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Old 10-30-2010, 03:18 PM   #126
RED
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

Quote:
Janet Rosen wrote: View Post
I would say that both of you are making a logical fallacy, equating loving the art or feeling committed to it to claiming "my aikido is as good as your's." I never said the latter. I have said up front that I am not a professional aikidoka. But as Mary has pointed out, neither of you are in a position to second guess our hearts, our motives, or, yeah, or level of committment to the art.
I've known many Aikidoka with extreme health issues, blind, old etc. Their Aikido will never be of a certain level because of physical disabilities. But, They train every chance they get. They are in love with Aikido. Aikido is like young love... when you're in love nothing takes priority. Health permitting, I see these people scramble to get to training, as much as humanly within possibility. Even when it isn't fun anymore, they have to be there.

Some people are in love with Aikido, hopelessly.. infatuated. A day without training is an anxious, bad day. When you are in love you rearrange your life, fiances and plans to accommodate the object of that obsession. That anxiety and depression without Aikido is what drives people to be with the object of their obsession...not matter what. I can't say who is and who isn't in love with anything. Only the individual can judge his own heart. I've not personally judged anyone for their level of commitment, because I don't know anyone on here personally. I just can't imagine anyone who loves something who wouldn't rearrange heaven and earth to get to it. If my statements are bothersome, they are not being directed at any individual. I'm just stating my beliefs on the issues, and I figure if what I complain against is in line with how some people train it might strike a nerve, and I apologize, because I'm not trying to direct my statements at any individual.

I don't care about other people's rank, or even skill set. You can be the worse Aikidoka that ever walked the earth...but I love it when I meet people who catch that love bug for the art.

My entire point in this is that I don't believe in excuses for why some one doesn't train more. I believe people make time for the things they love, they find time, no matter what. Life is complicated and taking more time to train can make it even more complicated--- but like a boyfriend your mom hates; it's worth the complication.
If something else takes priority in one's life over Aikido, that's fine.

These sets of decisions and priorities define what our lives are about IMO. I firmly believe a person is defined by love. What they love, and whom loves them. If your child takes priority over Aikido because you love him, be proud, you are defined as a mother. If Aikido takes priority over somethings in your life, be proud, you are Aikidoka.
I like the idea of people being who they are, and being intellectually honest with themselves about what the priorities of their life amounts to.
Other words, it's okay to do Aikido and not have it be your priority in life. Casual practice, hobbyist, recreation, or just the joy of the art are Nobel enough reasons to practice on a casual basis. Just understand for some one who practices a lot 2 days a week will always seem "casual", even if it doesn't feel casual for the 2 day a week practitioner.

Again, I apologize if you felt I was directing my complaints to any individual. I can't judge anyone, let alone people I've never met. These are my beliefs on priority, training and a life commitment to an art.

Last edited by RED : 10-30-2010 at 03:32 PM.

MM
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Old 10-30-2010, 04:46 PM   #127
RED
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

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Maggie Schill wrote: View Post
I've known many Aikidoka with extreme health issues, blind, old etc. Their Aikido will never be of a certain level because of physical disabilities. But, They train every chance they get. They are in love with Aikido. Aikido is like young love... when you're in love nothing takes priority. Health permitting, I see these people scramble to get to training, as much as humanly within possibility. Even when it isn't fun anymore, they have to be there.

Some people are in love with Aikido, hopelessly.. infatuated. A day without training is an anxious, bad day. When you are in love you rearrange your life, fiances and plans to accommodate the object of that obsession. That anxiety and depression without Aikido is what drives people to be with the object of their obsession...not matter what. I can't say who is and who isn't in love with anything. Only the individual can judge his own heart. I've not personally judged anyone for their level of commitment, because I don't know anyone on here personally. I just can't imagine anyone who loves something who wouldn't rearrange heaven and earth to get to it. If my statements are bothersome, they are not being directed at any individual. I'm just stating my beliefs on the issues, and I figure if what I complain against is in line with how some people train it might strike a nerve, and I apologize, because I'm not trying to direct my statements at any individual.

