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Old 03-31-2003, 10:27 AM   #1
GregH
Location: Harrisburg, Pa
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 15
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How much is Aikido worth to you?

Hello all,
I just had this cross my mind and wanted your thoughts on it. How much do you all pay for dojo fees? Is there a maximum you would pay? Just how much is the practice of Aikido worth to people? Kind of extending this thought, do your fees go to anything beyond dojo rent/utilities etc? Should a
sensei (dojo cho?) profit from teaching Aikido? Sorry for all these questions in one post, and thanks for your time.

Greg
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Old 03-31-2003, 11:07 AM   #2
acot
Dojo: West Michigan Aikido
Location: Grand Rapids, Michigan
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 112
United_States
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I pay $1000 New Taiwan Dollars a month (about $30us). I don't think it even begins to pay the rent here (Taiwan is small, land is limited so rent is pretty high) . This operated out of a community center by a couple of retirees.

From what I have read the Hombu HQ (for those who are assoiated with it) requires that the head instructor be at least a 4th Dan within any particular organzation. (i might be wrong). With that being said I would consider a 4th Dan in Aikido to have perhaps a B.A. or perhaps a masters degree in Martial Arts training. Should this person be able to profit from it? Sure, Aikido dojos aren't churches, they are private educational institutions which are set up to take in an income.

Perhaps another question should be put to those who are running a dojo. Are you making a profit? as in is your bottom line red or black?

Ryan
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Old 03-31-2003, 11:22 AM   #3
rachmass
Dojo: Aikido of Cincinnati/Huron Valley Aikikai
Location: Somerset Michigan
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 794
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Ryan, with all respect, where did you get the idea that Hombu (aikikai I presume) requires a head instructor of a dojo to be fourth Dan?

That said, I know there was a thread awhile ago about how much people paid for their aikido dues. I run a small dojo, and dues don't cover the lease, but I have a Yoga and a Pilates teacher who help split the cost. Hopefully over time, the dojo will completely support itself, but I run the dojo for the love and dissemination of aikido, and it is certainly not my day job. I think this is the norm.

The shihan and upper level teachers, in my mind, SHOULD be supported by their teaching; they've put the years of effort and experience into it, and are giving us all so much knowledge.

Regards,

Rachel
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Old 03-31-2003, 11:25 AM   #4
Daniel Blanco
Dojo: Suffolk Aikikai
Location: Patchogue
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 98
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aikido is hy workout/cardio routine,also my defense as a policeofficer.
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Old 03-31-2003, 11:30 AM   #5
Daniel Blanco
Dojo: Suffolk Aikikai
Location: Patchogue
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 98
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greg if your are satisfied with your workout then thate all that matters also if your instructors are good then stay where you are and enjoy.
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Old 03-31-2003, 12:14 PM   #6
otto
Dojo: Independent
Location: Maracaibo/Zulia
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 149
Venezuela
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How much is worth for you?...or how much do you pay for its instruction???

Two very different matters pal.

In my case i pay around 20 US dollars , and according to my sensei and his former teacher you cant make too much profit or have a comfortable living just by teaching MA's , their reasons to think this is that Martial Arts is something that's is fading out and there isnt too many people interested in invest its money training on it.

Guess the culture of the inmediate gratification is taking over , or at least so they think.

Best Regards

"Perfection is a Process"
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Old 03-31-2003, 06:23 PM   #7
kung fu hamster
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 166
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Gi - $65

Bokken - $20

Tanto - $5

Being able to play cool ‘grab my wrist' aikido party tricks on my Demon Seed nephew - Priceless


Last edited by kung fu hamster : 03-31-2003 at 06:30 PM.
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Old 03-31-2003, 11:49 PM   #8
batemanb
 
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Dojo: Seibukan Aikido UK
Location: body in UK, heart still in Japan
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 1,029
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Quote:
Rachel Massey (rachmass) wrote:
Ryan, with all respect, where did you get the idea that Hombu (aikikai I presume) requires a head instructor of a dojo to be fourth Dan?

Regards,

Rachel
Rachel,

I don't think that's what he said, he was talking about the head instructor of an organisation rather than an individual dojo
Quote:
Ryan Bertram(acot) wrote:
From what I have read the Hombu HQ (for those who are assoiated with it) requires that the head instructor be at least a 4th Dan within any particular organzation. (i might be wrong).
In Tokyo, I was paying 6000 yen (about $60 US/ £40 GBP) a quarter, for that I could train every evening in any one of 4 dojo's, all directly associated to the Aikikai. All of the dojo's are in school's, I don't know if the association paid for their hire. I don't know if the mony is aportioned to the dojo-cho's or if it went directly to Kaicho, or elsewhere, it never really bothered me.

In the UK, I pay £3 GBP per session. The club Sensei's do not take any money, the fees just about cover the cost of renting out the community centre, depending on how many people show. We go through periods of a full house (about 15-18 on the mat, which kind of fills it at 24 tatami), to times when only 3 or 4 show. So far we've been lucky that it always seems to balance out.

