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Old 08-13-2002, 09:11 AM   #26
SeiserL
 
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The voice of experience and the voice of inexperience. We all choose where we participate and who will listen to. Things are as they are.

Until again,

Lynn

Lynn Seiser PhD
Yondan Aikido & FMA/JKD
We do not rise to the level of our expectations, but fall to the level of our training. Train well. KWATZ!
 
Old 08-13-2002, 09:29 AM   #27
akiy
 
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Quote:
Rachel Massey (rachmass) wrote:
It is important to keep our comments here respectful of one another and not start sniping at each other. Lets be mature and civil (me included).
Yes -- the first rule of the AikiWeb Forums is "Treat your fellow AikiWeb Forums members with respect." I won't mention names, but there are those in this thread who have clearly transgressed this most common sense of rules here.

If you are unable to share your thoughts here on the AikiWeb Forums respectfully, please find another venue for your words. Repeat offenders may find their account disabled without warning.

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Old 08-13-2002, 11:47 AM   #28
mike lee
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a point

Quote:
Ah, Mike...

I may be dense here, but if you have a point to make in your last few posts, would you please make it?
Many of my students were not even born when I began training in aikido. I began studying various forms of martial arts 10 years before I began aikido training in 1977 at the University of Wisconsin, receiving frequent instruction from Akira Tohei Shihan, among many others.

There are a small group of individuals on this forum who, for various reasons, espouse using violence in their practice to compensate for their lack of understanding or skill in aikido. I question whether some of these individuals have ever practiced aikido for any length of time under a qualified shihan. It also seems that some of them have even made up their own art, but still use the aikido name for their own personal profit.

Nevertheless, these individuals actually attempt to instruct young members of the aikido community on this forum and elsewhere based their personal views, rather than spending the time and energy required to gain a true understanding of the art of peace.

The cultivation of large egos by various means, along with gathering a host of illusions, will only serve as roadblocks in the development of a true understanding of aikido, both individually and collectively.

Last edited by mike lee : 08-13-2002 at 12:49 PM.
 
Old 08-13-2002, 01:10 PM   #29
DaveO
Dojo: Great Wave Aikido
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Hmm. Interesting response. Please allow me, in my own humble, unenlightened manner, to answer point by point.
Quote:
Many of my students were not even born when I began training in aikido. I began studying various forms of martial arts 10 years before I began aikido training in 1977 at the University of Wisconsin, receiving frequent instruction from Akira Tohei Shihan, among many others.
OK, fair enough - you have more than twenty years in Aikido. This raises questions I'll cover in a bit, but in the meantime, you seem to have a hostile attitude to one or two in the VOE forum - why? Is your 20 years better than their 20 years, or is there an argument you have not seen fit to inform us of? Also, let me state a personal viewpoint; it seems to me your past few posts, for instance:
Quote:
Maybe Chis Li couldn't take the heat, so he found a way to get out of the kitchen.

Living in anger

Living in constant rage

Living in a cage
or
Quote:
Wow! Come down from the dizzying heights to talk to us common folk.

Have the cicada gone silent yet?
can hardly be considered mature, intelligent commentary from a man of your stated experience.
Quote:
There are a small group of individuals on this forum who, for various reasons, espouse using violence in their practice to compensate for their lack of understanding or skill in aikido. I question whether some of these individuals have ever practiced aikido for any length of time under a qualified shihan.
Forgive me, but I see very few, if any, posters here arguing for taking the violent path, unless one argues from a point of extreme political correctness. I could be mistaken; if you could please direct me to one post where the poster espouses violence in the use of Aikido, I would be grateful. In any event, your agression was aimed at the VOE forum, and as of this writing, no post in that forum condoned violence. Therefore, this point is rendered effectively null. As to the second part of this point, while you have every right to question, it could hardly be considered wise to do so simply because they have different ideas of Aikido than you, given the widely-differing ideas of aikidoka worldwide, and the disparate nature of the many aikido styles.
Quote:
Nevertheless, these individuals actually attempt to instruct young members of the aikido community on this forum and elsewhere based their personal views rather than spending the time and energy required to gain a true understanding of the art of peace.
Egad! You mean people without your vast experience, wisdom and opinions would actually do something so outrageously impertinent as to help others? Shocking; truly shocking, what this world's come to.

Now, when you say "...a true understanding of the art of peace", what do you mean? YOUR understanding perhaps? O-Sensei's? I personally believe that Aikido is something different to each practicioner; in a philosophical question of this nature, basic common sense should tell us that there can be no one correct answer. In other words, who the heck are YOU, or I, or any one person to say someone has "a true understanding of the art of peace"?
Quote:
The cultivation of large egos by various means, along with gathering a host of illusions, will only serve as roadblocks in the development of a true understanding of aikido, both individually and collectively.
Mike, I agree with you completely. Therefore, in an effort to help the collective develop their understanding, let me suggest that you begin by looking at your own ego. You are, after all, a twenty-plus year veteran of Aikido; you should be taking a leading role in these discussions, helping us, guiding us, not dropping nasty little juvenile, snide comments here and there.

Aikido was meant as a means to bring an attacker back into harmony with ki - I have seen little of that philosophy from you on this thread. For someone who has been studying since '77, and who has a true understanding of the art of peace, I would have expected better.

Interesting.

Answers are only easy when they're incomplete.
 
Old 08-13-2002, 01:39 PM   #30
mike lee
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Cool take it or leave it

"Forgive me, but I see very few, if any, posters here arguing for taking the violent path..."

Quote:
I know a student of Morihei Ueshiba's who was also a golden gloves boxer who integrates boxing techniques with his Aikido and does so very well, thank you, "arts of violence" or not. M. Ueshiba practiced with a sword (but he I'm sure that he was very peaceful as he sliced his partners into tiny pieces...), he practiced with a bayonet - how "non-violent" is that?

Last edited by mike lee : 08-13-2002 at 01:43 PM.
 
Old 08-13-2002, 01:55 PM   #31
akiy
 
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As this thread has quickly devolved into personal issues and squabbles, I am closing it.

For people who wish to continue with the violence/non-violence aspect of the last few posts, please head over to the following thread where the text that Mike Lee quoted.

http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/showth...&threadid=2087

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Old 08-16-2002, 03:52 PM   #32
Bruce Baker
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I apologise for those who are offended.

This post was meant to do two things. Get the voice of experience to talk about a subject, then bring the best questions out into the genearal public. I haven't seen that happen, yet.

My second point was to bring to light that John Stevens, author and teacher, is continueing his sharing of knowledge as to the sounds of Kotodama. Whether he has approached the subject of using sounds for healing, movement, or spiritual insight, he has only alluded to using them for spiritual insight ... at least in the three times I have met and talked to him.

Lastly, by wanderings have come across using the sounds which are found in Kotodama for movement. I knew that certain sounds affect the mental and spiritual wellbeing of human beings, but movement was a new one on me.

So how about it. Anyone out there know more than this?
 

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