I don't care about other people's rank, or even skill set. You can be the worse Aikidoka that ever walked the earth...but I love it when I meet people who catch that love bug for the art.

My entire point in this is that I don't believe in excuses for why some one doesn't train more. I believe people make time for the things they love, they find time, no matter what. Life is complicated and taking more time to train can make it even more complicated--- but like a boyfriend your mom hates; it's worth the complication.
If something else takes priority in one's life over Aikido, that's fine.

These sets of decisions and priorities define what our lives are about IMO. I firmly believe a person is defined by love. What they love, and whom loves them. If your child takes priority over Aikido because you love him, be proud, you are defined as a mother. If Aikido takes priority over somethings in your life, be proud, you are Aikidoka.
I like the idea of people being who they are, and being intellectually honest with themselves about what the priorities of their life amounts to.
Other words, it's okay to do Aikido and not have it be your priority in life. Casual practice, hobbyist, recreation, or just the joy of the art are Nobel enough reasons to practice on a casual basis. Just understand for some one who practices a lot 2 days a week will always seem "casual", even if it doesn't feel casual for the 2 day a week practitioner.

Again, I apologize if you felt I was directing my complaints to any individual. I can't judge anyone, let alone people I've never met. These are my beliefs on priority, training and a life commitment to an art.
I just want to clarify, I do believe you can be very good at Aikido with other priorities. I'm married, and if something was wrong with my husband, I wouldn't just train regardless of him. Aikido is about love IMO...I'm not a freak willing to spit in the eye of love and common sense.
I just have priorities, and some personal standards for my training, because of an honest love of an art.

MM
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Old 10-30-2010, 07:45 PM   #128
Ryan Seznee
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

Quote:
Janet Rosen wrote: View Post
I would say that both of you are making a logical fallacy, equating loving the art or feeling committed to it to claiming "my aikido is as good as your's." I never said the latter. I have said up front that I am not a professional aikidoka. But as Mary has pointed out, neither of you are in a position to second guess our hearts, our motives, or, yeah, or level of committment to the art.
I am trying to point out your logical fallacy. I made the comparison on purpose because it was so ridiculous that even someone who skimmed it would be able to understand how flawed it was. I starting off saying, "using THAT logic..." to denote that it was the logic that I perceived you to be using. The one that you continue to use... The arrangement is one for I feel this way even though I am giving every possible physical indication that I do not. I love it even though I only spend 2 to 3 hours a week with it. This would not make a convincing argument if we were referencing a relationship with a child, wife, or any kind of lifelong commitment, why should it fly with Aikido?

The average American spends 5.5 hours a week showering, 18.2 hours watching TV, and 2.349 hours shaving. If you spend 2 to 3 hours a week training in Aikido, you could make a stronger argument that you are a nudist, couch potato, or barber than an Aikidoka.
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Old 10-30-2010, 07:54 PM   #129
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

Not sure I care for the idea of being "in love" with aikido. "In love" is something that never last long. It tends to be blind to the truth of things, it is irrational and usually acts without thinking things out. In love almost always burns out and become dislike, disinterest, or boredom. And occasionally it burns down to a steady partnership that lasts a lifetime.

I think I'd really rather have a real lasting relationship with aikido than be enamored of that high feeling of being in love with it. Seeing not only its beauty but it's practical sides as well imperfections and appreciating it as a whole.

I can never say aikido is my life because my life is bigger than aikido. But aikido certainly enhances life and affects many aspects of it.

I have always had the attitude that whatever it is I am doing I want to be as good at it as I can possibly be. And generally find that I can become very good and even excel at anything I truly take an interest in doing. Maybe I can never be a great aikido teacher but I dang sure intend to be an excellent aikido hobbyist at the very least.

