Welcome to AikiWeb Aikido Information
AikiWeb: The Source for Aikido Information
AikiWeb's principal purpose is to serve the Internet community as a repository and dissemination point for aikido information.

Sections
home
aikido articles
columns

Discussions
forums
aikiblogs

Databases
dojo search
seminars
image gallery
supplies
links directory

Reviews
book reviews
video reviews
dvd reviews
equip. reviews

News
submit
archive

Miscellaneous
newsletter
rss feeds
polls
about

Follow us on



Home > AikiWeb Aikido Forums
Go Back   AikiWeb Aikido Forums > General

Hello and thank you for visiting AikiWeb, the world's most active online Aikido community! This site is home to over 22,000 aikido practitioners from around the world and covers a wide range of aikido topics including techniques, philosophy, history, humor, beginner issues, the marketplace, and more.

If you wish to join in the discussions or use the other advanced features available, you will need to register first. Registration is absolutely free and takes only a few minutes to complete so sign up today!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 05-17-2014, 08:49 AM   #26
RonRagusa
Location: Massachusetts
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 680
United_States
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

Quote:
Joe Curran wrote: View Post
I take it that you have experience of being Uke for Kanaya Sensei?Maybe you might care to share your experiences with others on this Forum? All the Best, Joe A.K.A Doubting Thomas.
Sorry Joe, I do not have any experience with Kanaya Sensei. I have, over the years, experienced others who display an amount of power that seems out of proportion relative to size and muscle mass. People who are able to apply power and control that requires very little in the way of movement. I would add that I don't buy into the whole no touch, action-at-a-distance throwing thing. I'm not sure what ideas or principles are being demonstrated, but none of that stuff has ever been applied to me by anyone I have ever trained under or with.

'Nuf said, off to class.

Ron

  Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2014, 09:03 PM   #27
NagaBaba
 
NagaBaba's Avatar
Location: Wild, deep, deadly North
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,148
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

Quote:
Joe Curran wrote: View Post
Dear Naga Baba,
Did you not perceive the exceptional Ki power shown here?The flow of Ki made Niagara Falls look like a tap that needed a new washer. Uke could have given a display of a one man aikido demo .Great stuff, all done with not a bead of sweat or a hair out of place.How is this feat done I ask myself?If anyone cares to tell me how this skill can be acquired send your replies to me on a 20$ note.Credit card donations not accepted. Cheers, Joe.
Hi Joe,
Now when talk about it....new washer could do a job

Nagababa

ask for divine protection Ame no Murakumo Kuki Samuhara no Ryuo
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2014, 09:08 PM   #28
NagaBaba
 
NagaBaba's Avatar
Location: Wild, deep, deadly North
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,148
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

Quote:
Cliff Judge wrote: View Post
Do you guys feel the same way about Osensei when you watch him on video? Really seems like the same kinda thing to me, not a demonstration of "what I can do" but rather a demonstration of "the movement of aiki" or something like that. Something more abstract.
No.
Once you practice enough, you can distinguish easily pretenders.

Nagababa

ask for divine protection Ame no Murakumo Kuki Samuhara no Ryuo
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2014, 08:15 PM   #29
Cliff Judge
Dojo: Aikido Shobukan Dojo
Location: Columbia, MD
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 993
United_States
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

Quote:
Szczepan Janczuk wrote: View Post
No.
Once you practice enough, you can distinguish easily pretenders.
So when a teacher has enough magical Aikido power they can make an uke do a big deep back bend that is impossible for them to resist? Because all good demos involve uke actively resisting the teacher's technique?
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2014, 06:04 AM   #30
sakumeikan
Dojo: Sakumeikan N.E. Aikkai .Newcastle upon Tyne.
Location: Newcastle upon Tyne
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,162
United Kingdom
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

Quote:
Cliff Judge wrote: View Post
So when a teacher has enough magical Aikido power they can make an uke do a big deep back bend that is impossible for them to resist? Because all good demos involve uke actively resisting the teacher's technique?
Hi Cliff,
If indeed the Uke {prior to applying his acrobatic skills] is actively endeavouring to maintain his balance it would appear the answer to both your questions is Yes.I must confess however that I still view this video with increasing scepticism.Cheers, Joe
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2014, 08:47 AM   #31
Cliff Judge
Dojo: Aikido Shobukan Dojo
Location: Columbia, MD
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 993
United_States
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

Quote:
Joe Curran wrote: View Post
Hi Cliff,
If indeed the Uke {prior to applying his acrobatic skills] is actively endeavouring to maintain his balance it would appear the answer to both your questions is Yes.I must confess however that I still view this video with increasing scepticism.Cheers, Joe
I don't believe I have seen many demos that are good by your definition, including Osensei.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2014, 08:54 AM   #32
jonreading
 
jonreading's Avatar
Dojo: Aikido South (formerly Emory Aikikai)
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 897
United_States
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

Ryne Sandberg (Hall of Fame second baseman for the Chicago Cubs), once said that he could move on the play when the pitcher threw the ball. He could tell by the location of the pitch and the position of the swing where the hit ball was going.

