How hard?

I love this faux-motivational poster (credit to it's creator...I don't know who they are and I can't remember where I downloaded it from). Makes me think of the first time I realized "in my bones" that I was studying a hardcore martial art.

Question: what was the first time you really experienced the true martial side of Aikido?

Makes me think of the first time I realized "in my bones" that I was studying a hardcore martial art.

At that stage, I kinda realized I'm throwing myself to the ground, and felt sorta silly...

Brian Dewey wrote: Question: what was the first time you really experienced the true martial side of Aikido?

The first time I took ukemi from my Sensei. I punched, and the next second I was on the ground, and very very confused.

Oh, and another time I took ukemi from a 1st kyu adult, and I didn't expect anything really amazing... but he nearly made me face-plant when he did irimi-nage on me.

When I was in the low kyu grades and asked my instructor to REALLY apply nikyo. He was hesitant but I badgered him into it. HOLY PANTS BATMAN!! I mean nikyo was always painful but this time I think I actually blanked out from the instant and overwhelming pain.

It was probably the best thing that ever happened to my training. My doubts had been allayed ...the techniques worked. I just had to learn to do them better

Bronson

p.s. Any news on the possibility of your coming to MI?

Brian Dewey wrote: what was the first time you really experienced the true martial side of Aikido?

The first time my Sensei (Dang Thong Phong of Tenshinkai Aikido) blended, smashed me to the mat and held me there with two fingers as I acted like a fish on the bottom of a boat and there was nothing I could do about it.

Hmmm, I haven't been training all that long and each session seems to show me that aikido is a martial art.

However (and it's a big one), I normally train Ki aikido but due to circumstances I am away from my normal dojo and had the opportunity to train with a different group.

I wasn't familiar with the style, Takemusu (but I wouldn't expect to be, I'm a noob) but when I spoke to the sensei I was very excited to train with them. His ideas about aikido echoed mine very strongly on subjects such as sincere attacks, bokken and jo training etc.

I felt I was experiencing the martial side on two specific points. When I received my first sincere (although controlled) yokomenuchi right on the kisser, and then when my shihonage ended up with me on the mat laughing fit to burst when uke showed me how we weren't moving round my centre.

I have never been so grateful to see the imperfections of my own ability and to learn!

Ahhhh it was great!

I am not practising aikido that long, but last monday when nikyo was applied correctly to me. Must be the first time I had so much pain.

It´s kind of interesting that most people think of pain (induced in cooperative training) when they think of "the true martial side of Aikido".

For me, it's that one time I fully resisted a perfectly executed full-speed shionage...OUCH!

Hip throws also do it for me. I've trained with some guys who also train in Judo. When applying their Judo experience to an Aiki-style hip throw...yikes Scooby!

Peter Gröndahl wrote: It´s kind of interesting that most people think of pain (induced in cooperative training) when they think of "the true martial side of Aikido".

You know what? You're absolutely right...thanks for pointing that out.

Peter Gr$B‹O(Bdahl wrote: It$B%((Bs kind of interesting that most people think of pain (induced in cooperative training) when they think of "the true martial side of Aikido".

I wonder if it's a phase that we go through. The experience I related happened relatively early in my aikido training and I think at that point it was the best way to get the point across. Now, a few years later I've learned more and my views have changed. I'm now far more impressed with the people who can control my postioning, balance, and stability without me ever feeling enough to know what the heck they're doing. But I wonder if I would have stuck with it long enough to appreciate that type of skill if I hadn't had the eye-opening experience of that intensely painful nikyo (which I practically begged for BTW )

Best,

Bronson

When I went to Jim Sorrentino's seminar at Aikido of Berkeley last month, when my partner, as uke, actually fought me, rather give me adequate resistance.
However I am first to admit that I chose my dojo because the martial aspects are not my primary reason for training, and the aspects that my sensei concentrates on are.

Peter Gröndahl wrote: It´s kind of interesting that most people think of pain (induced in cooperative training) when they think of "the true martial side of Aikido".

Brian Dewey wrote: You know what? You're absolutely right...thanks for pointing that out.

Thought about this a bit more. I see this two ways:

1) When ukes cease being compliant & cooperative, then that's where the "meat" of martial training begins and you begin to get real feedback on the effectiveness of your technique. I always get a friendly jab to the midsection, a gentle kick to the shin or a light slap to the face from my training partners when I lolligag on a technique.

2) From a more philosophical perspective, Budo isn't about how much pain you can inflict.

I came from a background in other martial arts, so I didn't really have a moment such as OP is talking about.

Brian Dewey wrote: [IMG]Question: what was the first time you really experienced the true martial side of Aikido?

Not sure if it's "true" or not, but I'd say it was when I first realized how much damage I could do to another person once I had control over their body. Whether that control was entirely given to me (as implied by Roman's post) or not, really seeing how I could do any number of mean things to someone was the first time I'd say I saw the martial side which can come with Aikido.

Roman Kremianski wrote: At that stage, I kinda realized I'm throwing myself to the ground, and felt sorta silly...

What stage are you refering to?

Kind of the final stage when I finally learned to take ukemi without messing myself up.

A couple of years ago myself and a friend took a month off Aikido to try out Ju-jitsu. Part of the training was competition and we were told that "airy-fairy Aikido doesn't work so go as hard as you want with the dan grades".

That killed my doubts about Aikido.

Brian Dewey wrote: Question: what was the first time you really experienced the true martial side of Aikido?

After watching my Sensei use a picture perfect kotegaeshi ura to drop a Shotokan Karate bb who was giving lip to one of our trainees after a self defence seminar. Wish I had a camera, you'd swear he was cooperating.

LC

The first time I realised Aikido was a martal art? My first and to date only attendance at an international, watching Black belts in randori getting (what appeared to me at the time anyways) a lesson in how to fly and the painful looking landings afterwards.

Or when a green belt tried to get me to breakfall out of a move rather than roll out of it....OUCHIES!

Brian Dewey wrote: Question: what was the first time you really experienced the true martial side of Aikido?

The first time I watched class at my dojo, before I started training. (I started a few days later...5 years ago...)