And I have already told my sensei that he had better not ever promote me to a rank that I have not earned and don't deserve.
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Old 10-30-2010, 08:07 PM   #130
Ryan Seznee
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

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Brian Gillaspie wrote: View Post
I respect that you consider these as decisions but to be honest for me I do not consider them as decisions. I chose to start a family so I am obligated to them so for me it is a responsibility. Please note that I am not condeming anyone who puts aikido as a priority over family but it is something that is not appropriate for me and my situation.

By the way, I do train more than 2 hours a week so I just want you to know that I am not bashing anyone who trains several hours a week. I simply just sharing my thoughts.
If you CHOSE to start a family, then you CHOSE to fall under the obligation. If you veiw it as a natural recourse of having a family, then you knew you would have the obligation when you CHOSE to start your family. It was, as you admit, your CHOICE.

That is what is annoying me the most about this post. It is the choice of every Aikidoka out there how committed and how good they are. No one is downing you for whatever level of commitment you are perusing, but everyone is equal in that they choose how much time they spent there. Everyone CHOOSES what is valuable and worth pursuing. I trained with a single father who went to every class with his son because he couldn't find a sitter. Don't complain that you can't have your cake and eat it too.
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Old 10-30-2010, 10:00 PM   #131
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

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Ryan Seznee wrote: View Post
If you CHOSE to start a family, then you CHOSE to fall under the obligation. If you veiw it as a natural recourse of having a family, then you knew you would have the obligation when you CHOSE to start your family. It was, as you admit, your CHOICE.

That is what is annoying me the most about this post. It is the choice of every Aikidoka out there how committed and how good they are. No one is downing you for whatever level of commitment you are perusing, but everyone is equal in that they choose how much time they spent there. Everyone CHOOSES what is valuable and worth pursuing. I trained with a single father who went to every class with his son because he couldn't find a sitter. Don't complain that you can't have your cake and eat it too.
I am not complaining about not getting more time to work out. And I realize that I can make choices as extreme as quitting my job, leaving my wife and abandoning my kids and train every minute of my life but you are right that "I" choose not to. If someone else choses to do that then that is fine with me and it doesn't make a difference if I agree or disagree with their choice.

I am just trying to point out that I train about 5-6 hours a week but I considered that committed considering my work load and family obligations. I don't need someone else to justify if I am committed to aikido but if you can tell me what the magic number of hours is to be considered committed (and tell me who gets to set that number) then we will see how I measure up to it.
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Old 10-31-2010, 12:48 AM   #132
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

Person A trains everyday and quits after five years.

Person B trains 2 times sometimes once a week for the rest of his/her life.

Who is the more committed?

David
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Old 10-31-2010, 02:13 AM   #133
carina reinhardt
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

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David Skaggs wrote: View Post
Person A trains everyday and quits after five years.

Person B trains 2 times sometimes once a week for the rest of his/her life.

Who is the more committed?

David
Person B..
Last year I trained almost every day because I prepared my examen for shodan and our teacher was so kind to give us extra classes in a small gym in his brothers house the days we had no classes in the normal gym,
After the examen I returned to the classes twice a week and it is a relief for me, I have more time for the rest of things I have to do working 8 hours a day.
As I said in another thread aikido is part of my life but twice a week and maybe once every 2 months a seminar or course is enough ..
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Old 10-31-2010, 02:21 AM   #134
Carsten Möllering
 
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

Quote:
David Skaggs wrote: View Post
Person A trains everyday and quits after five years.
Person B trains 2 times sometimes once a week for the rest of his/her life.
Who is the more committed?
Hmm, what is this alternative about?

I know few people practicing only two times a week for a lifetime.
A lot of people I know have integrated aikido in their life and practice more often then two times a week for their life.

Most people go to work everyday. For (nearly) a lifetime if this is possible.
Most people see their familiy members everyday. For a lifetime if it is possible.
Why should aikido be different if someone is committed to practice?

Interesting: There is no fitting german word. If we want to express that someone loves something like aikido in a way he arranges his life around it, we sometimes use the english expression "committement".