I am not unfamiliar with the feeling of oppression by good aikido that directs movement. I would tend to agree that I was unable to see some of the queues that would indicate aiki as I understand it, or the power to solicit compliance. Not to say it doesn't exist, but it is not easy to find if it does.

I have a history of complaining about aikido videos and I'll continue my complaint here. This video represents one of two things: 1. a level of aiki so high as to be practically invisible to observe; 2. the absence of aiki and thus invisible. I am giving the benefit of doubt to say Kanaya Shihan has some experience with aiki.

If the level of aiki is so high as not to be observed by video, why record it? This is more a criticism of the format in which the video is intended to be deceiving (a magic trick). Couple that with an uke who is cooperatively providing energy and the demo is more magic show and less practical. For someone who has been on the receiving end of sensei, that is fine; for the remaining 99.98% of us, we have a video with a trick and no education to recreate the trick ourselves..

Aiki does crazy stupid things and makes what we do look unreal. Videos that do not support a logical methodology of observing the cause of stupidity, or reproducing the stupidity are limited in their role as an educational tool.

Back to the question, sometimes it is entertaining to publish something like this - it is not intended to contain educational material, nor is it intended to persuade viewers of it truthfulness. In fact, part of the mystery is not knowing. Why else would we watch Chris Angel eat a scorpion and then pull it out of his pants pocket?

The original post did not publish any information about the purpose of the video, possibly for a reason. I think if we knew the intention of the video, we could possibly be more critical in providing feedback. I'm up for a good mystery anytime, but it's nice to know if I am looking at a mystery...

  Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2014, 09:26 AM   #33
Cliff Judge
Dojo: Aikido Shobukan Dojo
Location: Columbia, MD
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 993
United_States
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

What if this demo has nothing to do with the teacher demonstrating what he can compel someone to do? What if the uke is not only being compliant, but is being as compliant as he possibly can - which is quite a feat, actually, I don't think I could bend back as far as he does in some places here.

is it that we don't like to see demonstrations that are not application, or do we not understand what they are?
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2014, 10:41 AM   #34
jonreading
 
jonreading's Avatar
Dojo: Aikido South (formerly Emory Aikikai)
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 897
United_States
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

Quote:
Cliff Judge wrote: View Post
What if this demo has nothing to do with the teacher demonstrating what he can compel someone to do? What if the uke is not only being compliant, but is being as compliant as he possibly can - which is quite a feat, actually, I don't think I could bend back as far as he does in some places here.

is it that we don't like to see demonstrations that are not application, or do we not understand what they are?
In my last sentence, I mentioned that I like a mystery when that genre meets my expectation. If I were to watch a romantic comedy when I expected to see a mystery I would probably be disappointed in a similar vein. Worse, if it was a movie with Kate Hudson or Drew Berrymore. Seriously.

For me, the off-putting thing about this video collection is the absence of perspective and expectation. I don't think the demonstration is the issue, it's the lack of perspective in which to frame the demonstration. For example, if your ascertaining that this video is actually an athletic display of ukemi, then the expectation shifts from demonstrating aiki to demonstrating ukemi and the need to express and demonstrate aiki is less important, possibly explaining the perception that some posts have observed.

To your second question, if education is not the intention, how could you hold a viewer to the expectation of understanding the material? This is exactly how a magic trick works, right? A magic trick is based on ignorance of the viewer, not complexity of the trick. It is that we do not understand what is being conveyed.

Nolan Ryan was the greatest pitcher to play baseball. But if I were to illustrate his career from the perspective of his batting average that would portray a different picture. I am waiting to see what picture the demo is trying to paint before deciding the effectiveness of it.

  Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2014, 06:02 PM   #35
sakumeikan
Dojo: Sakumeikan N.E. Aikkai .Newcastle upon Tyne.
Location: Newcastle upon Tyne
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,162
United Kingdom
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

Quote:
Carsten Möllering wrote: View Post
There are some teachers around who could help you answer your question. Yamashima sensei, Endō sensei or Ikeda sensei e.g., all visit Europe on a regular base so you might be able to grab one of them.

