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Old 01-19-2007, 12:30 PM   #1
Darren
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for all those that think it works

thtp://youtube.com/watch?v=UDiRA7ldmcs
ha ha ha
back to earth we think
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Old 01-19-2007, 12:59 PM   #2
Steven
 
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Re: for all those that think it works

Quote:
Darren Kennedy wrote:
thtp://youtube.com/watch?v=UDiRA7ldmcs
ha ha ha
back to earth we think

Hope your aikido is not as bad as the url you posted.
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Old 01-19-2007, 01:17 PM   #3
Erik Calderon
 
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Re: for all those that think it works

Could you please repost the URL? I'd love to see it.

Erik Calderon
Aikido ShinKiKan.

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Old 01-19-2007, 01:49 PM   #4
Tinyboy344
 
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Re: for all those that think it works

You video has proved... nothing bcuz it's not available!
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Old 01-19-2007, 07:02 PM   #5
xuzen
 
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Re: for all those that think it works

Quote:
Darren Kennedy wrote:
thtp://youtube.com/watch?v=UDiRA7ldmcs
ha ha ha
back to earth we think
Your internet-do is weak grass-hopper.

Boon.

SHOMEN-ATE (TM), the solution to 90% of aikido and life's problems.
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Old 01-20-2007, 12:57 AM   #6
PhilMyKi
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Re: for all those that think it works

I thought I would hijack this thread with a video ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tib2Urowsdc

Watch this then watch this vs 'young karate guy'


Vorsprung durch Aikido!
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Old 01-20-2007, 01:27 AM   #7
senshincenter
 
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Re: for all those that think it works

Here's a better angle on that second video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7jf3Gc2a0_8

Hilarious!

I guess the truth really does hurt.

dmv

David M. Valadez
Visit our web site for articles and videos. Senshin Center - A Place for Traditional Martial Arts in Santa Barbara.
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Old 01-20-2007, 01:48 AM   #8
PhilMyKi
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Re: for all those that think it works

I would love to know if the young lad got his money?

Last edited by PhilMyKi : 01-20-2007 at 02:02 AM.

Vorsprung durch Aikido!
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Old 01-20-2007, 01:54 AM   #9
Mark Uttech
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Re: for all those that think it works

Hmmm... Another meaningless thread as online discussion runs into another video ambush.

In gassho

Mark
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Old 01-20-2007, 02:21 AM   #10
stelios
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Re: for all those that think it works

Where is the point (if any) on anything? That karate kid can ridicule hocus pocus grandpa live?
Please, people, please !
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Old 01-20-2007, 04:55 AM   #11
Josh Reyer
 
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Re: for all those that think it works

Look! The young karate guy grabbed his wrist! I thought nobody in their right mind ever attacked like that.

Josh Reyer

The lyf so short, the crafte so longe to lerne,
Th'assay so harde, so sharpe the conquerynge...
- Chaucer
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Old 01-20-2007, 06:09 AM   #12
Guilty Spark
 
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Re: for all those that think it works

Ahhh, every time I begin to think there is hope for humanity, and especially the youth of the world, I watch a video on youtube and then read the posted comments.

If you're hungry, keep moving.
If you're tired, keep moving.
If you value you're life, keep moving.

You don't own what you can't defend
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Old 01-20-2007, 07:56 AM   #13
statisticool
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Re: for all those that think it works

Quote:
Stelios Papados wrote:
Where is the point (if any) on anything? That karate kid can ridicule hocus pocus grandpa live?
Please, people, please !
The many people in the MA 'train' in a fantasy land, doing things that won't work at all in real life?

That seems to be very valuable lesson.

A secret of internal strength?:
"Let your weight from the crotch area BE in his hands."
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Old 01-20-2007, 09:23 AM   #14
senshincenter
 
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Re: for all those that think it works

Forget about martial technique, etc., both practitioners got a lot of work to do in my opinion. So, yes, it is kind of pointless to sit from afar and say "this" or "that" in that regard. However, there are huge lessons here, and even huger questions that could and should be asked. In my opinion, it's those lessons and questions that should be on the mind of every martial artist - WITH OR WITHOUT THIS VIDEO - all of the time.

The video only brings us back to what we all are supposed to be doing in this regard. They are a kind of a "pointer" in that way. They (pointers) are not necessary, but they do the job just fine. So they can be very helpful. What is it these things point to? Of course many things, but key is this: The lines between pride and humility, between ignorance and wisdom, and between love and fear are as thin as our will to power is penetrating.

This is no easy thing - to be an artist of violence, to make an art out of violence. Chances are one is more likely to "f" it all up than to reach the point of reconciliation than the founder of the art did. Not many folks, throughout history, can say that they have found "x" (e.g. peace and harmony) by looking for it in its opposite (e.g. violence).

With a task so difficult to achieve, it would seem that one should be very mindful of those human elements that lead one to have less clarity in his/her vision and/or subjectivity (e.g. a lust for power, fear, pride, and ignorance). If these things do not become and remain at the forefront of one's training concerns, well, in my opinion, you get a training life that is filled with moments (and micro-moments) of what can be seen in these three videos - from start to finish, on both sides.

In other words, this discussion can be as silly or as serious as one is ready to let desire, fear, pride, and ignorance go unnoticed or noticed in one's own life. The point of looking at these videos and discussing them, in my opinion, should be to determine, for oneself, where one is doing the exact same thing (in one version or another) in one's own training.

dmv

David M. Valadez
Visit our web site for articles and videos. Senshin Center - A Place for Traditional Martial Arts in Santa Barbara.
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Old 01-20-2007, 11:09 AM   #15
Guilty Spark
 
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Re: for all those that think it works

Did we see the same video?

