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Old 06-22-2006, 09:22 PM   #1026
Talon
 
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Drew do you ever grab anyone's fingers at twist them in Judo/BJJ, or crank the wirsts in a quick movmement while the person is moving in the opposite direction? If the answer is NO then I don't see how BJJ/Judo compare to alot of Aikido techniques. Non complience to those and fingers/wrists are broken. No thanks, I'd rather roll out of it....
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Old 06-22-2006, 09:43 PM   #1027
drew-jitsu
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Paul Nowicki wrote:
Drew do you ever grab anyone's fingers at twist them in Judo/BJJ, or crank the wirsts in a quick movmement while the person is moving in the opposite direction? If the answer is NO then I don't see how BJJ/Judo compare to alot of Aikido techniques. Non complience to those and fingers/wrists are broken. No thanks, I'd rather roll out of it....
Have you ever tried to grab someone's wrist or fingers in an actual altercation? It's kinda hard. And yes, there are people in BJJ that do try wrist locks. They are most of the time unsuccessful.
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Old 06-22-2006, 10:32 PM   #1028
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Drew Nichols wrote:
No troll here. I just noticed that the thread was at the bottom of the page, and I didn't want it to die. However, regarding your concessions as to going all out, there are arts that do go 100% i.e. BJJ and Judo. Also, anytime someone mentions Ki throws, I find it to be the epitome of delusional.
BJJ and Judo do not go 100% on any technique designed to destroy a joint or limb or choke someone out to unconsciousness.
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Old 06-22-2006, 11:19 PM   #1029
drew-jitsu
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Howard Dyke wrote:
BJJ and Judo do not go 100% on any technique designed to destroy a joint or limb or choke someone out to unconsciousness.
correct. we tap out before the damage is done. However, if we don't, we suffer broken limbs or unconsciosness. The point being is that we do go 100% in attaining the submission, but stop before it's fully applied. It's a foregone conclusion that if the technique is brought to fruition it will result in physical disability.
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Old 06-23-2006, 01:13 AM   #1030
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Straight Face Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Drew Nichols wrote:
therein lies the paradox. O'sensei achieved his proficiency by ACTUALLY FIGHTING!!! Then later in life advocated not fighting. In order to achieve the proficiency O'sensei attained, you HAVE TO FIGHT against fully resisting opponents. And as far as your "Ki rhytem" (sic), try using that against a non complient uke, and you will get your arse handed to you. This is why aikido 99% of the time will not work in an actual physical altercation the way it is currently trained. I kinda find it funny that the aikido community actually had to develop a quote to defend against it's effectiveness, i.e. "My aikido works, yours does not." Aikido in my opinion does have useful applicable techniques. They just need to be trained in a manner that makes them effective. It's obvious by the examples set by O'sensei that aikido can be effective. Why the aikido community chooses to be passive aggressive in it's philosophy is its downfall.
hi drew nichols,

For your info, I'm on my 3rd week of aikido training and i can tell you that aikido works just fine. I was playing with my dog the other day and when he jumped at me, i did a 180% tenkan and it fooled him good. Another 6 months and i'll ask my sensei to teach me the "2 pinky fingers of death" technique. Then and only then, will i quote "my aikido works, yours doesn't". I have to have my standards, y'know?

Thru aikido, i am now part of this 1000+ (and running) thread. the universe flows thru me.


rgds,
ksyuan
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Old 06-23-2006, 01:16 AM   #1031
mathewjgano
 
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Drew Nichols wrote:
try using that against a non complient uke, and you will get your arse handed to you. This is why aikido 99% of the time will not work in an actual physical altercation the way it is currently trained.
This seems a bit simplistic to me. I know scrappers; they've been my best friends all my life. I've done quite a bit better than succeeding only 1% of the time when we've tested each other out, and I've only trained in Aikido. You can argue about different approaches to Aikido perhaps, but I'm an example of how you seem to be making a bit of an assumption...or are at least not speaking clearly and precisely enough.
Quote:
Drew Nichols wrote:
Aikido in my opinion does have useful applicable techniques. They just need to be trained in a manner that makes them effective. It's obvious by the examples set by O'sensei that aikido can be effective. Why the aikido community chooses to be passive aggressive in it's philosophy is its downfall.
That's still a pretty large brush you're painting with. The Aikido community is a pretty diverse group of people; different people seeking different things in their study of Aikido. Certainly it's true that what one focuses on will affect that which one becomes most proficient at.
You're saying that Aikido works but that Aikidoka in general don't know how to use it effectively. I haven't met most Aikidoka or even trained at a large number of schools: but the two I have chanced upon develop their level of resistance based on what they know you can do; by feeling you out. Perhaps it's coincidence, but it makes me wonder how much experience you have with Aikido. I've heard a lot of Aikido is "empty" or not lively, but I'm not convinced it's as extream as you make it sound...but, as I said, I have a limited frame of reference.
Take care,
Matt