We may say: "Er/Sie hat ein committement: Aikido."
(At least people I know use this term.)

Last edited by Carsten Möllering : 10-31-2010 at 02:25 AM.
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Old 10-31-2010, 02:36 AM   #135
carina reinhardt
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

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Carsten Möllering wrote: View Post
Hmm, what is this alternative about?

I know few people practicing only two times a week for a lifetime.
A lot of people I know have integrated aikido in their life and practice more often then two times a week for their life.

Most people go to work everyday. For (nearly) a lifetime if this is possible.
Most people see their familiy members everyday. For a lifetime if it is possible.
Why should aikido be different if someone is committed to practice?

Interesting: There is no fitting german word. If we want to express that someone loves something like aikido in a way he arranges his life around it, we sometimes use the english expression "committement".

We may say: "Er/Sie hat ein committement: Aikido."
(At least people I know use this term.)
Of course everybody is different, it depends on the time everyone has to train and what he wants to invest in aikido.
I didn't know that you say committment, I know that you wouldn't say lieben as we don't say it in spanish. But living in the country makes you know more words although I learned first german than spanish with my parents..
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Old 10-31-2010, 02:47 AM   #136
carina reinhardt
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

But commitment is Verpflichtung, doesn't it and I wouldn't say so for aikido..
It does not fit in this thread, sorry to the others
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Old 10-31-2010, 06:50 AM   #137
Rabih Shanshiry
 
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

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Brian Gillaspie wrote: View Post
And I realize that I can make choices as extreme as quitting my job, leaving my wife and abandoning my kids and train every minute of my life but you are right that "I" choose not to. If someone else choses to do that then that is fine with me and it doesn't make a difference if I agree or disagree with their choice.
I think it's incubment on an instructor to give any student a reality check if they discover that training is jeopardizing their family life or financial well-being. That's pretty much the definition of addiction. If someone ignored the advice and abandonded their family to practice Aikido, they would not be welcome in my dojo until the situation was rectified. If you wish to dedicate your life to the art, that's wonderful - but not at someone else's expense.

Last edited by Rabih Shanshiry : 10-31-2010 at 06:52 AM.
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Old 10-31-2010, 07:30 AM   #138
Brian Gillaspie
 
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

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Rabih Shanshiry wrote: View Post
I think it's incubment on an instructor to give any student a reality check if they discover that training is jeopardizing their family life or financial well-being. That's pretty much the definition of addiction. If someone ignored the advice and abandonded their family to practice Aikido, they would not be welcome in my dojo until the situation was rectified. If you wish to dedicate your life to the art, that's wonderful - but not at someone else's expense.
I completely agree with everything you said in this post. I think I tried to say something similar myself in previous posts but it didn't come out so clearly.

I'll continue reading this discussion but this is my last post on this topic because all the time I have spent reading it should have been spent on the mat so I can call myself committed to aikido
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Old 10-31-2010, 08:09 AM   #139
Nicholas Eschenbruch
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

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I think it's incubment on an instructor to give any student a reality check if they discover that training is jeopardizing their family life or financial well-being. That's pretty much the definition of addiction.
Very good point, Rab. I would like to expand that it is also easy to use "comittment" to aikido as a cover-up for masochism, avoidances of all sorts and escaping from unwanted challenges in the rest of one's life. But everybody needs to draw their own lines and make their own choices, really - and sometimes most of us need somebody to knock us on our heads and point out what we are really doing here...
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Old 10-31-2010, 10:18 AM   #140
George S. Ledyard
 
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

Quote:
David Skaggs wrote: View Post
Person A trains everyday and quits after five years.

Person B trains 2 times sometimes once a week for the rest of his/her life.

Who is the more committed?

David
Hi David,
This is where I see the problem...
Let's posit that this is all done under the same teacher and that teacher is very high level. I would say that almost certainly A) was better when he quit than B) ever achieved.