But as far as I know, this guy has a profound background in Iwama ryū and used to practice with the late Saito sensei? So maybe first you should find some qualified teacher of Iwama ryū to work on the basics for some years ...

Looks familiar.
Dear Carsten,Your suggestion that I should seek out an Iwama Ryu instructor to help me learn the basics for a few years is advice well meant by your goodself. However I have trained under Shihan like Shibata, Murashige, Kanai,Tamura,Miyamoto , Kanetsuka, Yamaguchi , and other Shihan such asJuba Nour Bill Smith, Tony Cassells, Chris Mooney , Mike Flynn,Terry Ezra, GordonJones.etc .You might know a few of these sensei???My main teacher over the last 4 decades has been Chiba Sensei.Thanks for your advice , however as I am a 6th Dan Shihan,[not self promoted by the way ]I think I will give your suggestion a miss thank you very much.Cheers, Joe.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2014, 06:18 PM   #36
sakumeikan
Dojo: Sakumeikan N.E. Aikkai .Newcastle upon Tyne.
Location: Newcastle upon Tyne
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,162
United Kingdom
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

[quote=Cliff Judge;337088]I don't believe I have seen many demos that are good by your definition, including Osensei.[/QUOTE
Dear Cliff,
How do you know what my definition of a good demo is? I assume you like the Kanaya Sensei demo.Thats ok by me. i have on the basis of a video stated it is not my cup of tea.I also stated if you have taken time to read my comments regarding this demo, I said that the only way you could really tell would be to experience the Waza in a hands on situation.We can only speculate whether the Aikido herein is genuine.We cannot be absolute here unless we/you /I have personal direct experience .I could be wrong in my own assessment of the video.Cheers, Joe.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2014, 05:39 AM   #37
Carsten Möllering
 
Carsten Möllering's Avatar
Dojo: Hildesheimer Aikido Verein
Location: Hildesheim
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 847
Germany
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

Quote:
Joe Curran wrote: View Post
However I have trained under Shihan like ...
I know.
Quote:
My main teacher over the last 4 decades has been Chiba Sensei.
I'm aware of that.
Quote:
... I am a 6th Dan Shihan,...
Yes. I know.

Quote:
I think I will give your suggestion a miss ...
I didn't expext, you would and didn't mean my advice too serious ...

... well ...

I never practiced with this teacher. But as I said, I think I recognize a lot of what he is doing. I remember Ikeda Hiroshi sensei teaching similar guiding-before-pyhsical-contact-stuff. The third video shows some of the basic exercises, Endō sensei teaches. (And wich I try to teach in my classes.) Guiding and controlling uke by weird and playfull ways of contact I remember as a speciality of Yamashima sensei.

Also when I read, that Kanaya sensei originally was a committed student of Iwama ryū and used to practice with Saito sensei and only after having practiced this for a period of time changed to a more soft understanding of keiko, this remembered me of the biography of my sempai, our shihan - and also me myself: Studying clear basics for a long time. And then changing to a certain, more soft way, that is built on those basics.

So, when you asked "How is this feat done ...?" I felt 'provoked' to answer you - with a wink.
No offence ...

Last edited by Carsten Möllering : 05-20-2014 at 05:49 AM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2014, 08:14 AM   #38
sakumeikan
Dojo: Sakumeikan N.E. Aikkai .Newcastle upon Tyne.
Location: Newcastle upon Tyne
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,162
United Kingdom
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

Quote:
Carsten Möllering wrote: View Post
I know.
I'm aware of that.
Yes. I know.

I didn't expext, you would and didn't mean my advice too serious ...

... well ...

I never practiced with this teacher. But as I said, I think I recognize a lot of what he is doing. I remember Ikeda Hiroshi sensei teaching similar guiding-before-pyhsical-contact-stuff. The third video shows some of the basic exercises, Endō sensei teaches. (And wich I try to teach in my classes.) Guiding and controlling uke by weird and playfull ways of contact I remember as a speciality of Yamashima sensei.

Also when I read, that Kanaya sensei originally was a committed student of Iwama ryū and used to practice with Saito sensei and only after having practiced this for a period of time changed to a more soft understanding of keiko, this remembered me of the biography of my sempai, our shihan - and also me myself: Studying clear basics for a long time. And then changing to a certain, more soft way, that is built on those basics.

