11:02 PM   #9
Lan Powers
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<

Only old coots still interested in harmony and musubi would be going to the dojo. Much good it'll do them.>

What of us who are old coots already?

Hoping that the homes orderly will submit to nikyo, and bring more cherry jello.

Lan

Play nice, practice hard, but remember, this is a MARTIAL art!
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Old 10-22-2003, 07:39 AM   #10
indomaresa
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50 years? ...

we'll practice on gravity suspensor mats, to avoid any injury

Multiple Holo-ukes can be called anytime, from the holo-simulation rooms. hmmm...

hakamas are inflatable, heat resistant, water-proof, and most of all... has zippers ^_^

Long-distance, real-time seminar via the internet with tele-sensory enhancement enabling us to feel the shihan's nikkyo

There's going to be a 20th Dan rank because medical science prolonges life upto 200 year

A movie called "The Aikido Kid" is going to be produced. Starring Seagal as the old aikido man, and Joel Osmond as the Aikido Kid

-----------------------------------------

How about 100 years?

We can execute all the deadly techniques, train seriously with live katanas, because bacta tanks will revive us anyway

our bokkens are rectractable into the tsuba (hand guard), and glows brightly when extended by flicking a switch. It also makes buzzing noises when swinged.

what can I say? I'm a star wars fan

Maresa

The road is long...
The path is steep...
So hire a guide to show you the shortcuts
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Old 10-22-2003, 08:11 AM   #11
SeiserL
 
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IMHO, if you unify and stick to the roots Aikido will last like a lot of the traditional martial arts. If we continue to split and play politics, Aikido will be something you only read about in obscure history books as just anoth cult or fad.

Lynn Seiser PhD
Yondan Aikido & FMA/JKD
We do not rise to the level of our expectations, but fall to the level of our training. Train well. KWATZ!
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Old 10-22-2003, 08:14 AM   #12
philipsmith
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One things for sure: just like today it will be the same but different all over the world
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Old 10-22-2003, 08:22 AM   #13
MikeE
 
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Quote:
Christopher Li (Chris Li) wrote:
What would you say the Founder's principles are?

Best,

Chris
I guess I would start here:

http://www.aikiweb.com/general/founder.html

My thought is that Aikido will aid in the cultivation and evolution of each person, and this should lead future Aikidoka farther down the path that many are on today.

Last edited by MikeE : 10-22-2003 at 08:26 AM.

Mike Ellefson
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Old 10-22-2003, 10:58 AM   #14
Chris Li
 
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Quote:
Michael Ellefson (MikeE) wrote:
What if you replaced each instance of the word "Aikido" in the linked passages with the word "Karate"? Would you still be training in accordance with the principles of the founder?

I also have to note that the bulk of the founder's actual writings on this kind of thing have yet to be translated, and are very difficult to read even in Japanese. Even in Japan I met very few people who had actually read them. Given that fact, how many people are really more than superficially conversant with Morihei Ueshiba's thinking?

Best,

Chris

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Old 10-22-2003, 11:22 AM   #15
happysod
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I think (hope) it'll be just the same, just the names and faces will change. The O'sensei stories will have taken on even more mythic status and at least four more revisionist histories of aikido will be available in paperback. As for aikiweb, the two main camps, hit 'em hard/no lets harmonise will still battle for net supremecy...

An alternative apocalyptical version has the UK banning all ma's as too potentially dangerous to criminals and all of us doing aikidosise.

[insert badly translated smug admonishment here]
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Old 10-22-2003, 02:16 PM   #16
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Instead of bokkens we will have light sabers and O'sensei will come back as Yoda.
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Old 10-22-2003, 07:39 PM   #17
sanosuke
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Quote:
our bokkens are rectractable into the tsuba (hand guard), and glows brightly when extended by flicking a switch. It also makes buzzing noises when swinged.
hopefully there won't be Jedi-ryu aikido also, and Maresa, may the ki be with you.....
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Old 10-22-2003, 09:38 PM   #18
jk
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So many Star Wars fans. Maybe y'all should read this (note no. 7 on the list):

Ten geekiest hobbies



I think I'll agree with Chris...there probably isn't much you'll find in aikido principles/philosophy (whatever that is) that you can't find elsewhere in the wonderful world of the martial arts.

The practice of aikido will persist, and most likely due to the many things you are able explore while engaged in cooperative aikido kata practice; things that are more difficult to do when you're trying to actively beat each other into a pulp. Not that actively beating each other into a pulp isn't fun...
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Old 10-22-2003, 11:08 PM   #19
MikeE
 
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Quote:
Christopher Li (Chris Li) wrote:
What if you replaced each instance of the word "Aikido" in the linked passages with the word "Karate"? Would you still be training in accordance with the principles of the founder?

I also have to note that the bulk of the founder's actual writings on this kind of thing have yet to be translated, and are very difficult to read even in Japanese. Even in Japan I met very few people who had actually read them. Given that fact, how many people are really more than superficially conversant with Morihei Ueshiba's thinking?

Best,

Chris
Jeez Chris,

My cup is half full. How is yours?

So, the "bulk" of the Founder's actual writings have yet to be translated. A broad and encompassing statement like that should be qualified with sources. Not that I disagree with you. In fact, I admit my ignorance. You obviously are better connected to whomever is in control of O'Sensei's writings.

I just think that the portion we have of O'Sensei's principles are a good start for guiding our training.

What do you think?

Mike Ellefson
Midwest Center
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Aikido Bukou
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Old 10-23-2003, 02:06 AM   #20
Chris Li
 
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Quote:
Michael Ellefson (MikeE) wrote:
Jeez Chris,

My cup is half full. How is yours?