So, that's always been at the heart of my doubts... is there some inherent value in being mediocre in Aikido, just because it's Aikido or is there some theoretical baseline below which it is just too shallow to really be worth much at all and is perhaps something of a waste of time?

A) May have walked away... but the lessons from the intensive experience are far deeper and more based in some reality than those derived from the half-hearted and inconsistent experience of B). So, A) walked away with something of substantial value from the experience. While B) stays in the art and dabbles for years and years.

Unfortunately, B) will be precisely the person Saotome Sensei would be referring to when he chides the folks at camp. "I see you people every year for ten years... each year your Aikido is the same. Your practice, what meaning?"

So, personally, I am coming down on the side of A) is being the more committed. He trained harder and went deeper when he trained. The other fellow has been pretending to train for a long time.

George S. Ledyard
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Old 10-31-2010, 11:00 AM   #141
George S. Ledyard
 
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

Quote:
Carsten Möllering wrote: View Post
Most people go to work everyday. For (nearly) a lifetime if this is possible.
Most people see their familiy members everyday. For a lifetime if it is possible.
Why should aikido be different if someone is committed to practice?
Hi Carsten,
This touches on something really important... I would say that O-Sensei never thought of or intended Aikido to be a "hobby". It is a Budo a Michi.

Personally, I think that Aikido has tremendous depth and sophistication and the practice has the potential to be trans-formative in a host of ways. As I said before, it represents "old knowledge" which one might consider worth a lot of effort to preserve in this modern world.

As Americans, we have allowed our selves to be subsumed by work. We derive a huge part of our sense of self from our jobs. We think very little of not seeing the family as much as we'd like, if the cause is work related. We get less vacation than any other industrialized nation in the world and the average American doesn't use up what we have.

We are a nation of workaholics. We are by far the richest nation in the world but feel we have to scramble just to keep our heads above water. We don't have time for the things that would enrich our souls because we have bought into this whole idea that we are what our jobs are. And this is getting worse... All those things you hear on the news about "productivity gains" in various industries... well, that's fewer people doing the same or more work than more folks did previously. Folks are working themselves in to an early grave. Stress related illness is one of the biggest causes of ill health in America. Our pain killer industry is larger than many countries GNP. Why do we need so many pain killers in the first place?

So a practice such as Aikido, which can feed your soul, your intellect, is good exercise, and provides a great social community is placed behind your job in priority. That job is probably killing you, for most folks involves selling or producing something that is completely non-essential or is even unhealthy, and the doing of which enriches your life not at all. And we let this happen with little or no complaint.

This whole thing of "I don't have time to train more" is simply symptomatic of larger issues in our society. We are more than what we do in our jobs. Yet almost everyone I know would be doing something different if he or she could do so. Everyone. has a whole list of things that they'd like to be doing but feel they can't. If only I'd win the lottery, then I could do ....

If there ever was a time in history when the average person did have the time and the means to pursue something beyond basic survival, that time is now. The whole system is set up to make a very few richer and richer and yet the vast majority allow themselves to be sucked into the belief that they have to work harder and harder just to get by. But this is an illusion. The only reason you are asked to work harder and harder is so that the top five percent of the wealthy can GROW their wealth. Not just maintain it, but grow it. And everyone says that they can't train more, or whatever it is that they REALLY rather be doing.

This whole society is pretty crazy. At its heart is a set of assumptions that could easily be different if people understood how they are manipulated and collectively decided to change things. But I don't see these things changing any time soon. In fact I see it getting a lot worse in the future.

It's always been about time and money... When you have time you often don't have the money, when you have the money you frequently don't have the time. That's why throughout history much of the spiritual work was done in monasteries and religious communities because the could economically afford the "leisure time" required to do something other than produce food and shelter.

We are a richer society than any in history ever dreamed of and yet will still tell ourselves we don't have time for these amazing things we could be doing rather than killing ourselves to produce ever increasing profit for a ruling class of wealthy individuals and corporations.

