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10-23-2012, 09:39 AM
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#1
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Location: Indianapolis
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 165
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I Was Wrong
In regards to IP/IS I was an extreme skeptic. After spending a weekend training with Mr. Popkin I readily admit I was completely wrong. If you have an opportunity to train with him or Joe Brogna, run, don't walk. He had great things to say about Dan Harden as well.
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10-23-2012, 09:55 AM
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#2
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Location: CA
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 697
Offline
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Re: I Was Wrong
Quote:
Richard Stevens wrote:
In regards to IP/IS I was an extreme skeptic. After spending a weekend training with Mr. Popkin I readily admit I was completely wrong. If you have an opportunity to train with him or Joe Brogna, run, don't walk. He had great things to say about Dan Harden as well.
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Train more, post less. It will be alright. Winding, winding, spiral - puuuulllllling and back bow (trust me - this is way funny in person).
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10-23-2012, 10:20 AM
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#3
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Dojo: Charlotte Aikikai Agatsu Dojo
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,944
Offline
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Re: I Was Wrong
Quote:
Richard Stevens wrote:
In regards to IP/IS I was an extreme skeptic. After spending a weekend training with Mr. Popkin I readily admit I was completely wrong. If you have an opportunity to train with him or Joe Brogna, run, don't walk. He had great things to say about Dan Harden as well.
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come on! he couldn't have known about those stuffs. he spent most of his time fishing, and not even good at it! everyone knows that fishing involved the use of explosive http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSEuD...eature=related therefore, his knowledge of IP/IS is suspect
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10-23-2012, 10:28 AM
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#4
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Dojo: Aikido Sangenkai
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 3,313
Offline
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Re: I Was Wrong
Don't worry, the same thing happened to me.
Best,
Chris
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10-23-2012, 10:32 AM
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#5
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,394
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Re: I Was Wrong
Me too. I thought it was all B.S.
Then I learned
Then...I thought the model was a secret to one art!!
Then two.
Oops!!
Dan
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10-23-2012, 11:15 AM
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#6
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Dojo: Hildesheimer Aikido Verein
Location: Hildesheim
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 932
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Re: I Was Wrong
That's why I love live:
There are gates to be opened.
In a lot of senses.
Everyday.
Change.
Sorry for my english. In German this could be a poem ... :-)))
Last edited by Carsten Möllering : 10-23-2012 at 11:17 AM.
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10-23-2012, 01:12 PM
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#7
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Location: NY
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 54
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Re: I Was Wrong
Welcome to the club
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"Logical consequences are the scarecrows of fools and the beacons of wise men" - Thomas Henry Huxley
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10-23-2012, 02:14 PM
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#8
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Location: CA
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 697
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Re: I Was Wrong
Yup, the real pickle is so what are you going to do now?
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10-23-2012, 02:20 PM
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#9
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Dojo: Aikido Sangenkai
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 3,313
Offline
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Re: I Was Wrong
Quote:
Robert M Watson Jr wrote:
Yup, the real pickle is so what are you going to do now?
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Beer, and a lot of it. Might not help, but it can't hurt, right?
Best,
Chris
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10-23-2012, 02:31 PM
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#10
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Dojo: Aikido Arts of Shin Budo Kai/ Bedford Hills, New York
Location: New York
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 1,302
Offline
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Re: I Was Wrong
Quote:
Christopher Li wrote:
Beer, and a lot of it. Might not help, but it can't hurt, right?
Best,
Chris
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I try not get stuck in a rut, so I switch between beer, sake, red wine and some nice mixed drinks......
Regards,
Marc Abrams
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10-23-2012, 03:26 PM
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#11
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Dojo: Seikokan , Leeuwarden
Location: Leeuwarden. the Netherlands
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 150
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Re: I Was Wrong
That's all fine and dandy but meanwhile I'll be stuck sipping Chardonnay with mr. DH the next couple of days....that's what this IP/Aiki fest seems to call for. And I like my beer...