So, when you asked "How is this feat done ...?" I felt 'provoked' to answer you - with a wink.
No offence ...
Dear Carsten,
In my reply to you I was being a little naughty.I decided to post the info [which I already knew you knew ] to have a little dig at you.Not in a malicious way I hasten to ad, just a bit of fun.In no way was your advice [Iwama Ryu bit ] offensive .I knew your were pulling my leg.
As it happens , perhaps due to the my maturity [age related] I am no longer the proverbial bull in the china shop.When I was much younger I was not averse to using what physical power I had.Now I try and get the same result being less energetic and I tend to find I need to become more efficient rather than rely on sheer brute force.I can understand this may well be the motivation of Kanaya Sensei.It would be good to find out more of his thoughts on the subject if possible.
So Carsten, have a nice day,Cheers, Joe.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2014, 04:34 PM   #39
Chris Raihl
 
Chris Raihl's Avatar
Location: Foster City, CA
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 12
United_States
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

Sorry for my level of ignorance; but if this student of Iwama Ryu has these abilities, and if said abilities can be learned; why have we not seen Morihiro Saito Sensei demonstrate them? Or are we to assume this sensei has somehow surpassed the skill of Saito Sensei and that of Witt Sensei?

Respectfully

Chris

  Reply With Quote
Old 05-22-2014, 10:43 AM   #40
hughrbeyer
Dojo: Shobu Aikido of Boston
Location: Peterborough, NH
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 653
United_States
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

Would it be surprising, or terrible, if he had? We should all strive to surpass our teachers...

Evolution doesn't prove God doesn't exist, any more than hammers prove carpenters don't exist.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-22-2014, 10:47 AM   #41
Cliff Judge
Dojo: Aikido Shobukan Dojo
Location: Columbia, MD
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 993
United_States
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

What if he is not demonstrating "abilities." What if Saito Sensei was not really doing that either?
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-22-2014, 11:12 AM   #42
Carsten Möllering
 
Carsten Möllering's Avatar
Dojo: Hildesheimer Aikido Verein
Location: Hildesheim
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 847
Germany
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

I think this is simply about changing one's way of practice, not about surpassing someone.

As I repeatedly said, I don't see any "magical" abilities here, no mysteries. He is not throwing ki-balls or something like that. He is simply guiding uke by moving himself. Also these no-touch things are only a small part of what is shown in the video.

Alltogether I have to admit, I don't see why this is such an issue here? I know stuff like this simply as one aspect of what is taught by a whole lot of teachers.
Is this really so unusual for some of you - even for those whoe are practicing for such a long time ... - or am I getting something wrong?

As far as uke is concerned: There are certain teachers and schools who teach ukemi by bridging. Over here this is especially popular within the Tendōryū. And there are simply some aikidōka who like to do ukemi this way. I myself don't think this to be a clever position. So I think, it is not something tori does, but a certain way this uke reacts. No miracle here also.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-22-2014, 11:15 AM   #43
Chris Raihl
 
Chris Raihl's Avatar
Location: Foster City, CA
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 12
United_States
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

So far the response has been as follows;

1/ It is possible he surpassed Saito Sensei and other esteemed 7th Dan Shihans

2/ Nothing unusual here - throwing someone who has intent for harm without touching is usual and not a big deal.

Ok I got it now, sorry for my ignorance.

Respectfully

Chris

  Reply With Quote
Old 05-22-2014, 01:14 PM   #44
Cliff Judge
Dojo: Aikido Shobukan Dojo
Location: Columbia, MD
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 993
United_States
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

Quote:
Carsten Möllering wrote: View Post
Alltogether I have to admit, I don't see why this is such an issue here? I know stuff like this simply as one aspect of what is taught by a whole lot of teachers.
Is this really so unusual for some of you - even for those whoe are practicing for such a long time ... - or am I getting something wrong?

As far as uke is concerned: There are certain teachers and schools who teach ukemi by bridging. Over here this is especially popular within the Tendōryū. And there are simply some aikidōka who like to do ukemi this way. I myself don't think this to be a clever position. So I think, it is not something tori does, but a certain way this uke reacts. No miracle here also.
As I have said a couple of times in this thread, I think this kind of demo is about showing something abstract. A technique executed at speed may look like a very linear application of force, while the teacher is actually doing something subtle, so they slow everything down and expand it out so you can see that it's a rather more helical movement. Unless the teacher explicitly states that they are showing an application that should work on an unwilling partner, I assume it is not a demonstration of an application.

And the students, I think, cluelessly believe the teacher is demonstrating a skill, or something that can be "made to happen" without the cooperation of an uke. So then further down the line they naturally believe their teacher can actually do these things, while other teachers making the same type of demo are fake. Perhaps the teachers do or don't help this delusional process along by sucking up the admiration or just refusing to actually tell the students that.