Ok, that's it for the "Lefty" tirade. It's just hard to watch how people buy in to these myths... myself included. I think we really need to question all of our assumptions. If things keep going they way they are, no one will be doing anything seriously... It will all be hobbyists in everything, that and marketers... A whole world full of hobbyists and marketers. Nothing of real depth can survive in that environment.

George S. Ledyard
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Old 10-31-2010, 11:16 AM   #142
Pauliina Lievonen
 
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

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George S. Ledyard wrote: View Post
So, that's always been at the heart of my doubts... is there some inherent value in being mediocre in Aikido, just because it's Aikido or is there some theoretical baseline below which it is just too shallow to really be worth much at all and is perhaps something of a waste of time?
With all due respect, here I think you make the same kind of mistake of perspective that was talked about earlier in the thread, but from the opposite side - that of the professional.

Of course for a professional it would not make sense to aim for mediocrity. It certainly wouldn't make sense to admit to it!

From the point of view of a hobbyist the goal of excellence is I think much less important. Haven't people even in this thread said things along the lines of "I don't care if I never become excellent in aikido, I love doing it and want to keep on doing it"?

I know I've got a lot out of my aikido practice, things that are of value to me personally. Whether or not my aikido practice is of value to anyone else is another question...

It comes down to choices for the teachers as well I think. If you want to train professionals - well you could try to set up some kind of program for that. It might bankrupt you, but you could try it. Or you can teach hobbyists, and be happy that they get something out of the experience, even though they never reach your level.

Pauliina
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Old 10-31-2010, 11:32 AM   #143
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

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Pauliina Lievonen wrote: View Post
With all due respect, here I think you make the same kind of mistake of perspective that was talked about earlier in the thread, but from the opposite side - that of the professional.

Of course for a professional it would not make sense to aim for mediocrity. It certainly wouldn't make sense to admit to it!

From the point of view of a hobbyist the goal of excellence is I think much less important. Haven't people even in this thread said things along the lines of "I don't care if I never become excellent in aikido, I love doing it and want to keep on doing it"?

I know I've got a lot out of my aikido practice, things that are of value to me personally. Whether or not my aikido practice is of value to anyone else is another question...

It comes down to choices for the teachers as well I think. If you want to train professionals - well you could try to set up some kind of program for that. It might bankrupt you, but you could try it. Or you can teach hobbyists, and be happy that they get something out of the experience, even though they never reach your level.

Pauliina
Paulina I agree, of course with all due respect to George.
I don't think a person who only can train twice a week for the rest of is life must be mediocre .
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Old 10-31-2010, 11:39 AM   #144
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

Carina, that's not what I meant exactly. I mean that someone who only trains a couple times a week probably doesn't care that much if they are mediocre at aikido or not. They get something valuable out of the training anyway.

If someone wants to be really good at something, I'd assume that they start to train more almost automatically. The hunger for excellence seems to take care of that.

Pauliina
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Old 10-31-2010, 11:45 AM   #145
carina reinhardt
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

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Pauliina Lievonen wrote: View Post
Carina, that's not what I meant exactly. I mean that someone who only trains a couple times a week probably doesn't care that much if they are mediocre at aikido or not. They get something valuable out of the training anyway.

If someone wants to be really good at something, I'd assume that they start to train more almost automatically. The hunger for excellence seems to take care of that.

Pauliina
Ok Paulina that is assuming you have any time you like, as I posted before, preparing my shodan examen my family almost didn't see me.
If we take 2 persons who do not must go to a job either attend a family of course the one who trains every day will be much better.
But training only twice a week does not mean you don't care much

Last edited by carina reinhardt : 10-31-2010 at 11:47 AM.
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Old 10-31-2010, 12:05 PM   #146
Pauliina Lievonen
 
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

Carina, let's put it this way: would you like to become 8th dan?

If you say, no, I don't have that much time... then that is what I mean. I don't mean that you don't care about aikido. I just mean that you probably don't care if you become 8th dan.