Last edited by mathewjgano : 06-23-2006 at 01:19 AM.

Gambarimashyo!
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Old 06-23-2006, 06:11 AM   #1032
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

I was one of the large contributors to this thread and am most honored to see it still going strong.
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Old 06-23-2006, 06:29 AM   #1033
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Mike Geery wrote:
I was one of the large contributors to this thread and am most honored to see it still going strong.
How old were you when it started and how old are you now?
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Old 06-23-2006, 07:04 AM   #1034
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

I hate to constantly use the army as examples but you gotta go with what you know right

In the military one of my biggest pet peeves is constantly hearing people compare their trade (job) against someone Else's job. We're tougher we walk everywhere. We're tougher we use tanks. We're more important we fly. With out me your nothing. Guys can have less than a year in and their already talking trash about everyone else. Concentrate on your own job and let other people do their thing.

Drew, Mike, this isn't to slight you or your style, I'm mostly speaking in more general terms. One of the biggest things about Internet jujitsu arguments/debates (especially including Brazilian jujitsu it seems) is that there is a constant argument about how effective their art is. How other arts fail to stack up against it. How their art is going to work in real life where others won't. How other arts won't last in a cage fight. I can't help but think who cares? If your tough do you need to go around telling people that your tough? No it should be obvious. If your martial arts is the best thing since sliced bread why tell people? It should be apparent.

Using this thread for example, Aikido does not work at all in a fight, thats a great discussion because it's a popular (important) argument among the martial arts community. Why then does it ultimately degrade into an aikido vs judo/jujitsu/TKD/karate etc.. thread? The title isn't aikido does not work against other martial arts, its working in a fight. The chances of two martial artists meeting up and going at it style vs style in the street is pretty slim. Ya someone on here is going to have a hockey bag full of examples, exception to the rule though.
Aikido- some jerk comes up and grabs you in a bar and you pin them or defend yourself without hurting them.

If you want to debate style vs style open up a new thread, as far as I can tell this thread is about aikido working in a street fight against someone who probably
A) Doesn't know said person knows aikido/martial arts
B) Doesn't know martial arts themselves.

Grabbing a wrist in a fight is very difficult, agreed, that said I've blocked a punch with my arm and slid my hand down to their wrist and grabbed it. Every situation on the ground is different, you could fill up this web site with examples of aikido working and aikido not working.

Sometimes I get the feeling that martial artists almost need validation on their art. They need the MA community to say YES your martial arts works, yes it's great. Some people seem to need even more seeming to be happy only when someone admits "yes your martial art is better than mine, you win".
Again mike and drew this isn't against you specifically, but truth be told I've found the JJ community, perhaps more so in their "greener members" seems hooked on pointing out other martial arts short comings against their own.

I hope I'm not reading too much into this thread. Apples and oranges as far as I'm concerned. One is good for vodka, the other for pie. I think the main reason behind the whole aikido not working in a fight stuff is because you don't really start learning aikido until your black belt. To me it's like white to black belt = this is how to do the technique. Black belt and above = this is how to make the technique work.

Defending yourself against someone without hurting the attacker is a hell of a lot harder than defending yourself aganst them without concern for their saftey.

Last edited by Guilty Spark : 06-23-2006 at 07:14 AM.
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Old 06-23-2006, 07:07 AM   #1035
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Just to play devils advocate cause I'm really bored today.

