Welcome to AikiWeb Aikido Information
AikiWeb: The Source for Aikido Information
AikiWeb's principal purpose is to serve the Internet community as a repository and dissemination point for aikido information.

Sections
home
aikido articles
columns

Discussions
forums
aikiblogs

Databases
dojo search
seminars
image gallery
supplies
links directory

Reviews
book reviews
video reviews
dvd reviews
equip. reviews

News
submit
archive

Miscellaneous
newsletter
rss feeds
polls
about

Follow us on



Home > AikiWeb Aikido Forums
Go Back   AikiWeb Aikido Forums > General

Hello and thank you for visiting AikiWeb, the world's most active online Aikido community! This site is home to over 22,000 aikido practitioners from around the world and covers a wide range of aikido topics including techniques, philosophy, history, humor, beginner issues, the marketplace, and more.

If you wish to join in the discussions or use the other advanced features available, you will need to register first. Registration is absolutely free and takes only a few minutes to complete so sign up today!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 08-16-2004, 02:43 PM   #51
Ron Tisdale
Dojo: Doshinkan dojo in Roxborough, Pa
Location: Phila. Pa
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 4,614
United_States
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

That would explain it...thanks!

Ron (still linguistically impaired, but learning...)

Ron Tisdale
-----------------------
"The higher a monkey climbs, the more you see of his behind."
St. Bonaventure (ca. 1221-1274)
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-16-2004, 08:31 PM   #52
Jeanne Shepard
 
Jeanne Shepard's Avatar
Dojo: Puget Sound Aikikai
Location: Seattle
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 351
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

[quote=Lyle Laizure]I have heard this argument before. I read an excerpt from one of Saotome Sensei's books (sorry I don't reccollect which one) where he says that this is (and this in my words not Saotome Sensei's) rediculous. If Aikido is about everything it is supposed to be about then even suggesting that someone would be having improper thoughts about the women in class because they are not wearing hakama defeats the purpose."

What if we have improper thoughts about people who ARE wearing hakamas?!

Jeanne
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-16-2004, 11:28 PM   #53
Karen Wolek
Dojo: Kingston Aikido
Location: New York
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 322
United_States
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

Jeanne!!!!!! ROFLMAO!

Thanks, I needed that!

Karen
"Try not. Do...or do not. There is no try." - Master Yoda
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2004, 01:21 AM   #54
Chris Li
 
Chris Li's Avatar
Dojo: Aikido Sangenkai
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 3,084
United_States
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

Quote:
Lyle Laizure wrote:
I have heard this argument before. I read an excerpt from one of Saotome Sensei's books (sorry I don't reccollect which one) where he says that this is (and this in my words not Saotome Sensei's) rediculous. If Aikido is about everything it is supposed to be about then even suggesting that someone would be having improper thoughts about the women in class because they are not wearing hakama defeats the purpose.

Not as well put as Saotome Sensei put it.
According to Koichi Tohei, in "Ki no Kakuritsu", Morihei Ueshiba required women to wear hakama because women rolling around without them distracted him.

Best,

Chris

  Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2004, 02:57 PM   #55
Bronson
 
Bronson's Avatar
Dojo: Seiwa Dojo and Southside Dojo
Location: Battle Creek & Kalamazoo, MI
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,677
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

Quote:
Christopher Li wrote:
According to Koichi Tohei, in "Ki no Kakuritsu", Morihei Ueshiba required women to wear hakama because women rolling around without them distracted him.
HERETIC!!! How dare you suggest that O-Sensei was a human being and subject to the same human wants, desires, and distractions as the rest of us.



Bronson

"A pacifist is not really a pacifist if he is unable to make a choice between violence and non-violence. A true pacifist is able to kill or maim in the blink of an eye, but at the moment of impending destruction of the enemy he chooses non-violence."
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2004, 09:06 PM   #56
Joezer M.
 