Cheers
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Ernesto
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10-23-2012, 05:34 PM
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#12
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Dojo: Aiki Kurabu
Location: Elizabethtown, PA
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,110
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Re: I Was Wrong
I have never been wrong in my life - just not as enlightened as I should have been on many occasions is more like it
Greg
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10-23-2012, 05:36 PM
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#13
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Dojo: Aiki Kurabu
Location: Elizabethtown, PA
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,110
Offline
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Re: I Was Wrong
Quote:
Marc Abrams wrote:
I try not get stuck in a rut, so I switch between beer, sake, red wine and some nice mixed drinks......
Regards,
Marc Abrams
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All within the same hour too - you lush
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10-23-2012, 05:44 PM
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#14
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Dojo: Aikido Arts of Shin Budo Kai/ Bedford Hills, New York
Location: New York
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 1,302
Offline
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Re: I Was Wrong
Quote:
Greg Steckel wrote:
All within the same hour too - you lush
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Hey! I resemble that re-marc
Regards,
Marc Abrams
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10-23-2012, 05:49 PM
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#15
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Dojo: Aiki Kurabu
Location: Elizabethtown, PA
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,110
Offline
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Re: I Was Wrong
Quote:
Marc Abrams wrote:
Hey! I resemble that re-marc
Regards,
Marc Abrams
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Oh, you are just so cute when you get witty
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10-23-2012, 08:34 PM
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#16
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Location: San Diego CA USA
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 561
Offline
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Re: I Was Wrong
Quote:
Richard Stevens wrote:
After spending a weekend training with Mr. Popkin I readily admit I was completely wrong.
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Hi Richard- I love me a story. Any chance you can describe a little more the change of heart that you experienced? Was it sudden, like he told you to grab his wrist, and then he shocked and amazed you? Or was it more of a cumulative revalation? Thanks!
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10-24-2012, 05:05 AM
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#17
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Dojo: www.pbjjc.com
Location: Long Island, NY
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 700
Offline
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Re: I Was Wrong
Thanks for the kind words
Great group !!! Lots of hard work .
Hope to see you guys soon,
Best wishes,
Howard
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10-24-2012, 08:29 AM
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#18
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Dojo: Ban Sen Juku Leuven - Masakatsu Dojo
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 15
Offline
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Re: I Was Wrong
Quote:
Richard Stevens wrote:
In regards to IP/IS I was an extreme skeptic. After spending a weekend training with Mr. Popkin I readily admit I was completely wrong. If you have an opportunity to train with him or Joe Brogna, run, don't walk. He had great things to say about Dan Harden as well.
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Nah.... before "the others" were wrong.... & now.... "they" are still wrong.... :-)
enjoy
SC
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10-24-2012, 08:40 AM
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#19
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Location: Indianapolis
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 165
Offline
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Re: I Was Wrong
Quote:
Jonathan Wong wrote:
Hi Richard- I love me a story. Any chance you can describe a little more the change of heart that you experienced? Was it sudden, like he told you to grab his wrist, and then he shocked and amazed you? Or was it more of a cumulative revalation? Thanks!
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I was a bit dumbfounded from the get-go. He started off by having us show one of our basic waza and then he showed us what it was like with "aiki". We can get it to work even with a great deal of resistance, but he did it against full resistance seemingly effortlessly. Everything else was just as impressive. His abilitiy to "connect to the ground" was unbelievable. The experience made me reconsider a lot of my views.
I have to say though, the fact that he is down the earth and seems genuinely interested in helping others improve made it such a good experience.
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10-24-2012, 09:09 AM
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#20
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Dojo: Aikido Kenkyukai International
Location: Ambler, Pennsylvania
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 232
Offline
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Re: I Was Wrong
once Ithought Iwas wrong,but Iwas mistaken
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10-24-2012, 10:48 AM
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#21
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Location: Phoenix, Oregon
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 407
Offline
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Re: I Was Wrong
So, it was aikido, but better? You mention his connection with the ground, and ability to easily perform techniques against profoundly resistant partners. Can you go into more detail?
Most importantly, was he able to convey to you how he did those things? Did he teach you what to do, and have you been able to apply what you were taught effectively?
I am interested. If I had the free time from work, I'd check out a seminar for sure. Folks I know and respect are saying good things about the folks teaching these seminars, but are not saying that they have taken useful stuff out of the seminars and applying the techniques in their own practice. So I am not fully sold on the idea yet. Can you provide anything that would tip the balance?