Quote:
Paul Nowicki wrote:
Drew do you ever grab anyone's fingers at twist them in Judo/BJJ, or crank the wirsts in a quick movmement while the person is moving in the opposite direction? If the answer is NO then I don't see how BJJ/Judo compare to alot of Aikido techniques. Non complience to those and fingers/wrists are broken. No thanks, I'd rather roll out of it....
Yes, I have done wrist locks, toe holds, finger locks, etc. They are extreamly hard to get and usually I only use them against less skilled opponents (although fingers usually only when screwing around with friends as its really unsportsman like to bend peoples fingers without knowing they are ok with you trying). I have never had a wrist lock work from the standing position (Well I shouldn't say never, I think I got an ikkyo once). Every successful wristlock I have performed has been on the ground (tipically used as a setup for a sweep). The more I spar, the more my success rate goes up.

Personally to me aikido is not all about the deadly wrist lock. If you seek the wristlock in a fight, your not thinking properly. The real secret to making anything work is to seek to take your opponents balance. If you are going to talk about how badass anything is, or what will end a fight, its all right there. Of course once you do that, you have a lot of options depending on the situation. I personally perfer good throws over standing locks anyday. I've had a good harai or ogoshi end a fight even on the mats.

Remember, nothing hits harder than the earth.

Quote:
Grant Wagar wrote:
The more I practice Aikido the more I'm understanding how striking isn't the end all of self defense.

I'm of the opinion that you don't need to hit someone to hurt them. More than a few techniques I've seen would result in some serious injury if don't without regard for the other persons safty. Broken wrists, arms, dislocated shoulders, concussions. It sounds crude but if you break someones hand wrist or arm their going to have a hard time punching you regardless how skilled at striking they are.
Unless they are Rich Franklin. He beat a man for 13 minutes with a broken hand. He said he knew 2 minutes into the first round his hand was broken. Here's a funny video with him talking about it
http://www.ufc.com/index.cfm?fa=Mult...etail&gid=2331

Here's a good article on that as well http://www.ufc.com/index.cfm?fa=news.detail&gid=2329 My favorte part :

Quote:
"I remember clipping my hand and making a fist a couple of times and realizing that something was wrong," remembered Franklin two days after the bout. "And then I could feel the bones slipping over on top of one another. That's when I grabbed my hand to feel it."

He didn't like the answer his hand gave him, but he didn't stop fighting. As the round progressed, with seconds feeling like hours, he admitted that he was "trying to rationalize what's going on in my head."

That's the former math teacher in him -- look at a problem, analyze it, and solve it.

"Something's not right with my hand," he thought, but Loiseau wasn't going to step back in a corner and wait for Franklin to recover or take a breather. The punches kept coming, and so did the kicks, each passing his head with a whoosh. Franklin didn't give up his poker face either, continuing to pound Loiseau with all his limbs, not just the good ones. Once you show the first sign of weakness, a world-class fighter will pounce with extreme prejudice; Franklin couldn't let that happen.

The horn sounded. End of round two. Franklin went back to his corner after pitching a virtual shutout in the previous ten minutes.

He informed Gurgel, a fighter himself, someone who is no stranger to the pains that are as plentiful as the cheers in this sport, that he was fighting with only one good hand.

"He kind of looked at me like I was complaining, and I wasn't complaining," chuckled Franklin. "I was just giving him an informative statement so he could corner me properly."

Gurgel only seemed to hesitate for a millisecond before blurting out "then use the elbow." In a combat sport, when a cornerman has 60 seconds to be doctor, counselor, confessor, and strategist, there's no time for pleasantries. Watch a boxing match sometime, and see what a cutman tells his fighter when his eyebrow is split to the bone.

"It's okay, it's not that bad."

Gurgel took his fighter's mind away from the injury and back on the fight. He knew Franklin wouldn't quit. He also knew that despite what happened in the previous two rounds, Loiseau was still dangerous. So he had to get his fighter ready to fight again.

"Keep throwing punches," said Gurgel. "It'll go numb."
My point is, never stop fighting until the fight is done. Just because you throw the guy doesn't mean he's done. Don't expect the wrist lock to end it. It might end a argument between to posturing males. But when someone is really out to hurt you, I think you are going to have to seriously hurt them to end it (unconciousness or death).

I only have one other comment to make. I see a lot of people saying there is not sparing in aikido because it is too dangerous. I think that is bull. I submit that there are styles that have competition. I also submit that nothing done in aikido is more dangerous than techniques done in MMA. Your sparing would be restricted. No grabbing hair, eyes, fingers, etc. But I firmlly believe that if you are good in a restricted enviroment, you will be even better in an unrestricted enviorment. A lot of people counter saying that the sparing teaches you to not use the deadly techniques (eye gouges, fingers, groin, etc). But I counter that most people are not really doing these in non sparing enviorments and thus still not trained to properly use them.