So, the "bulk" of the Founder's actual writings have yet to be translated. A broad and encompassing statement like that should be qualified with sources. Not that I disagree with you. In fact, I admit my ignorance. You obviously are better connected to whomever is in control of O'Sensei's writings.
"Takemusu Aiki" and "Aikido Shinzui" are both openly available in Japanese, but not in English. In "Takemusu Aiki" Morihei Ueshiba discusses in a fair amount of depth his conception of what "Aikido" is, and, after reading it, I realized that what is available in English is really more or less a collection of out-of-context clippings. They're not wrong, but it's the something like the difference between someone quoting bible passages at you and actually having the full text of the book in front of you. Even things like the only really comprehensive biography of Morihei Ueshiba ("Aikido Kaiso, Ueshiba Morihei Den" by Kisshomaru Ueshiba) have yet to make their way into English.
Quote:
Michael Ellefson (MikeE) wrote:
I just think that the portion we have of O'Sensei's principles are a good start for guiding our training.

What do you think?
Maybe, except that I could bring you ten different students of Morihei Ueshiba with ten different interpretations of the "Founder's principles" (each an every one stating definitively that they adhere to said principles). I've found the situation to be even worse when you get a couple of generations away and into a foreign language (English, in this case).

Best,

Chris

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Old 10-23-2003, 06:13 AM   #21
markwalsh
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After the Bush/Blair induced apocalypse, Mad Max Style sensei will stalk the wastelands dishing out justice and bringing harmony to the force, until a peaceful world government is established under the leadership of a cloned O'Sensei.

Seriously, 50 years is fairly hopeful IMHO for global survival, but every little helps, so lets keep at the wrist grabbing.

If we and aikido are still around I think rank (no common standard) and organisations (too many) will have become so meaningless as to be ignored.

Mark

x
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Old 10-23-2003, 07:42 AM   #22
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Mark, "If we and aikido are still around I think rank (no common standard) and organisations (too many) will have become so meaningless as to be ignored" - here I was thinking MikeE was the optimist, no rank or organisations?

Au contraire I agree, we will see a multitude of both with ever more grandiose titles introduced by to justify preeminance (super shihan a la dragonball springs to mind..). However, far from them being ignored they will become even more important to the bureaucratic and even used as basis for government "teaching certificates", aikido-l seminar members will be hunted down as the deviant mas that they are...

[insert badly translated smug admonishment here]
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Old 10-23-2003, 09:40 AM   #23
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Quote:
John Kuo (jk) wrote:
So many Star Wars fans. Maybe y'all should read this (note no. 7 on the list):

Ten geekiest hobbies



I think I'll agree with Chris...there probably isn't much you'll find in aikido principles/philosophy (whatever that is) that you can't find elsewhere in the wonderful world of the martial arts.

The practice of aikido will persist, and most likely due to the many things you are able explore while engaged in cooperative aikido kata practice; things that are more difficult to do when you're trying to actively beat each other into a pulp. Not that actively beating each other into a pulp isn't fun...
You think their probably isn't much in aikido that you can't find elsewhere? Do you even know what Aikido is??

The only thing geekier than "star wars" fans and the people like them, are the ones who troll from various boards and philosophize

about subjects on which they are ingnorant.

Sorry, JK, but where do you get off posting here if you don't even know what Aikido is? I've only be practicing about a year and a half and I read up on it when I can and when I find something interesting. And yet, despite my limited knowledge, I know aikido is truely unlike all other martial arts despite the fact that it is classified a "martial art."

There is no beating people to a pulp in aikido. In fact, there are no beatings at all despite stories to the contrary. Bad ukemi? Sure. Over-zealous student? on occassion. But we don't beat to a pulp anything... except bokkens maybe.

Have a nice day!

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Old 10-23-2003, 10:32 AM   #24
zachbiesanz
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As long as we don't get to the point where there are striped (and even camouflage) belts, I think I'll be happy.

I also hope to see an increase in cross-organizational friendship seminars.

Aikido is the art of hitting an assailant with the planet.
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Old 10-23-2003, 09:35 PM   #25
jk
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Hi John,

There seems to be a fundamental disconnect here, and the blame seem to lie in my less-than-stellar writing style.

It's encouraging that after one and a half years of practice, you are assured of aikido's uniqueness. I will admit my inability to accurately describe in black-and-white, after a few paltry years of aikido practice, just what aikido is and isn't. Hence the use of the word "probably." What I do want to say is that we are in agreement that aikido is a singular martial art that stands on its own; HOWEVER, this doesn't preclude the existence of many common elements, philosophical or otherwise, between two or more unique martial arts. That was the only point I wanted to make.

As for beating people into a pulp, when did I say that was what aikido was about? In an attempt to be clearer, I will say that the cooperative kata practice of aikido is more conducive to learning elements such as blending, sensitivity, non-resistance, and the like. This is IN CONTRAST to "beating each other to a pulp," which is my clumsy vernacular for non-cooperative practice/sparring/what-have-you that you may find in other martial arts. For me, the cooperative kata practice is a very enriching experience, and I am of the opinion that this is what will contribute to aikido's staying power.

I plead guilty to being a major geek, for being excruciatingly ignorant about a lot of things, and for making dastardly fun of poor innocent Star Wars fans. Mea culpa, mea maxima culpa. Will this do to assuage any hurt feelings?

Have a nice day too, John.

Regards,

Last edited by jk : 10-23-2003 at 09:49 PM.
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