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Old 04-16-2002, 08:01 AM   #1
Bruce Baker
Dojo: LBI Aikikai/LBI ,NJ
Location: Barnegaat, NJ
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 893
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skipping to the pin or throw..

How many times does your teacher stop a class to say, "You are hurrying the technique trying to get to the throw or the pin?"

I know focus of where your partner is, what they can do to counter, and how you get from here to there is supposed to be second nature, but sometimes(and this might be under my Aikido works yours doesn't) does the class or yourself forget about going slow/ not to hurry to the spectacular pin or throw?

I have been spending too much time responding to threads. It appears both the writers and responders have left Aikido in the Dojo and forgotten to use this lesson in Aikiweb threads.

Read an two or three entire threads, what do you think?
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Old 04-16-2002, 10:21 AM   #2
Brian Vickery
Dojo: Aiki-Buken Aikido
Location: Gilbert, Arizona
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 208
United_States
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Wink Re: skipping to the pin or throw..

Quote:
Originally posted by Bruce Baker
How many times does your teacher stop a class to say, "You are hurrying the technique trying to get to the throw or the pin?"

(...practically every class! ...I know, it was a rhetorical question!)

I have been spending too much time responding to threads. It appears both the writers and responders have left Aikido in the Dojo and forgotten to use this lesson in Aikiweb threads.
Well Bruce, since you're the one who started most of those threads, it's hard to be sympathetic!

...you know the old saying ...if you can't stand the heat...;^)

Brian Vickery

"The highest level of technique to achieve is that of having NO technique!"
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Old 04-16-2002, 11:48 AM   #3
ScottyC
Location: Indianapolis, IN, USA
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 17
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Quote:
How many times does your teacher stop a class to say, "You are hurrying the technique trying to get to the throw or the pin?"

I know focus of where your partner is, what they can do to counter, and how you get from here to there is supposed to be second nature, but sometimes(and this might be under my Aikido works yours doesn't) does the class or yourself forget about going slow/ not to hurry to the spectacular pin or throw?
Of course. This happens from time to time with most people, I would expect. I see it happen more often during randori.

What I try to remember -- and teach others in my classes -- is that the "spectacular pin or throw" is the least significant part of the encounter.

A saying in our dojo is, "The throw actually happens the step before the throw". That is, the taking of balance is the pivotal element. If you haven't done that BEFORE the "spectacular throw", then you won't GET a "spectacular throw".

In rushing to the punch line, often the critical element of balance disruption is glossed over or missed entirely. IMHO, that's one of the greatest dangers in rushing through techniques.

Quote:
I have been spending too much time responding to threads. It appears both the writers and responders have left Aikido in the Dojo and forgotten to use this lesson in Aikiweb threads.

Read an two or three entire threads, what do you think?
I think that this passage has nothing whatsoever to do with the initial part of your post. I also think that it's a passive-agressive attack on those who have disagreed with you in the forums.

I probably wouldn't have said anything, but you asked.

What was your motivation for that last section?

Scott Crawford
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Old 04-19-2002, 05:06 PM   #4
Bruce Baker
Dojo: LBI Aikikai/LBI ,NJ
Location: Barnegaat, NJ
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 893
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Rushing ...

My motivation was the same as the question.

People answering to threads without considering other options.

Follow the conversations of three or four threads.

See how the tones change, modify, and sometimes apologize when actual down-to-earth thoughts are deeply considered verses off the top of the head non-sense?

Are we rushing to put responses in threads just like rushing to get to the pin in our verbal sparring of threads?

By the way...

The insight of all the previous steps to get to the pin are correct. The throw and the pin are the harmony of the beginning ... taking the balance, creating the wave of energy, which can be ridden to the throw, or turned back upon itself by the more experienced.

Where else does the lesson apply?
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Old 04-19-2002, 05:50 PM   #5
Brian Vickery
Dojo: Aiki-Buken Aikido
Location: Gilbert, Arizona
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 208
United_States
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Re: Rushing ...

Quote:
Originally posted by Bruce Baker

Follow the conversations of three or four threads.

See how the tones change, modify, and sometimes apologize when actual down-to-earth thoughts are deeply considered verses off the top of the head non-sense?

Are we rushing to put responses in threads just like rushing to get to the pin in our verbal sparring of threads?
Hello Bruce,

...this might have to do with the particular 'experience level' (for lack of a better term) at that this forum.

Do you visit other aikido forums? ( aikidojournal.com ; stevenseagal.com ; e-budo.com)

It's kinda strange, but each site has a unique 'experience level'. What I mean by that, not meaning any type of put-down to any of these sites, is that the responses posted at these sites seem to fit within a certain range, a kind of depth of experience or understanding.

To see what I mean, go to the S.Seagal message board on that site, read some of the postings in the 'aikido' section. Then go to the Aikido Journal Bulletin Board and read a few there. Is it just me, or is there an intrinsic level of understanding. (I picked these two because they seem to be on opposite ends of the spectrum when it comes to aikido experience.)

It seems to me, that people only/usually respond at a particular site where they feel some level of comfort. For me, I respond in here ...but I rarely respond in the Aikido Journal BB, too many heavy hitters in there. I go to that site to learn. Nor do I respond on the S.Seagal message board, but I do enjoy reading the postings there, mostly for entertainment.

Maybe you can post the same thread in multiple forums just to see if this rings true! At other sites you might not get the 'rush to respond' effect you seem to be getting in here. (...not that I'm telling you to go somewhere else, really!) Just a thought!


...then again, I could be full of beans here!

Regards,

Last edited by Brian Vickery : 04-19-2002 at 06:07 PM.

Brian Vickery

"The highest level of technique to achieve is that of having NO technique!"
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Old 04-20-2002, 06:01 AM   #6
Bruce Baker
Dojo: LBI Aikikai/LBI ,NJ
Location: Barnegaat, NJ
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 893
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Infamous technique interuption

Oh, MY!

You weren't referring to the infamous

The deadly...

Gas attack interuption technique!!

Try BEANO dear fellow!

The BAS-TON (Boston, MA) gas relief wonder!

Savior of the Dojo!

It keeps the class from skipping out the door.

(enough skipping humor, thanks Brian.)
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