The real problem with sparing for most people is they look at it as a concpet of winning and losing and they are afraid to 'lose'. Some are afraid to look bad, some are afraid to hurt others, some are afraid they might get hurt. Of course there are thoughs who use the reason that O'Sensei did not want competition in his art. But sparing is not competition. Obviously aikido is not about contest, but for you to learn to take the balance of a person in a real conflict, you need as close to real resistance as you can get. (In my opinion)

And that's my turn at devils advocate for the day.

- Don
"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough" - Albert Einstein
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Old 06-23-2006, 07:25 AM   #1036
DonMagee
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Grant Wagar wrote:
Defending yourself against someone without hurting the attacker is a hell of a lot harder than defending yourself aganst them without concern for their saftey.
I just wanted to quote that last part again. It's very very true. It is only easy when you outclass your opponent.

- Don
"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough" - Albert Einstein
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Old 06-23-2006, 07:45 AM   #1037
dps
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Don Magee wrote:
The real secret to making anything work is to seek to take your opponents balance.
What effect does physically unbalancing your opponent have on their mind? I am not sure if I am asking this in the right way but, is our physical balance a basic need to survival that we will try to maintain at the cost of not so important needs or wants.
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Old 06-23-2006, 07:57 AM   #1038
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Good question. I dont know the answer. What I do know is I have never met a person that can attack effectivly while off balance. Without balance you can't throw a hard punch or kick, you can't prevent yourself from being thrown, and you can't throw anyone yourself (unless of course they give up their balance in the act of throwing you). I'd say on the untrained person balance is a basic survival instinct. As you get trained you learn how to deal with fear and learn that there are things you can do while falling down. Judo guys are good at this, they can work reversals and twist and turn themselves to prevent landing in ippon. Its just a matter of getting comfortable with it like anything else.

So a person could ignore their loss of balance to continue their attack, but they are going to be very ineffective and if the loss of balance goes to far, they are going to fall down. I think it is safe to say that without balance there can be no good attacks. This is why I get frustrated at new people who play the martial arts chess game. You show them something slowly and that gives them time to keep their balance and they will say "Couldn't I just punch you here, or arn't you open for this here". They dont understand that when you actually do the technique full speed that even if they do throw the punch it is of very little concern to me. Usually some friendly sparing shows them.

- Don
"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough" - Albert Einstein
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Old 06-23-2006, 07:59 AM   #1039
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
I just wanted to quote that last part again. It's very very true. It is only easy when you outclass your opponent.
Exactly. Easier for a grown man or woman to defend themselves against a teenager, much more difficult than against someone their own "class" for lack of a better word.

It's easy to forget that the goal of aikido is to protect both the defender AND the attacker. Makes applying aikido on the street way more tricky.

Quote:
What effect does physically unbalancing your opponent have on their mind?
Perhaps when you physically unbalance someone they loose their consintration/train of thought and focus?
They go from wanting to hurt you to a more self preservation mode and they focus on getting their balance back?
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Old 06-23-2006, 08:18 AM   #1040
dps
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Thank You Don,
That was an excellent answer. "Couldn't I just punch you here, or arn't you open for this here". That brings back memories of when I first started.
Quote:
Grant Wagar wrote:
They go from wanting to hurt you to a more self preservation mode and they focus on getting their balance back?
Thank You.
The way you said it is closer to what I was thinking than what I wrote.
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Old 06-23-2006, 08:21 AM   #1041
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Don Magee wrote:
This is why I get frustrated at new people who play the martial arts chess game. You show them something slowly and that gives them time to keep their balance and they will say "Couldn't I just punch you here, or arn't you open for this here". They dont understand that when you actually do the technique full speed that even if they do throw the punch it is of very little concern to me. Usually some friendly sparing shows them.

I think this should be a primer for every martial artist when at a seminar or learning something new for the first time.