Joezer M.'s Avatar
Location: Indonesia
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 54
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

In my dojo only yudansha wear hakama... so after practice they can look busy folding their hakamas while the rest of us clean the dojo
... and after several times receiving the honor of having to fold my sensei's hakama ("Hey, you're going to be shodan soon... why don't you practice folding with my hakama while I grab a clod one?"), I can't say I'm actually looking forward to having to wear it every time I practive

Reagards,
Joezer
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2004, 12:27 AM   #57
Anders Bjonback
Dojo: Boulder Aikikai
Location: Boulder, CO
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 129
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

This may seem really shallow... but hakama are just so cool! I think I've been wearing once since a little before my sixth kyu exam (now I'm 3rd kyu), and aikido just isn't the same without it. It makes cool swishing sounds and just look aesthetically pleasing, cool (as in "totally sweet"), and exotic. They're awesome!
During this period of my life, when I'm thinking I'll probably not be doing aikido when I get out of college, I think that maybe I shouldn't be wearing a hakama. But I really love aikido, and if you define devotion as a kind of love, then I guess I'm devoted despite whatever my future with the art is.

"For peace and happiness are presences, not objects we can grasp and hold onto."
--Lilian Smith
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2004, 12:48 AM   #58
L. Camejo
 
L. Camejo's Avatar
Dojo: Ontario Martial Arts
Location: Mississauga, Ontario
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,423
Canada
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

Quote:
Joezer Mandagi wrote:
In my dojo only yudansha wear hakama... so after practice they can look busy folding their hakamas while the rest of us clean the dojo
Hehe I like this post.

It reminds me of training at an Aikikai dojo and seeing this phenomena for the first time. Being the official bonafide Aiki-heathen that I am (wearing only black belt and gi), I proceeded to get all the other folks together (mainly mudansha) and leave early for a cold one while the other Yudansha were still folding.

Personally though, one great deterrent to me for wearing hakama (besides our official stance that it is dangerous) is having to take so much time to fold it afterwards (folding is not my area of expertise). I once considered wearing one, but thought of the looks I'd get when I folded it like my gi and tossed it into my bag without "lining up all the pleats".

Just my 2 cents.
LC

--Mushin Mugamae - No Mind No Posture. He who is possessed by nothing possesses everything.--
http://www.tntaikido.org
http://www.mushinkan.ca
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2004, 01:11 AM   #59
Zato Ichi
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 129
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

Quote:
Anders Bjonback wrote:
It makes cool swishing sounds and just look aesthetically pleasing, cool (as in "totally sweet"), and exotic. They're awesome!
Wow, Anders! Your hakama must have REAL ULTIMATE POWER!!
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-19-2004, 09:11 AM   #60
Troy
 
Troy's Avatar
Dojo: Yellow Springs Aikido
Location: Fairborn, Oh
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 50
United_States
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

At my Dojo, Aikido-ka are aloud to wear the Hakama after reaching 1st Kyu, so we can get used to wearing them before our Shodan test. I would really like to wear the Hakama sooner though. But, I do like the idea of earning the right to wear it. It shows that you are committing everything to your Aikido.

"The Art of Peace is the religion that is not a religion; it perfects and completes all religions."
-Morihei Ueshiba
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-19-2004, 10:37 AM   #61
David Humm
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 269
United Kingdom
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

Here's another slant on this thread..

Why do we think the likes of Aikikai Hombu (and or others) adopted the hakama at Shodan rule ?

No one I've spoken to seems to know a definitive answer
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-19-2004, 11:15 AM   #62
Yann Golanski
 
Yann Golanski's Avatar
Dojo: York Shodokan Aikido
Location: York, United Kingdom.
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 406
United Kingdom
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

As far as I know it dates from WW2. After the war, there was a shortage of cloth and so Doshu instigated the rule of hakama at shodan to make sure new students were not put off because of the price of a dogi and a hakama.

The people who understand, understand prefectly.
yann@york-aikido.org York Shodokan Aikido
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2004, 05:06 AM   #63
bruce bryan
Dojo: Shudokan Honbu Dojo
Location: nottingham
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 6
England
Offline
Talking Re: Wearing Hakama

The Hakama question has opened much debate.

Whilst the Hakama may be seen as just a 'Bit of cloth' of which people place 'Too much significance', I feel that it is a very significant article of clothing personally.