Whether it be Japan or UK, the dojo's that I train in are all excellent value for money.

Having said all that, can I put a price on what Aikido is worth to me, probably not.

Regards

Bryan

Last edited by batemanb : 03-31-2003 at 11:52 PM.

A difficult problem is easily solved by asking yourself the question, "Just how would the Lone Ranger handle this?"
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Old 04-01-2003, 12:40 AM   #9
bob_stra
Location: Australia
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 641
Australia
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Re: How much is Aikido worth to you?

I pay about A$80 per month (about $50 US) for 3 classes per week.

I guess that's a lot, but there are other factors besides money that draw me to the dojo.

I think the cheapest local aikido is A$120 ($70 US) per 6 months. Good guys from what I hear, but too far away from me.
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Old 04-01-2003, 01:05 AM   #10
Jeff Tibbetts
Dojo: Cedar River Aikikai
Location: Cedar Rapids, Iowa
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 142
United_States
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Wow. I pay just $20.00 a month. That's with a student discount, it's $35.00 for others, I think. Anyway, I've always thought this was a hell of a deal. I think I'd be willing to pay a lot more, but I don't have a lot more; so I guess I'm lucky. I think that it would be nice for a Sensei to make a little extra pocket money (or a lot, for a Shihan or full-time instructor,) but I don't think that that's usually the case. I know we split the Dojo with a Goju-Ryu Karate club and a very small Judo club, so the cost may be a bit more manageable. We have, maybe, 20 or so dues-paying regulars give or take, but I haven't got a clue what the rent is.

If the Nightingale doesn't sing-
wait
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Old 04-01-2003, 01:18 AM   #11
bob_stra
Location: Australia
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 641
Australia
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Actually, the $80 / month is the student rate!

To be fair, JDJ is open 6 days a week, several classes a day. It's a commercial dojo in the heart of the CBD.

My judo place use to share the dojo with goju guys. Classes were $20 a month unlimited.

The MMA place I train in is in a old garage/warehouse. Costs 8 bucks a class.

Location, location!!
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Old 04-01-2003, 01:32 AM   #12
E. Winters
Dojo: Aikido of San Leandro and Aikido Institute of Davis
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 6
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Hello, I pay 70 and 80 U.S. dollars between two dojos and if I could pay more I would.Part of the reason the dojos cost so much is that I live in California and property is very expensive here and one of the dojos that I attend is in the San Francisco bay area, which is considered one of the three most expensive areas to live in within the USA. I still feel I am not contributing enough.I feel that the instructors should be able to spend all their precious time teaching and traning. I also think that money is the minimum I should give to the dojo.I also feel a student should also help take care of the dojo by providing whatever service they are capable of providing. I have two great instructors that have given me something I could never repay them back for but I will do my best.

Train hard and have fun!
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Old 04-01-2003, 05:52 AM   #13
ian
 
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Dojo: University of Ulster, Coleriane
Location: Northern Ireland
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,654
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we pay £10 for insurance per year - and everything else is free!

---understanding aikido is understanding the training method---
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Old 04-01-2003, 06:42 AM   #14
acot
Dojo: West Michigan Aikido
Location: Grand Rapids, Michigan
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 112
United_States
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Rachel,

Chapter 2.....

(3) The head of management or the chief of Aikido instruction of the relevant Aikido organization is 4th dan or above. The Person in Charge is a permanent resident of the country of that organization.

http://www.aikikai.or.jp/Eng/Interna...egulations.htm.

Just in case anyone wondered where I got that information.

Cheers,

Ryan
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Old 04-01-2003, 08:28 AM   #15
rachmass
Dojo: Aikido of Cincinnati/Huron Valley Aikikai
Location: Somerset Michigan
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 794
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Okay Ryan, that is what Bryan said; I guess I took it as the wording of heading a dojo, in which case there is nothing about being a 4th Dan, not the organizational sense, like AAA, ASU or USAF (which of course, all have much higher ranks at the top).

Cheers back!

Rachel
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Old 04-01-2003, 08:35 AM   #16
DGLinden
Dojo: Shoshin Aikido Dojos
Location: Orlando
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 159
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I think the cost is probably like that of real estate - it depends on the location. New York and San Franscisco should probably be higher than Orlando just by virtue of economic factors. The cost should be higher for shihan level instruction. Top instructors should definately be paid, big bucks - the more the better. They have sacrificed more than most will ever know to get where they are.

As to how much instructors actually do make... that question is impertinant and considered out of line in polite society - which aikidoka always aspire to. At least in Orlando.