Another problem is that there is a matter of degrees here. What is the difference between allowing your instructor to bend you all the way backwards when you could probably try to roll or turn away, and kicking your feet up into the air so you go flying at the end of a kote-gaeshi or irimi-nage, when you might be able to do something else that would allow you to keep your posture? Why hold on to a wrist that you know is going to perform a technique?
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-22-2014, 01:30 PM   #45
NagaBaba
 
NagaBaba's Avatar
Location: Wild, deep, deadly North
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,148
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

Quote:
Christopher Raihl wrote: View Post
2/ Nothing unusual here - throwing someone who has intent for harm without touching is usual and not a big deal.

Ok I got it now, sorry for my ignorance.
There is no intent to harm. No intent exist here at all....

Nagababa

ask for divine protection Ame no Murakumo Kuki Samuhara no Ryuo
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-22-2014, 01:50 PM   #46
Cliff Judge
Dojo: Aikido Shobukan Dojo
Location: Columbia, MD
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 993
United_States
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

Quote:
Szczepan Janczuk wrote: View Post
There is no intent to harm. No intent exist here at all....
Nor in any martial arts training that sane people engage in.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-22-2014, 02:29 PM   #47
Chris Raihl
 
Chris Raihl's Avatar
Location: Foster City, CA
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 12
United_States
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

As we are splitting hairs allow me to correct myself please;

I should have used the term " train with Vigor" or "train with intent" ( as in intent to teach, intent to learn, intent to be taught etc")

Respectfully

Chris

  Reply With Quote
Old 05-22-2014, 03:17 PM   #48
Cliff Judge
Dojo: Aikido Shobukan Dojo
Location: Columbia, MD
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 993
United_States
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

Quote:
Christopher Raihl wrote: View Post
I should have used the term " train with Vigor" or "train with intent" ( as in intent to teach, intent to learn, intent to be taught etc")
Well I agree that I don't see a lot of vigor in these videos. Is it always necessary for the instructor to demonstrate with vigor, do you think, or is it ever okay to slow things down and do them with larger movements if you've got something you want to teach?
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-2014, 09:28 AM   #49
hughrbeyer
Dojo: Shobu Aikido of Boston
Location: Peterborough, NH
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 653
United_States
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

I'm reminded of the story about O-Sensei doing a demo and choosing a high-ranked student to be uke, and that student deciding that attacking sincerely meant attacking full-force, with everything he had. The result being that O-Sensei had to do his techniques for real, and he later bawled the uke out because he wasn't able to show things the way he wanted to show them.

So even O-Sensei, apparently, was interested in showing aspects of his art which were hard or impossible to see in a (more) real self-defense situation. The attacks had to be dialed back a bit in order for him to show them.

Which suggests that in demos like the one in the OP, we shouldn't just be looking for street-fighting level of self defense. If the teacher is actually trying to show something, perhaps some level of collusion is necessary--even if the 'collusion' is just an agreement that the attacks will be less than full-on.

Evolution doesn't prove God doesn't exist, any more than hammers prove carpenters don't exist.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-2014, 11:39 AM   #50
sorokod
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 607
United Kingdom
Offline
Re: YouTube: Kanaya Hirotaka Shihan

Quote:
Which suggests that in demos like the one in the OP, we shouldn't just be looking for street-fighting level of self defense. If the teacher is actually trying to show something, perhaps some level of collusion is necessary--even if the 'collusion' is just an agreement that the attacks will be less than full-on.
With the general agreement that the demonstrated is not "street-fighting level of self defines", will not stop a burglar and, in my opinion, will not be able to subdue an upset toddler - what is being demonstrated? I am looking for something more substential then general statements about "principals" and "flow of energy".

  Reply With Quote

Please visit our sponsor:

Handmade Aikido Gifts - Handmade functional ceramic art with aikido themes



Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
YouTube: Hiroshi Tada Shihan - Rare Aikido Demonstration (1957) akiy General 2 11-20-2013 06:03 PM
YouTube: Mori Shihan Marie Noelle Fequiere General 14 09-03-2013 02:55 AM
Nishio Shihan on YouTube OwlMatt General 1 11-21-2010 01:00 AM
Fujita Shihan 8th Dan in the Philippines CitoMaramba Seminars 13 12-04-2009 08:54 AM
Aikido Scam by an Indian group ze'ev erlich General 10 08-02-2009 07:46 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:21 PM.



vBulletin Copyright © 2000-2014 Jelsoft Enterprises Limited
----------
Copyright 1997-2014 AikiWeb and its Authors, All Rights Reserved.
----------
For questions and comments about this website:
Send E-mail
plainlaid-picaresque outchasing-protistan explicantia-altarage seaford-stellionate