From the very first day, stepping into a Karate Dojo (many years ago) as a brand new white belt, I was amazed at the skill and knowledge of 'Those brilliant Black Belts', and vowed that some day i would be as skillful and knowledgable, and would earn the honour of being awarded one of those Black Belts. Many years later, having trained day after day, studying, attending camps and seminars and 1:1 tuition, I gained my Shodan. That was a proud and humbling moment. Earning my Nidan years after was no less difficult or humbling an award.

Now, as a White belt once again, begining my Aikido journey, watching the Yodansha in their Hakama, I am no less amazed as i was all those years ago, and once again have made the vow that I will one day through hard training and study,earn the coveted Hakama. Whilst I understand that everyone in the Dojo are more knowledgable than I, as a beginner, looking around an unfamiliar Dojo, at unfamiliar faces, I know who I can turn to for the correct help and advice through the difficult beginners stage and beyond.

There is no Ego in wearing a Hakama. It is a sign that the wearer has dedicated themselves completely to Aikido, and has earned the right to wear it. Therefore i feel that all grades wearing the Hakama takes away it's special meaning to those awarded it. We may as well do away with the whole belt/grade system, and also the Black Belt.

I personally feel that the Hakama is as much an award as the Black Belt worn underneath it, and look forward to the day that I am knowledgable and Skillful enough to wear one.

Just my view guys.

Domu.
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2004, 09:41 AM   #64
Derek Webb
Dojo: MK Keihatsu & Phoenix Coventry
Location: Milton Keynes
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 17
United Kingdom
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

Personally I see wearing the hakama and the award of black belt very much as a rite of passage. Years of hard practice, travelling thousands of miles, losing touch with old friends because aikido came first (though making many new ones in the process), the constant re-evaluation of technique and attitude and then the realisation that this is only one stage on the path.

Folding the hakama serves at least two purposes - a form of self discipline and more important provides time to reflect on the class and/or general gossip about anything.

Don't have any problems with any way various organisations deal with the hakama question. After all when in Rome.........

Regards

Delboy
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2006, 05:20 PM   #65
Mludwick
Location: Escazu
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 1
Costa Rica
Offline
Exclamation Re: Wearing Hakama

A Hakama is a skirt like garment meant to cover a Kimono for formal occasions. If the garment has seperate legs it is not a Hakama and used while riding horses. There are many types of Hakama anything from a thin one used for woodworkers to keep thier undergarnments clean to a Womans version.

The myth that a Hakama is to hide leg movements is a fairytail. Never has it been intended for this and it hardly would work. Samurai before battle would pull up the Hakama several inches to free up thier movements. People that say it's gives the illusion of floating have been watching too many science fiction movies.

Wherever you train if the policy is not to allow you to wear the Hakama then I guess you have to live with it. The garment alone is hardly an indication of proficiency.

Go out, buy a silk kimono,Hakama and an Obi. If you can figure out how all the knots should be tied and garments layered go out and have some Sushi. Nobody will mistake you for a 5th Dan.

Michael Ludwick

P.S> I hope this clears things up. Good Health.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2006, 08:47 PM   #66
DonMagee
Location: Indiana
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 1,311
United_States
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

I actually have no desire to wear the magic pants...err Hakama. I find them a pain for even my seniors to wear them. I can't see the feet of people trying to teach me when they wear them, and I see the process of putting them on and taking them off as really annoying. In fact, from day one my first question to my teacher was "Do you have to wear a hakama?".

Lucky the club I train prohibits wearing one until 2nd kyu. Even then it is optional. Personally, I perfer to wear a pair of fight shorts and a rash guard, but I can still understand functional reasons for wearing a gi, the hakama however just seems like a layer of humdrum used as a motivator and a symbol of status (at least in my club). There is nothing wrong with that, I see how it inspires people to train harder, and it is useful in learning who the guys to ask questions are (although our club is small and after a month or two, you know them all by heart anyways). I still find it more of a time consuming distraction anyways.

But maybe that is just because I'm not allowed to wear one? If I do ever reach a rank in which I can wear one, I will probably wear one just so I don't upset the balance of the class. It's not like it will hurt anything by wearing one.