Daniel G. Linden
Author of ON MASTERING AIKIDO (c) 2004
Founder Shoshin Aikido Dojos
www.shoshindojo.com
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Old 04-01-2003, 10:19 PM   #17
bob_stra
Location: Australia
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 641
Australia
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Quote:
Daniel Linden (DGLinden) wrote:
I think the cost is probably like that of real estate - it depends on the location. New York and San Franscisco should probably be higher than Orlando just by virtue of economic factors.
Kind of assumes that folks in NY and SF make more cash than those in Orlando. I have no idea if that true or not tho.
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Old 04-04-2003, 10:25 AM   #18
taras
Location: West Yorks and Merseyside, UK
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 170
United Kingdom
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I pay £3 per session (about $4.5); children and unemployed pay £2. On top of that we pay £10 insurance and around £12 per grading.

All the money that we pay goes towards the rent, and also towards purchasing equipment. Instructors don't even get petrol money although one of them has to travel some distance to get to dojo. I suggested to reimburse him once and was told by another student that he would probably take offence.
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Old 04-04-2003, 12:24 PM   #19
Veers
 
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Dojo: Shinkikan Aikikai Aikido of Corpus Christi
Location: Corpus Christi, Texas
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 169
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Sensei told me last night that dues would be $50 per month, which currently comes out to about $6.25 a class. A third class on Saturday is a possibility, which would lower that to about $4.20. I'm willing to pay that much...it's about what I had budgeted (if you call my inane calculations budgeting).

Not sure how much money he's making off the classes, if any.

The early bird may get the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.
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Old 04-04-2003, 01:23 PM   #20
akiy
 
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It looks like we have about 22 hours a week of class for adult regular members who pay $70/month for an unlimited number of classes. It looks like that comes out to an average of about $0.73 per hour of class available. Not bad...

-- Jun

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Old 04-05-2003, 02:51 AM   #21
erikmenzel
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Dojo: Aikidojo Leiderdorp
Location: Leiden
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 530
Netherlands
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A minimum of 25 euro for 45 hours per month, thus 56 eurocents per hour. (People that can afford to pay more often do)

But we also disencourage enybody to make these calculations at our dojo. People don't pay per lesson but pay to maintain the dojo. And even besides that, participation in the dojo is what is considered the most important. We expect people to spent enough time. The dojo needs to be cleaned, the mats and equipment needs to be checked and repaired.

So we expect people keep the dojo running

Erik Jurrien Menzel
kokoro o makuru taisanmen ni hirake
Personal:www.kuipers-menzel.com
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Old 04-05-2003, 04:40 AM   #22
norman telford
 
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Dojo: newton aycliffe aikido club (UKAU)
Location: county durham england uk
Join Date: Nov 2002
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i think here in the UKAU we get a good deal we pay £20(pounds sterling) a month for that you are able to train 7 days a week approx 60 hrs a month specialized courses are avilable one weekend a month at £5 each one on a sat and one on a sun various two and three day seminars (these vary in price)and a week long summer school all grading is free
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Old 04-06-2003, 01:52 AM   #23
aubrey bannah
Dojo: Yoshinkan Brisbane
Location: aust
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 34
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In Brisbane $70 mth, Less if you want to pay for a yr in advance. This lets you enjoy youself for 62 class's. Strangly enough over the last four yrs more students are doing this amount of training.

Such powers I poccess for working in the political field have been derived from the spiritual field. Mahatma Gandhi.
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Old 04-07-2003, 10:01 PM   #24
Joseph Huebner
 
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Dojo: Seiwa Dojo / Battle Creek, MI
Location: Hastings, Michigan
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 46
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I pay $40.00 USD for dues to our dojo. On top of this I drive 55 miles round trip 2-4 days a week. I am going to camp this yr, my first ever Seidokan Aikido camp... There's $200.00 bucks invested. Perhaps because I'm in my third month studying aikido I am more than willing to expend alot of time and money for aikido.

Yet, in comparison, it's more than 4 bucks for a pack of smokes nowadays. Potato chips are three bucks a bag, and a 20 oz soda is a whopping $1.29. Our satellite dish bill is around $70.00 a month. Wow! By comparison, it costs less to study aikido than it does being a couch potato including gasoline and oil changes.

I can't say if our Sensei makes any money since I don't do the books. I would say that he does not. If he did, I would not object. Having the opportunity to learn from his experience, and getting to know a great group of people is a hell of a bargain for what I am paying. Would I pay more? If I had to, yes indeed.



Joseph Huebner
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Old 04-07-2003, 11:01 PM   #25
Paul Sanderson-Cimino
Dojo: Yoshokai; looking into judo
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 424
United_States
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My college (Carleton College) subsidizes our dojo. My roommate and I did the math ... it drops below a dollar a class if you pay for all three classes: beginning, intermediate, and advanced, which each meet twice per week for a total of 6 sensei-led classes per week. It's 25$ for beginning, 35$ for beginning and intermediate, and 40$ for all three. (That's for a 10-week term.) They run for about an hour each.

(There's also a 3 hour 'open mat' session each saturday, and a 'buki night' for an hour on thursday, but those are not led by the sensei.)

All in all, we're very fortunate to have college sponsorship, giving us poor college students the opportunity to train. ^_-
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