I'm having trouble trying to figure out the point your trying to make my friend.

Speaking of silly and serious I think you'll find the latter completly lacking in that clip.

If you're hungry, keep moving.
If you're tired, keep moving.
If you value you're life, keep moving.

You don't own what you can't defend
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Old 01-20-2007, 03:06 PM   #16
tenshinaikidoka
 
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Re: for all those that think it works

It is not the art but the person who uses the art. It has always been that way and to continue to debate and or riducule martial artists, in my opinion, is a waste of breath,typing and reading!!!! I practise a certain way, and I use my art for my job as well as defense off the job. It has yet to fail me and I have had to use it in many different and interesting situations.

But, that is only me, and not everyone!!!!
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Old 01-20-2007, 03:20 PM   #17
senshincenter
 
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Re: for all those that think it works

Well, here's one way that a person could look at this as a pointer...

The first time the elder gentleman was hit in the face by the younger one, you could see the shock on his face and in his body language. This shock, I would suggest by the cues that were present, was not just from the "miracle" of being struck, or even from some rule the younger gentleman might have broken, etc. That shock was from the NEWNESS of the experience - if not from the rarity of the experience. That experience here is pain or the sensation of soft tissue reacting to a stressing energy of some kind. Folks that get hit all the time, well, they don't react like that at all. Here's the thing: When the guy practices his ki projections, his students time and time again react as if they are suffering some sort of stressing energy (at least) at the level of soft tissue. In other words, folks act like they are being hit. They are not at all acting like they are experiencing some other kind of "out of this world" energy. Don't get me wrong - I realize they are not really being hit - I realize that no touch is involved - but they ARE acting as if that is the energy they are experiencing. Well, if that is the case, why should the teacher of such a tradition be so shocked when he's actually struck? Shouldn't that experience be old-hat in a tradition that so eagerly attempts to blur the line between being struck (touched) and not being touched - at least at the level of soft tissue being stressed by energy? For me, even when you allow all the assumptions to be granted whatever level of truth they may claim, we are still looking at a huge inconsistency here. The man should not have been so un-used to being struck - to having his soft tissue stressed by energy.

For me, it is doubtful that this person is the only one making such inconsistencies in his training, just as it is doubtful that this is his only one. I bet that I have such inconsistencies as well - not this exact one, but at least ones very similar in concept or in structure. I would say we all do. This is the nature of subjective truth - that it survives in its limited practicality by seeking to universalize itself through self-delusion. My job then, or at least one of my main jobs, as a martial artist, is to find out where these inconsistencies might be, knowing that they will never be obvious to me - that they will resist me gaining clarity over them until the very end. Along the way, this is going to have me acting very silly - other times very seriously.

Again, I would propose that there is much to talk about when we use these videos as tools of self-reflection. There is much more going on here that some young guy kicking the crap out of some old man (though that obviously happened too).

dmv

David M. Valadez
Visit our web site for articles and videos. Senshin Center - A Place for Traditional Martial Arts in Santa Barbara.
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Old 01-20-2007, 03:59 PM   #18
tenshinaikidoka
 
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Re: for all those that think it works

Exactly, it is how the person trains!!!!!!! If there is a flaw to something you find the flaw and you try and fix it. I hope that was what my post stated, if it was taken another way, I apologize!
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Old 01-20-2007, 05:05 PM   #19
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Re: for all those that think it works

Yes, what you say makes sense. I agree. However, at the same time, it seems natural to ask how all those folks (not just "why") bought into all this stuff and then to wonder what all we (I) buy into. Why all the jumping around? Why the need to beat up on an old man? Why the cash prize and gathering all your "friends" to see you humiliated? Who made changes, if any, after that night? Who stayed the same? What does it take for both? Weird stuff is going on - going on unnoticed (my opinion) - which is the only way weird stuff can go on.

Last edited by senshincenter : 01-20-2007 at 05:16 PM.

David M. Valadez
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Old 01-20-2007, 06:21 PM   #20
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Re: for all those that think it works

I completly agree with you Mr. Valadez.
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Old 01-20-2007, 08:27 PM   #21
senshincenter
 
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Re: for all those that think it works

Please call me "Dave" - I'd be thankful. :-)

David M. Valadez
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Old 01-21-2007, 02:04 AM   #22
darin
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Re: for all those that think it works

I saw this on tv when I was in Tokyo. He's also some kind of martial arts master.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hvOaO_WXd6w
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Old 01-21-2007, 02:18 AM   #23
Kevin Leavitt
 
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Re: for all those that think it works

David V wrote:

Quote:
Yes, what you say makes sense. I agree. However, at the same time, it seems natural to ask how all those folks (not just "why") bought into all this stuff and then to wonder what all we (I) buy into.
Here is the semi-scientific/pyschological answer to the question:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance
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Old 01-21-2007, 04:48 AM   #24
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Re: for all those that think it works

Quote:
Darin Hyde wrote:
I saw this on tv when I was in Tokyo. He's also some kind of martial arts master.
True...

A secret of internal strength?:
"Let your weight from the crotch area BE in his hands."
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Old 01-22-2007, 04:57 AM   #25
stelios
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Re: for all those that think it works

Justin, do you really, I mean deep inside you, reckon that this sort of power a)exists b)can be mastered by everybody c)experienced and demonstrated at will d)override anyones defences no matter what? I still remain sceptical...
I do not discard it but remain sceptical...
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