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Old 05-24-2003, 02:01 AM   #26
erikmenzel
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Thanks everybody for the nice comments regarding my concerns. All the things voiced are very valid. Indeed one should have an open mind towards Aikido, but the reel world (TM) already shows us that this is not the norm and to many schools or students exclude some parts of aikido just because it is not mentioned by a certain teacher, in a certain teaching curriculem or in a certain book. Every tool has the risk of being used in such a manner.

Yes, Aikido is spontanious and like every other human motion no 2 times are exactly the same.

My main concern is however that the motions and dynamics one sees in aikido are the result of a sum of motions. There is a huge difference between the motion (intent) that nage initiated and the motion that actually happend due to the interaction with uke. To put it in other words: the motion one sees is not the motion that nage started to make, but the sum of the motion of uke and nage. Someone studying these motion might very easily make the assumption that what he sees (the final result of interaction) is what he has to do. This is not true.

Erik Jurrien Menzel
kokoro o makuru taisanmen ni hirake
Personal:www.kuipers-menzel.com
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Old 05-24-2003, 04:06 PM   #27
Paul Sanderson-Cimino
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Very impressive; it shows much promise for recording and studying aikido. (More than, perhaps, the clumsiness of photography and VHS video allow.) Obviously, it has its limits, but so do all forms of instruction that I can think of.
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Old 05-25-2003, 02:07 AM   #28
Kelly Allen
Dojo: Friends Dojo
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Lightbulb Multiple digital cameras

I thought it was interesting, but I found the two dimentional appearance of the stick men in three dimentional interaction confusing to the eye.

I seen another type of capture sytem on the PGA tour. It was set up on one of the tee boxes during one of the majors. It consisted of 24 digital cameras wrapped around the box in a 180* arc. All 24 cameras recorded the swing into a computer so that whe the swing was replayed any part of the swing could be anylised from any angle within that 180* arc. It could be played in slow motion, fast motion, of froze on a spacific part of the swing.

Now why can't the same technology be used by setting up the cameras in a 360* veiw around the demonstrating Aikidokas. Add a few cameras above to capture over views as though being captured from a dome of eyes. That I think would make an ideal teaching tool. Like haveing a three dimentional VCR tape. The Nage can change up Uke to different body types to show how size and weight can affect the dynamics of the same throw.

Just a thought. What do you think?
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Old 05-25-2003, 11:11 PM   #29
Alfonso
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Wow, I was way off target. But I think I understand what you mean. Henry Kono sensei did a seminar at my dojo. I believe this was pretty much his point.

My head's still spinning on that seminar..
Quote:
Erik Jurrien Knoops (erikknoops) wrote:
My main concern is however that the motions and dynamics one sees in aikido are the result of a sum of motions. There is a huge difference between the motion (intent) that nage initiated and the motion that actually happend due to the interaction with uke. To put it in other words: the motion one sees is not the motion that nage started to make, but the sum of the motion of uke and nage. Someone studying these motion might very easily make the assumption that what he sees (the final result of interaction) is what he has to do. This is not true.

Alfonso Adriasola
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Old 05-25-2003, 11:41 PM   #30
erikmenzel
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Quote:
Alfonso Adriasola (Alfonso) wrote:
My head's still spinning on that seminar..
That must be because you do not understand about yin and yang

Erik Jurrien Menzel
kokoro o makuru taisanmen ni hirake
Personal:www.kuipers-menzel.com
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Old 05-26-2003, 09:58 AM   #31
Alfonso
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...right...

Alfonso Adriasola
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Old 05-28-2003, 06:22 AM   #32
PRutledge
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Re: Multiple digital cameras

Quote:
Kelly Allen wrote:
I seen another type of capture sytem on the PGA tour. It was set up on one of the tee boxes during one of the majors. It consisted of 24 digital cameras wrapped around the box in a 180* arc. All 24 cameras recorded the swing into a computer so that whe the swing was replayed any part of the swing could be anylised from any angle within that 180* arc. It could be played in slow motion, fast motion, of froze on a spacific part of the swing.
Kelly - I agree that would be another very interesting technology to apply to Aikido. It's the same basic idea behind the original Matrix "bullet time" effect, and I remember they used something similar for NFL games for a while. It has the advantage of using visible light cameras and not requiring markers. I assume there are technical issues with synchronizing the frames for seamless shifts between views, and maybe some tricky lighting, but it seems like something that might be applied in a dojo setting.

Patrick Rutledge
patrick@adaptiveperception.com
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