- Don
"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough" - Albert Einstein
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2014, 11:06 AM   #67
ykrhanshi3
 
ykrhanshi3's Avatar
Location: San Jose
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 2
United_States
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

O-Sensei accepted no excuse for not wearing hakama. If one is to respect the art and the founder, then the hakama should be required in all dojo and seminar activities.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2014, 12:41 PM   #68
phitruong
Dojo: Charlotte Aikikai Agatsu Dojo
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,811
United_States
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

noooooo not the zombie thread on hakama!

it is almost as bad as zombies wearing hakama. picture this: the walking dead wearing pink polka dot hakama! ooooooo the nightmare and suffering! years of big ugly stick therapy!

"budo is putting on cold, wet, sweat stained gi with a smile and a snarl" - your truly
http://charlotteaikikai.org
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2014, 08:11 PM   #69
Steven
 
Steven's Avatar
Dojo: Aikido Yoshinkan Sacramento - Seikeikan Dojo
Location: Orangevale, CA
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 607
United_States
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

Quote:
Joe Salazar wrote: View Post
O-Sensei accepted no excuse for not wearing hakama. If one is to respect the art and the founder, then the hakama should be required in all dojo and seminar activities.
And yet there is evidence to the contrary like this...

  Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2014, 09:16 AM   #70
sorokod
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 606
United Kingdom
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

Quote:
Steven Miranda wrote: View Post
And yet there is evidence to the contrary like this...

Lifting his arm in despair for lack of hakamas

  Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2014, 09:41 AM   #71
Walter Martindale
  AikiWeb Forums Contributing Member
Location: Cambridge, ON
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 661
Canada
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

Wow... 28 posts in 2000, 36 posts in 2004, 2 posts in 2006, and 3 so far in 2014.. oh, no, wait, this one makes 4 in 2014... so far...

Haven't worn the hakama for a while, but that's only because I'm not practicing that much these days. I miss it... I guess that's why I keep checking in at aikiweb..

I like wearing the hakama during practice - the extra layer of fabric helps during shikko - one layer rubs the mat, one layer sticks to the skin, and the two layers slide on each other, reducing wear and tear on the skin...
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2014, 11:05 AM   #72
Steven
 
Steven's Avatar
Dojo: Aikido Yoshinkan Sacramento - Seikeikan Dojo
Location: Orangevale, CA
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 607
United_States
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama



Quote:
David Soroko wrote: View Post
Lifting his arm in despair for lack of hakamas
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2014, 11:55 AM   #73
Greg Jennings
Dojo: WPAFB JiuJitsu Group
Location: Springboro, OH
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,105
United_States
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

When in Rome, dress for keiko as the Romans do.

Greg Jennings
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2014, 12:04 PM   #74
GMaroda
Dojo: Allegheny Aikido
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 138
United_States
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

Quote:
Greg Jennings wrote: View Post
When in Rome, dress for keiko as the Romans do.
TOGA! TOGA! TOGA!

I keep threatening to get an American flag pattern hakama. Or maybe gold lamé.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2014, 05:53 PM   #75
Adam Huss
 
Adam Huss's Avatar
Location: Ohio
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 663
United_States
Offline
Re: Wearing Hakama

Quote:
Greg Jennings wrote: View Post
When in Rome, dress for keiko as the Romans do.
That would be naked.

Ichi Go, Ichi Ei!
  Reply With Quote

Please visit our sponsor:

Handmade Aikido Gifts - Handmade functional ceramic art with aikido themes



Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Poll: What do you think of wearing a hakama during aikido training? AikiWeb System AikiWeb System 39 11-07-2014 05:58 PM
Wearing of Hakama at Seminars Dante General 18 12-02-2004 07:30 AM
Hakama FAQ DaveO Humor 24 11-02-2004 06:22 PM
What level do you start wearing Hakama? villrg0a General 32 08-05-2003 04:58 PM
Hakama or no hakama. nmarques General 40 06-13-2002 07:57 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:47 AM.



vBulletin Copyright © 2000-2014 Jelsoft Enterprises Limited
----------
Copyright 1997-2014 AikiWeb and its Authors, All Rights Reserved.
----------
For questions and comments about this website:
Send E-mail
plainlaid-picaresque outchasing-protistan explicantia-altarage seaford-stellionate