Last edited by Budd : 06-23-2006 at 08:29 AM.
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Old 06-23-2006, 08:23 AM   #1042
dps
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Don Magee wrote:
As you get trained you learn how to deal with fear and learn that there are things you can do while falling down.
Could you say that balance and fear are two main principles Aikido.
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Old 06-23-2006, 09:42 AM   #1043
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
David Skaggs wrote:
Could you say that balance and fear are two main principles Aikido.
I would say only the balance really matters. The fear is inconsequential (I hope I spelled that right). It does not matter if they are afraid to fall down or not. The only thing that matters is the must recover their balance to launch an effective attack. I think taking someone's balance or letting them give up their balance is the most important core element you can learn in any martial art. I think this is even more important in aikido because of how percise the techniques must be in order to work. I really didnt' start understanding this until judo. This is because a lot of my partners in aikido would 'give it to me'. In judo I found out the hardware as I got counter-thrown every time I tried a throw until I learned how to properly take my partner's balance. Now I apply this to every aspect of my martial arts training. It doens't matter if it is bjj, judo, aikido, boxing, or a tickle fight with my wife.

- Don
"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough" - Albert Einstein
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Old 06-23-2006, 10:18 AM   #1044
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Don Magee wrote:
It doens't matter if it is bjj, judo, aikido, boxing, or a tickle fight with my wife.
The true Way of Harmony.
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Old 06-24-2006, 12:57 PM   #1045
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Good points about it's more important to take the attacker's balance than anything else.

And it's quite true that nothing hits harder than the ground, as a poster stated above.

The biggest problem many critics of Aikido have with it is that they never get to 'see' it pulled off an an untrained person.

If a really good Aikidoka pulled a full power, no-holding-back-whatsoever breath throw on an attacker who came at him full speed, full power (which is the only kind of 'demo' these critics would accept as authentic) and that attacker is untrained in ukemi, the chances of the attacker getting seriously injured are greatly multiplied.

We live in a culture where people sue others for minor bumps and bruises. What will happen if some guy gets thrown hard with a shiho-nage, lands wrong and separates his shoulder?

The fact is, by it's very devastating nature, Aikido has to be done slowly and gently with untrained people, this is why all the 'hey man show me your aikido - gee that's weak and slow' criticisms are missing the point.

Not that many people are competent enough to do many Aikido techniques on someone else full power with no holding back to begin with.

First they have to have the technical skill and the physical ability and then on top of that they need a highly trained uke to practice with.

Most Aikidoka don't reach that level, either technically, physically, or training-partner wise.

When you are involved in a martial art involving manipulation of joints, joint locks, and throws that send the other person's entire body flying through the air, there are going to be plenty of checks and balances before you reach a level where you can go full speed, all out, holding nothing back on a training partner who is skilled enough to take your high-level full power Aikido and get up unhurt.

So instances where a BJJ asks an Aikidoka to 'prove' to him that Aikido would work since the BJJ guy has no training in ukemi, if the Aikidoka accepts this challenge, mentally he realizes he's got an untrained person here, going full power and all out is automatically out of bounds.

Face it, a martial art that teaches it's students at the highest levels to take an attacker's entire body and slam it to the floor with incredible force or to lock up joints and take people down hard doesn't translate itself well to "Let me go half speed here and not really go full power so I don't hurt you, Ok?"

Unless it two Aikidoka who have reached a high level of proficiency at both the technique and receiving ukemi, there will always be holding back, not going as fast or as hard as they really could.

And when Aikidoka try to 'prove' to untrained people who have no ukemi skill that Aikido 'works' the first thing these people sense is that.........the Aikidoka is holding back.

manofaiki
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Old 06-24-2006, 04:41 PM   #1046
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
wrote:
I have competed in both boxing and wrestling and I am now training in brazilian Jiu-Jitsu. I have watched many No Holds Barred competitions, like the UFC, and it is clear to me that Aikido and it's techniques and it's way of training do not prepare anyone to actually fight. I know that Aikido practitioners talk a lot about concepts like spirituality, harmony...etc. but I also hear people talk about how it is a pratical means of self defense. Aikido does not have practical striking techniques or any REAL matwork at all. I would like to know how Aikido can be used as self defense if you cannot grapple or strike.
There is no good response to a thought like this. I don't even see this leading to a constructive conversation unless someone changes the subject.