By mediocre I don't mean "mediocre compared to all the other shodans in the world." I don't think Ledyard sensei meant that either. I mean mediocre compared to the very highest that it's possible to achieve in aikido (and that's not really 8th dan, but I'm using that as an convenient example, ok?...)

I really hope that if someone would come here on Aikiweb and say: I'd like to become as good at aikido as it's humanly possible to become, that we'd all agree that that takes more practice than twice a week... and yes, we'd probably tell that person to be prepared to not start a family, to have no other hobbies, and to only work to support the aikido practice.

Pauliina
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Old 10-31-2010, 12:25 PM   #147
carina reinhardt
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

Quote:
Pauliina Lievonen wrote: View Post
Carina, let's put it this way: would you like to become 8th dan?

If you say, no, I don't have that much time... then that is what I mean. I don't mean that you don't care about aikido. I just mean that you probably don't care if you become 8th dan.

By mediocre I don't mean "mediocre compared to all the other shodans in the world." I don't think Ledyard sensei meant that either. I mean mediocre compared to the very highest that it's possible to achieve in aikido (and that's not really 8th dan, but I'm using that as an convenient example, ok?...)

I really hope that if someone would come here on Aikiweb and say: I'd like to become as good at aikido as it's humanly possible to become, that we'd all agree that that takes more practice than twice a week... and yes, we'd probably tell that person to be prepared to not start a family, to have no other hobbies, and to only work to support the aikido practice.

Pauliina
Yes I understand you Paulina No I will not become 8th dan, I like aikido very much and when I started to train I had problems with my husband who did not understand it. Now he respects it.
I train to relax and amuse myself after 8 hours job, so it is my hobby . I train in my free time, if I wouldn't need to have to work and had enough time perhaps I would train every day, but even then I don't would think to become an 8th Dan. The grades are not important for me as I m not thinking to teach aikido,
I enjoy very much the training with my good friends in the dojo thats why I train as much as I can and hope for the rest of my life.
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Old 10-31-2010, 12:27 PM   #148
Ryan Seznee
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

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David Skaggs wrote: View Post
Person A trains everyday and quits after five years.

Person B trains 2 times sometimes once a week for the rest of his/her life.

Who is the more committed?

David
Neither has any commitment. Training every day would be the minimum for doing something on a professional level, but quitting shows a deffinate lack of commitment. They would both acheive about the same, and both would be just scratch the surface in Aikido and never make it past the rank of "beginner".

Why compare degrees of failure, don't you believe in success in this area of life?
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Old 10-31-2010, 12:36 PM   #149
carina reinhardt
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

Sorry Pauliina, in dutch right
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Old 10-31-2010, 12:55 PM   #150
Ryan Seznee
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Re: Is two Days a week enough?

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Rabih Shanshiry wrote: View Post
I think it's incubment on an instructor to give any student a reality check if they discover that training is jeopardizing their family life or financial well-being. That's pretty much the definition of addiction. If someone ignored the advice and abandonded their family to practice Aikido, they would not be welcome in my dojo until the situation was rectified. If you wish to dedicate your life to the art, that's wonderful - but not at someone else's expense.
All training is at someone else's expense, though. You could take that hour you spend at the dojo and spend it with your wife, children, parrents, put more hours in at work to make your household more profitable, time at the local church or community center, or even going to feed starving children in Africa. You are choosing not to invest it in those areas. You are choosing not to strengthen those relationships, do those good things, or even not take some *me* time. I think it is completely irrational that an average american spends 18 hours watching TV and can't find more than 2 hours a week to train and thinks that they are a serious student (which was what precipitated this conversation).

It is alright to be a family man. It is a GOOD thing to love your family, but it is possible to be a good parent and an aikidoka. I have known people that can pull it off, and I have met their wives and children who don't complain. Why do you think that you are so special that you have a busier life than all of the people who are now shihan?
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