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08-31-2005, 12:53 PM
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#26
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Dojo: Aikido West Reading
Location: Reading, Pa
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 261
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
Wear golf shoes and kick hard.
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08-31-2005, 08:26 PM
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#27
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Dojo: Aikido of Ashland
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 395
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
Quote:
Chris Ross wrote:
I know that this might sound quite strange, but try this. Have a training partner bear hug you and lift you off the ground. When he does, stick both of your legs straight out in front of you. This should cause one of two things. If he has his back arched really far to lift you, the two of you may go over backwards, if he doesn't, this should make you pretty tough to keep held up, and he should be forced to set you down, usually rather rapidly. If you try this, I'm curious as to what your feedback is on it.
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I tried this with my cousin anthony (he's pretty strong) and it really did work. He was able to hold me for about 4 or 5 seconds. He said it was really difficult because it put more strain on his back. He said when he got done, the pain in his back was enough of a destraction for the victim to definitely run away. (i hope i didnt hurt him) But anyway , we were both very surprised at this neat little trick.
Just some feedback , Try it yourself if u dont believe me.
-Paige
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08-31-2005, 08:36 PM
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#28
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 5
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
I'm glad to hear that you liked that little trick. My teacher showed me that one, among others, that I found quite entertaining. I particularly like raising my knees to my chest and then kicking straight out, it usually has a more drastic affect. I'm sure that flexibility or lack of, might keep some people from doing it that way though.
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09-01-2005, 09:36 AM
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#29
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 63
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
We covered this one in class. Drop your weight at the hips and groin strike. If you can't drop, reach down and pinch a really tiny piece of skin on their leg. The thin layer of fat there makes it surprisingly painful. You can also use that as a way to create an openinng for the strike.
I guess if they pick you up right off of the ground, kick off of something to knock them back and land right on their head. If you can't do that, you could try hammer kicking them in the knee or something.
Hey, whatever works, but try and get that weight drop at the moment of the grab.
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09-01-2005, 09:38 AM
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#30
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Location: NJ
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 241
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
Just keep a look out for signs in the forest stating.... beware! bear hugging bears afoot and you will be fine
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Dont make me, make you, grab my wrist.
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09-01-2005, 10:48 AM
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#31
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Dojo: Aikido of Lincoln
Location: Lincoln, NE
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 32
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
bear hugging bears aside...
We practiced these a few times when I was training in Daito Ryu (regular bear hugs not the kind intent on a suplex). Most the suggestions for counters started with stomping on the foot and elbowing in the ribs if you were still on the ground. Kicking the knees/groin and reverse head butting if you weren't. But if all of that failed we would use our knuckles on the back of the attackers hand for what we called the metatarsal rub (rubbing the knuckles across the bones in the back of the hand). The pain is excruciating and makes them let go instantaneously (although if the person was "under the influence" it's anyones guess if it would work). At least this option doesn't cause any permanent damage.
Thinking about the suplex, doing this might turn their suplex into a throw, or at the very least send you sliding on your back instead of your head.
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09-01-2005, 11:04 AM
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#32
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Dojo: International Budo Ryokukai (I've been away for some time)
Location: Michigan
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 26
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
You could just leave the bar like the bouncer told you to
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09-01-2005, 03:39 PM
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#33
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Dojo: Aikido West Reading
Location: Reading, Pa
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 261
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
Quote:
Brian Barnard wrote:
You could just leave the bar like the bouncer told you to
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Many years ago I had the interesting experience of being forcefully removed from a local drinking establishment. The hold used was excellent, he grabbed my elbows and pinned them to my sides while lifting up slightly to get me off balance. I have incorporated that style of grab or "attack" into our practice. Like a bear hug, it is difficult to work your way out of when you're caught off guard.
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09-01-2005, 06:03 PM
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#34
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Dojo: Zanshin Kai
Location: Birmingham
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 865
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
Be a tree hugging hippy instead of a bear hugging one?
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09-02-2005, 12:52 AM
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#35
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Dojo: Seibukan Aikido UK
Location: body in UK, heart still in Japan
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 1,031
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
One would hope that you don't get into the position of being hugged and lifted off of the ground, i.e. maintaining zanshin at all times etc. However, just in case I have a lapse in concentration.... .
I decided to play around with this in my class last night. I got the biggest heaviest chap in the room to hug me as tight and hard as he could and to pick me up off the floor, he lifted me like a piece of paper. Despite the tension around my arms and chest, most of the rest of the body was moveable, first attempt I stayed relaxed, rotated my hand and grabbed his "nadgers", he dropped me like I was a piece of hot coal . Second attempt, I just totally relaxed, he managed to keep me off the floor for about 2 seconds before he collapsed under my weight. Third attempt, I just demonstrated the fact that if I stayed relaxed and diddn't fight against his grab, I had a number of different atemi available to me using hands, feet and head.
