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Old 03-09-2005, 05:13 AM   #1
Michael Cardwell
Dojo: Snake River Aikido
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bowing in

I was wondering how different dojos bow in, and if there is a standard way of doing it, because I have not seen any one dojo do the exact same bow in procedure. At the dojo I train at we bow twice, then clap twice, then bow and say: onegai shemas. bowing out is the same, except we say domo arigato. At a seminar with Pat Hendricks, there was two bows and four claps. Frank Duran uses two bows and two claps, but in a different order then ours. And at the last seminar I was at, there was two bows and no claps. I usually manage to mess up at some point during the bow in at other dojos, oh well.

So whats the norm?
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Old 03-09-2005, 05:45 AM   #2
Amir Krause
Dojo: Shirokan Dojo / Tel Aviv Israel
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Re: bowing in

We bow to the Kamiza and sensei, and sometimes to the Sempai (if we are sitting separately which we don't do normally). we do not clap since that is part of a religious (Shinto?) ritual and our religious beliefs are mostly Judaisem (Secular for most). We often perform some short meditation before the bow.

Bowing to Sensei, some say "onegai shemas" at practice start and "Domo-Arigato-Gozaimashta" at the end, others just say "thanks" at the end.

Amir
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Old 03-09-2005, 06:03 AM   #3
Michael Cardwell
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Re: bowing in

Thats fairly close to what we do, I guess every bow in is somewhat similar. My sensei did mention once that we clap twice because that is how he first learned how to bow in, but that he had since learned that this might not be proper because it is a shinto practice ( I'm not sure about clapping four times, but clapping twice is defiantly shinto, if you every watch Tenchi Muyo he claps twice and then says "old shrine habit". Sorry, nerd in came out for a second ). Anyway we use the two claps as a signal to clear our heads and leave everything off the mat, not as any sort of religious practice.
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Old 03-09-2005, 07:19 AM   #4
Yann Golanski
 
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Re: bowing in

"Onegai shimasu" = please let's start / please let's do that... "domo arigato gozaimashita" = thank you very much for what has happened, "domo arigato" = thank you and "domo" = thanks. For a guide to pronunciation see http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2047.html for example...

Etiquette will vary from dojo to dojo so make sure you ask before training as there is no norm... When in Rome do as the Romans.

The people who understand, understand prefectly.
yann@york-aikido.org York Shodokan Aikido
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Old 03-09-2005, 07:45 AM   #5
SeiserL
 
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Re: bowing in

IMHO, follow the etiquette of the dojo you are in.

Lynn Seiser PhD
Yondan Aikido & FMA/JKD
We do not rise to the level of our expectations, but fall to the level of our training. Train well. KWATZ!
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Old 03-09-2005, 08:02 AM   #6
Michael Cardwell
Dojo: Snake River Aikido
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Re: bowing in

[quote=Yann Golanski

Etiquette will vary from dojo to dojo so make sure you ask before training as there is no norm.[/QUOTE]

Thanks Yann, I suspected as much from what I have seen, but I wanted to ask anyway.

[quote= IMHO, follow the etiquette of the dojo you are in.[/QUOTE]

Of course, that was never a question with me. My problem is that I forget to ask what the bow in procedure is before class starts and I am usually left bowing when I should be clapping or clapping when I should be bowing, or clapping when no one at that dojo claps. sigh, it's embarrassing.
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Old 03-09-2005, 08:39 AM   #7
Yann Golanski
 
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Re: bowing in

Michael,

That's why I always introduce myself to the sensei before class. Allows me to ask a few things -- such as what belt colour (s)he's rather see me wear, hakama or not and etiquette. Let others take the lead and follow what they do. Works for me and I haven't been kicked out of a dojo yet...

The people who understand, understand prefectly.
yann@york-aikido.org York Shodokan Aikido
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Old 03-09-2005, 08:47 AM   #8
Jim Simons
Dojo: Aikido in the Fan
Location: Richmond, VA
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Re: bowing in

Our bow-in and bow-out varies depending on who is teaching the class, and we just follow that individual's lead. Mostly we bow to the shomen and then to the sensei, or else bow-two claps-bow to the shomen and then bow to the sensei. One gent has us bow-gassho-bow-two claps-bow to the shomen. That's always struck me as a bit excessive, but I don't have a problem with performing the rei that way when I train in his class.
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Old 03-10-2005, 02:52 PM   #9
Yokaze
 
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Re: bowing in

Woah, I always thought it was "Gozaimasu." I've been taking japanese for some time now and the "thank you very much" is always spelled "Doomo Arigato Gozaimasu" (without the ta at the end.) Maybe it's just a dialect thing.

Anyway, just to throw in my bit, to bow in we sit in seiza with our weapons in front of us. We take several deep breaths before bowing twice, clapping twice, and then touching our foreheads to the mat until the sensei asks us to rise.

^_^

"The only true victory is victory over oneself."

Rob Cunningham
3rd Kyu

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Old 03-10-2005, 03:34 PM   #10
Bronson
 
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Re: bowing in

Quote:
Rob Cunningham wrote:
Woah, I always thought it was "Gozaimasu." I've been taking japanese for some time now and the "thank you very much" is always spelled "Doomo Arigato Gozaimasu" (without the ta at the end.) Maybe it's just a dialect thing.
I've asked the same thing. I believe I was told the -ta is an older, more formal way of saying it. I reserve the right to be incorrect

Bronson

"A pacifist is not really a pacifist if he is unable to make a choice between violence and non-violence. A true pacifist is able to kill or maim in the blink of an eye, but at the moment of impending destruction of the enemy he chooses non-violence."
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Old 03-10-2005, 04:34 PM   #11
AikiSean!
 
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Re: bowing in

Bowing in - sempai hits a very small gong when sensei is visibile, we all line up in ranks in seiza. We have a moment of meditation then bow to Shomen, then sensei, then say "Onegaeshimasu Sensei!". Bowing out we line up in ranks again brief meditation, then bow to shomen, then sensei, say "Domo Arigato Gozaimash'ta Sensei!", then bow to sempai, then each other(more specifically those we've worked with that night.) The bow commands we use are, Shomen ni rei, sensei ni rei. Otagai ni rei. Kikko sheerio(clap).
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Old 03-10-2005, 07:48 PM   #12
Charles Hill
Dojo: Numazu Aikikai/Aikikai Honbu Dojo
Location: Three Lakes WI/ Mishima Japan
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Re: bowing in

Quote:
Rob Cunningham wrote:
Woah, I always thought it was "Gozaimasu." I've been taking japanese for some time now and the "thank you very much" is always spelled "Doomo Arigato Gozaimasu" (without the ta at the end.) Maybe it's just a dialect thing.
It is my understanding that you use the present tense (gozaimasu) to refer to what you will be receiving in the future. If my boss says that he will let me have time off, I say "arigatou gozaimasu." "Mashita" is past tense and refers to what you have already received. Thus, I believe, we should use "gozaimashita" after class.

Charles
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Old 03-10-2005, 07:52 PM   #13
PeterR
 
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Re: bowing in

Hey here's something.

Last night after Judo (where I was totally humiliated) on the way out one of the members said what sounded like Ashta. I asked him "What about tomorrow" and he laughed saying it was a short version of thank you. Never heard that one before.

Peter Rehse Shodokan Aikido
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