Welcome to AikiWeb Aikido Information
AikiWeb: The Source for Aikido Information
AikiWeb's principal purpose is to serve the Internet community as a repository and dissemination point for aikido information.

Sections
home
aikido articles
columns

Discussions
forums
aikiblogs

Databases
dojo search
seminars
image gallery
supplies
links directory

Reviews
book reviews
video reviews
dvd reviews
equip. reviews

News
submit
archive

Miscellaneous
newsletter
rss feeds
polls
about

Follow us on



Home > AikiWeb Aikido Forums
Go Back   AikiWeb Aikido Forums > Techniques

Hello and thank you for visiting AikiWeb, the world's most active online Aikido community! This site is home to over 22,000 aikido practitioners from around the world and covers a wide range of aikido topics including techniques, philosophy, history, humor, beginner issues, the marketplace, and more.

If you wish to join in the discussions or use the other advanced features available, you will need to register first. Registration is absolutely free and takes only a few minutes to complete so sign up today!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 11-08-2009, 08:01 AM   #1
kokyu
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 283
Hong Kong
Offline
Escaping ushiro ryotedori

Recently, I witnessed different initial footwork and arm movements in ushiro ryotedori

My first exposure to ushiro ryotedori can be seen in Yamada Sensei's demonstration here (technique starts at 4:40)

Ushiro ryotedori kotegaeshi 1

(Note how both hands come up as Yamada Sensei steps out)

If I understand correctly, the double hand lift is mainly to off-balance uke by making him overextend forward

Then, I've also seen the following:

Ushiro tekubi tori kotagaeshi

(Note how one hand comes up while the other stays at tori's hips)

The second method appears to rely more on using body movement to swing uke to the side, and extending the hand on the forward leg to escape on the other side. It seems to extend the idea of tenchi nage, where uke's energy is split before tori steps out of the grip.

This second method also seems quite popular, but I *am curious* who started this style of movement, as it does not appear in the usual texts

Would also be really interested to hear everyone's views and experience on different ways of moving and getting out of ushiro ryotedori or tekubutori
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2009, 09:55 AM   #2
Abasan
Dojo: Aiki Shoshinkan, Aiki Kenkyukai
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 813
Malaysia
Offline
Re: Escaping ushiro ryotedori

The 1st method is a beginning method. There a few ways of doing it and this is perhaps the most common for aikikai. Certainly in shinshintoitsu I've seen 2 other beginning method which really involves the direction that nage moves towards.

The 2nd method looks like he was trying for kino nagare. Here the problem for beginners would be that they will try to go for the hand below and also rely too much on the 'atemi' from the raised hand. In this method if awase hasn't been achieved, kuzushi won't be there. And if kuzushi isn't there, nage is liable to get hit from the quite centered uke. As to how it extends from tenchi nage... hmm well, only if nage is doing aiki age on the up hand and aiki sage on the down hand I suppose. I didn't see it here though.

Since you're also interested in other ways. Another way in shinshintoitsu will take place if uke has nage's hands behind his back. There instead of bring the hands forward and up, nage leaves it behind and bring his hands together by moving his hips in hanmi. One of nage's hands grab uke's wrist. From there he moves uke with his center and swings him around and executes kotegaishe.

Draw strength from stillness. Learn to act without acting. And never underestimate a samurai cat.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2009, 10:18 AM   #3
ChrisHein
 
ChrisHein's Avatar
Dojo: Aikido of Fresno
Location: Fresno , CA
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,628
United_States
Offline
Re: Escaping ushiro ryotedori

Saito Sensei has a whole series from ushiro ryote, with several different variations. I don't have the time to find the video clip at the moment, but I'm sure if this post sticks around it will pop up.

I think Ueshiba did lots of different things, and you'll see slightly different variations of all escapes from different teachers depending on what phase he was in when that teacher studied with him.

Also because of the technical similarities between Aikido and many Koryu Jujutsu you'll see plenty of cross-overs. It'd be pretty hard to pin down exactly where this variation originates from.

  Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2009, 02:42 PM   #4
sorokod
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 582
United Kingdom
Offline
Re: Escaping ushiro ryotedori

Popping up... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFNB4EcmfNw#t=0m51s

There are quite a few of ushiro techniques in that video

  Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2009, 08:24 PM   #5
tim evans
Dojo: USAF
Location: cincinnati/ohio
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 187
United_States
Offline
Re: Escaping ushiro ryotedori

We have been doing a lot of ushiro waza but the dynamic version is the most difficult anyone know of a video on this.

one of the "corn fed boys"
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2009, 06:42 AM   #6
kokyu
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 283
Hong Kong
Offline
Re: Escaping ushiro ryotedori

Quote:
Ahmad Abas wrote: View Post
As to how it extends from tenchi nage... hmm well, only if nage is doing aiki age on the up hand and aiki sage on the down hand I suppose. I didn't see it here though.
Not quite tenchi nage... but here is an example of splitting uke's energy with the same technique

Ushiro tekubi tori kokyunage

Quote:
Ahmad Abas wrote: View Post
The 2nd method looks like he was trying for kino nagare
I thought you could go for ki no nagare in the first method as well

Yamada Sensei

... But I think the 'one-hand' method works well when uke is smaller then you, as explained here

Wedell Sensei

Quote:
Ahmad Abas wrote: View Post
Since you're also interested in other ways. Another way in shinshintoitsu will take place if uke has nage's hands behind his back.
I've seen this one before... and since I started Aikido in Shinshintoitsu, I believe the basic method is to scoop the hands in front (palms up), and then swing the hands around at the top (palms down) while shifting to one side.

There's also this interesting footwork, with the foot shifting immediately to one side

Tamura Sensei - Ki Society
  Reply With Quote

Please visit our sponsor:

AikiWeb Sponsored Links - Place your Aikido link here for only $10!



Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Seminar with Ushiro Sensei (Ushiro Karatedo) 10-24 & 10-25 Marc Abrams Events Listings: Non-Aikido Martial Traditions 4 12-06-2009 03:51 PM
Seminar with Kenji Ushiro Sensei- Shindoryu Ushiro Karate Marc Abrams Events Listings: Non-Aikido Martial Traditions 2 05-19-2009 01:08 PM
English Version of "Karate and Ki" by Kenji Ushiro Sensei Marc Abrams Non-Aikido Martial Traditions 18 01-22-2009 07:28 AM
Kenji Ushiro Sensei Seminar - May 2008 Marc Abrams Events Listings: Non-Aikido Martial Traditions 11 05-13-2008 03:21 PM
Ushiro Ryotedori Iriminage Ki no Nagare Greg Jennings Techniques 23 08-06-2001 10:35 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:11 AM.



vBulletin Copyright © 2000-2014 Jelsoft Enterprises Limited
----------
Copyright 1997-2014 AikiWeb and its Authors, All Rights Reserved.
----------
For questions and comments about this website:
Send E-mail
plainlaid-picaresque outchasing-protistan explicantia-altarage seaford-stellionate