When the class played with it, it was interesting to see the differences in what each individual thought "relaxed" meant .
Ideally the key is not to fight with the grab, just like any grab, ignore uke and use the rest of your body in a relaxed manner.
Regards
Bryan
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A difficult problem is easily solved by asking yourself the question, "Just how would the Lone Ranger handle this?"
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09-02-2005, 02:36 AM
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#36
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Dojo: White Rose Aikikai - Durham
Location: Newcastle
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 156
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
Stick the nut on, or if your Zanshin isn't too addled by booze, glass him before he gets too close.
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Aikido doesn't work? My Aikido works, what on earth are you practicing?!
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09-02-2005, 02:56 AM
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#37
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Location: Singapore
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 52
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
Quote:
Tim Gerrard wrote:
Stick the nut on, or if your Zanshin isn't too addled by booze, glass him before he gets too close.
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Ha ha !!! That's humorous !! Or try to get your fingers on his....ahem. crotch area. He will never hug you again I promise .
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09-02-2005, 04:25 AM
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#38
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Dojo: Seibukan Aikido UK
Location: body in UK, heart still in Japan
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 1,031
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
Quote:
Jiawei Lee wrote:
Ha ha !!! That's humorous !! Or try to get your fingers on his....ahem. crotch area. He will never hug you again I promise .
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read "nadgers"
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A difficult problem is easily solved by asking yourself the question, "Just how would the Lone Ranger handle this?"
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09-02-2005, 06:17 AM
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#39
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Dojo: Hiroshima Kokusai Dojo
Location: Hiroshima, Japan
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 2,308
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
Hello Everybody,
I assume we are discussing bear hugs from behond and not grips often seen in sumo wrestling, where the opponent attacks from the front, his mawashi is grabbed and he is lifted out of the ring.
Bear hugs from behind could be a crucial problem for some people living in Tokyo and perhaps elsewhere.
There have been cases of people being grabbed from behind during the Tokyo rush hour and pushed off the platform in front of an oncoming train. I am sure that Tokyo is not so unusual, but the rush hour can be awesome, in terms of the sheer numbers of people. Occasionally cases hit the headlines of some mentally deranged guy, let out of an institution, taking a dislike to someone he has never set eyes on before, jumping on them from behind and pushing them on to the tracks. You stand in line, absorbed in your reading or plugged into your I-Pod headphones and suddenly you are A over T and facing train wheels bearing down on you.
O Sensei discusses this question in Budo Resnhuu and in Budo but there are some differences. However, he is very clear that (1) such attacks are very difficult to dea,l with and (2) you need to train constantly to develop the requisite sixth sense.
Best regards,
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P A Goldsbury
_______________________
Kokusai Dojo,
Hiroshima,
Japan
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09-02-2005, 10:29 PM
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#40
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Dojo: None at the moment - on hiatus
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 965
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
Just this week in one of our dojo's jiyu waza session, my adjutant sensei was the shite; myself and two more other were the ukes in our regular san nin dori jiyu waza (three opponent free sparring).
As I was coming in for a shomen uchi attack towards the front side of shite, another uke was coming in from shite behind also with a shomen attack. What adjutant sensei did (in my opinion) was brilliant, he reverse and slam into the rear uke (if you have seen Gozo Shioda's video you will get a better mental picture) using his back. Then he lunged forward and did an kokyu nage on me. The rear uke (a lady uke) was gassed out for a few seconds. His timing was impeccable
Seeing how this thread is regarding what to do wrt bear hugs... I guess that could be one defense just before the hug take place. And maybe also defense against psychotic Japanese during metro rush hour ala Peter G's story.
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SHOMEN-ATE (TM), the solution to 90% of aikido and life's problems.
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09-03-2005, 06:41 AM
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#41
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Dojo: Doshinkan dojo in Roxborough, Pa
Location: Phila. Pa
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 4,615
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
That is one defense...and it is a good one if you have good focus power. Chida Sensei carried an impression of Kancho Sensei's patch for about a week from one of those.
Best,
Ron (didn't try that one on my testing run though)
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Ron Tisdale
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"The higher a monkey climbs, the more you see of his behind."
St. Bonaventure (ca. 1221-1274)
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09-05-2005, 12:22 AM
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#42
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Dojo: Tsubaki Kannagara Jinja Aikidojo; Himeji Shodokan Dojo
Location: Renton
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,276
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
Quote:
Peter Della wrote:
e.g. kicking them in the crotch, head butting them with the back of your head, etc.any ideas?