Besides, I can say
Quote:
Boxing, wrestling, and BJJ are useless in real life. I now train in "PullMyFinger" (M16A2 Carbine .223 with scope mount) and MMA is useless against it.
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Old 06-24-2006, 05:20 PM   #1047
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Brian Cates wrote:
Good points about it's more important to take the attacker's balance than anything else.

And it's quite true that nothing hits harder than the ground, as a poster stated above.

The biggest problem many critics of Aikido have with it is that they never get to 'see' it pulled off an an untrained person.

If a really good Aikidoka pulled a full power, no-holding-back-whatsoever breath throw on an attacker who came at him full speed, full power (which is the only kind of 'demo' these critics would accept as authentic) and that attacker is untrained in ukemi, the chances of the attacker getting seriously injured are greatly multiplied.

We live in a culture where people sue others for minor bumps and bruises. What will happen if some guy gets thrown hard with a shiho-nage, lands wrong and separates his shoulder?

The fact is, by it's very devastating nature, Aikido has to be done slowly and gently with untrained people, this is why all the 'hey man show me your aikido - gee that's weak and slow' criticisms are missing the point.

Not that many people are competent enough to do many Aikido techniques on someone else full power with no holding back to begin with.

First they have to have the technical skill and the physical ability and then on top of that they need a highly trained uke to practice with.

Most Aikidoka don't reach that level, either technically, physically, or training-partner wise.

When you are involved in a martial art involving manipulation of joints, joint locks, and throws that send the other person's entire body flying through the air, there are going to be plenty of checks and balances before you reach a level where you can go full speed, all out, holding nothing back on a training partner who is skilled enough to take your high-level full power Aikido and get up unhurt.

So instances where a BJJ asks an Aikidoka to 'prove' to him that Aikido would work since the BJJ guy has no training in ukemi, if the Aikidoka accepts this challenge, mentally he realizes he's got an untrained person here, going full power and all out is automatically out of bounds.

Face it, a martial art that teaches it's students at the highest levels to take an attacker's entire body and slam it to the floor with incredible force or to lock up joints and take people down hard doesn't translate itself well to "Let me go half speed here and not really go full power so I don't hurt you, Ok?"

Unless it two Aikidoka who have reached a high level of proficiency at both the technique and receiving ukemi, there will always be holding back, not going as fast or as hard as they really could.

And when Aikidoka try to 'prove' to untrained people who have no ukemi skill that Aikido 'works' the first thing these people sense is that.........the Aikidoka is holding back.

manofaiki
I just wanted to point out that everyone I know who trains in bjj learns forward and backwards rolls, front, side, and back breakfalls. They can take any throw you want to put on them. In fact I've seen bjj guys that take falls better that judo guys (Because they dont concentrate so much on not landing in ippon but rather landing in a good defendable position). Yet, I constantly hear from my judo instructor and my aikido instructor about how they dont know how to fall. (Which I find funny because they compliment my falls, and the guys at my bjj club fall just as well as I do). Maybe this is exclusive to my club, but I doubt it. Especially with all the ex-judo guys I see at bjj competitions. They are not going to take a nice looking roll out of your attack, but if you throw them, you can expect a good breakfall and continued action until you get them to tap.

- Don
"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough" - Albert Einstein
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Old 06-24-2006, 10:10 PM   #1048
statisticool
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Drew Nichols wrote:
Have you ever tried to grab someone's wrist or fingers in an actual altercation? It's kinda hard.
In gloved not-real-life-matches with rules that say to not grab fingers, I can see how grabbing fingers could be difficult.

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"Let your weight from the crotch area BE in his hands."
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Old 06-25-2006, 12:51 PM   #1049
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Cats know how to fall, unless you drop them from a high enough a height

I remember watching some guy from the crowd step into a cage and KO the professional fighter.

There are too many variables at hand to decide what will work and what won't.
Skill of the attacker, skill of the defender, survival instinct, aggression of the attacker, the all important luck.
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Old 06-25-2006, 05:57 PM   #1050
mathewjgano
 
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Grant Wagar wrote:
Cats know how to fall, unless you drop them from a high enough a height
I remember learning that a cat is less likely to hurt itself from a slightly higher height than a lower one, even though both heights were somewhat significant. After a certain amount of time the cat relaxes and is able to absorb more impact with less damage to bones. I think it had to do with animals falling from roof-tops or something like that.

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