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I suppose it all depends on the details of the grab. I've used the back of my head to hit someone in the nose before and that was quite effective. I've also slipped out of one fairly strong friend's grab by sinking and raising my arms. I've seen a demonstration where the arms were free and nage knocked uke to the ground such that uke was pinned by nage's body and where nage was able to use his elbows to strike pretty effectively. I'm sure kicking at the knees or groin could potentially work too. I found at my highest level of training whenever someone put a hand on me, my instinct was to close the distance which always seemed to give me a slight advantage whenever friends would try to sneak up on me, but every human has a blind spot, so it seems we're never invulnerable.
I wonder about the scenario of sticking the legs straight out, if, as the attacker, I wouldn't just drop with all my weight trying to break their tail bone, or at least drop them and then pin them to the ground...then again, if I was attacking someone from behind I probably wouldn't grab them as there are so many tender places to strike...not to take away from the fact that this is a good thing to consider. Not everyone thinks the same way after all...
I'll have to try it out on the mat I guess to be more sure.
Take care,
Matt
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Gambarimashyo!
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09-05-2005, 04:14 PM
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#43
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Dojo: White Rose Aikikai - Durham
Location: Newcastle
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 156
Offline
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
Quote:
Jiawei Lee wrote:
Or try to get your fingers on his....ahem. crotch area. He will never hug you again I promise .
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Or he might take a liking to you, then you'll be sorry
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Aikido doesn't work? My Aikido works, what on earth are you practicing?!
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09-05-2005, 11:36 PM
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#44
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Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 241
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
There are several things you can do 3 of whch I will briefly mention:
1. build centripetal force by circulating your center in a continuous tenkan-like fation and open up in such a way that sends uke flying. It is hard for me to describe, I would be much better at demonstrating.
2. Do a forward ukemi roll. He is bond to let go once youhave made him the floor!
3. Pressure points.
I hope this helps!
Brad
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09-06-2005, 06:46 AM
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#45
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Dojo: Zanshin Kai
Location: Birmingham
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 865
Offline
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
tickle him? Or saw "Aww thanks"
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09-06-2005, 10:11 PM
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#46
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Dojo: Tan Aiki Dojo
Location: California
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 202
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
Kiss him??
Seriously, this question has come up before in my (now former) dojo. Believe it or not, look over one shoulder and keep trying to turn your head farther over your shoulder. Don't know exactly how but this will actually pull your attacker off balance and onto the ground. Or at least this works when you are bear-hugged from behind.
The thing I want to know is how did someoen get a frontal bearhug on you to begin with?
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09-06-2005, 11:40 PM
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#47
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Dojo: Wherever I am.
Location: New Zealand
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,013
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
We did a few of these last month. I did two from the front and two from the rear -- varying the attacks to arms-over-arms and arms-under-arms.
We didn't do any lifting versions but in that situation Jujutsu teaches you to headbutt at the moment of contact - either forwards or rearwards depending upon position - not as the end of the technique but as the begining - to stop them getting a firm grip.
Also interesting is if they catch you arms-under-arms from the front, you can catch them arms-over-arms (or vice-versa) and as you meet, the one on-the-ball, or the sharpest, will get the better position (kind of like when shaking hands one person often gets the better grip - if you're quick, it is you). So, just as we often deal with say yokomen in a yokomen kind of way so can we deal with bear hugs in a bear hug kind of way.
Last edited by Rupert Atkinson : 09-06-2005 at 11:44 PM.
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09-14-2005, 04:42 AM
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#48
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Dojo: White Rose Aikido - Durham University
Location: Gateshead
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 916
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
'glass him before he gets too close.'
Jiawei Lee wrote:
Or try to get your fingers on his....ahem. crotch area. He will never hug you again I promise .
'Or he might take a liking to you, then you'll be sorry'
I love you Tim.
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They're all screaming about the rock n roll, but I would say that it's getting old. - REFUSED.
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09-14-2005, 04:43 AM
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#49
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Dojo: White Rose Aikido - Durham University
Location: Gateshead
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 916
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
My uncle once kissed a football hooligan who was about to stitch him one, totally diffused the situation. But then again, I can also imagine it earning you a greater kicking...
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They're all screaming about the rock n roll, but I would say that it's getting old. - REFUSED.
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09-14-2005, 07:24 AM
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#50
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Dojo: University of Iowa Aikikai, Iowa City, IA
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 15
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Re: what do you do from a bear hug attack?
The bear hug was a standard attack in the Yoshinkan style I used to study at Mits Yamashita's dojo in Long Beach. One response I remember from a rear bear hug involves shite moving his arms out and forward and dropping his center to make his upper body more "cone shaped" and loosen uke's grip slightly. Shite then steps forward as if to make a yokomen attack and projects uke around his side. There were other responses.
Charles Cunningham
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