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10-24-2012, 11:06 AM
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#22
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Dojo: Aikido Sangenkai
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 3,313
Offline
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Re: I Was Wrong
Quote:
Krystal Locke wrote:
Folks I know and respect are saying good things about the folks teaching these seminars, but are not saying that they have taken useful stuff out of the seminars and applying the techniques in their own practice.
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That's because it can't be done.
Not that there won't be things that you can immediately add on, but basically speaking, this stuff is not an add-on. It's not some extra tricks and twists that you can add on to your regular training and go along on your way.
What we're talking about is a fundamental change in the way that you use and condition your body - that change affects everything else and, eventually, is expressed in the technique (it does take some time).
So...rather than doing an "Aiki technique", you do Aiki and the technique expresses that quality of your body (and mind). If that makes sense...
Best thing is to go try it out! Alan Beebe can't be too far from you, and Dan gets down there.
Best,
Chris
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10-24-2012, 11:13 AM
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#23
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Location: Seattle
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 88
Offline
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Re: I Was Wrong
Howard Popkin Sensei and Joe Brogna Senseis are also frequently in the Seattle.
I know it's a fair distance from you, but they are truely excellent teachers.
Pat
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10-24-2012, 11:31 AM
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#24
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Location: Indianapolis
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 165
Offline
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Re: I Was Wrong
Quote:
Krystal Locke wrote:
So, it was aikido, but better? You mention his connection with the ground, and ability to easily perform techniques against profoundly resistant partners. Can you go into more detail?
Most importantly, was he able to convey to you how he did those things? Did he teach you what to do, and have you been able to apply what you were taught effectively?
I am interested. If I had the free time from work, I'd check out a seminar for sure. Folks I know and respect are saying good things about the folks teaching these seminars, but are not saying that they have taken useful stuff out of the seminars and applying the techniques in their own practice. So I am not fully sold on the idea yet. Can you provide anything that would tip the balance?
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Good questions. I don't want to speak out of place, but he did provide us with specific exercises to develop these "abilities". We are in the process of joining the Ginjukai as a study group (consisting of both Aikikai and Dentokan members) to try and further develop these skills under Mr. Popkin's guidance.
While I most certainly won't claim to have developed any "aiki" skills after a mere two days or introduction/practice I find myself at a place where:
1. I know it isn't BS
2. It can be clearly applied to my Jujutsu waza (or more accurately my waza applied to it)
3. My waza will always be severely lacking without it
As I mentioned before I was completely skeptical of the whole IP/IS argument. I expected Mr. Popkin to simply have polished, excellent Jujutsu. It was much more than that. I think the entire weekend he only showed us one kata from Daitoryu. As much as I hate to say this, it has to be felt.
Interestingly I felt more correlation between what Mr. Popkin does and my Iai than I do with my current Jujutsu practice.
Last edited by Richard Stevens : 10-24-2012 at 11:32 AM.
Reason: poor grammar
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10-24-2012, 12:07 PM
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#25
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Location: Phoenix, Oregon
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 407
Offline
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Re: I Was Wrong
Quote:
Christopher Li wrote:
That's because it can't be done.
Not that there won't be things that you can immediately add on, but basically speaking, this stuff is not an add-on. It's not some extra tricks and twists that you can add on to your regular training and go along on your way.
What we're talking about is a fundamental change in the way that you use and condition your body - that change affects everything else and, eventually, is expressed in the technique (it does take some time).
So...rather than doing an "Aiki technique", you do Aiki and the technique expresses that quality of your body (and mind). If that makes sense...
Best thing is to go try it out! Alan Beebe can't be too far from you, and Dan gets down there.
Best,
Chris
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I am not looking for add-ons to my technique. I have twenty shitty tricks to make my uke move or hurt more, and I am looking to rid my aikido of those tricks in favor of clean, effective technique. I see what you're saying, move the body differently, ingrain different internal responses to stimulus, and the techniques will naturally change, and you believe they will be more effective and flow more naturally from the stimulus. I am way alright with that. I'd like to learn more about that.
But at the end of the day, yes I am looking to learn that to improve my aikido, in the sense that I am making something that is me and mine, and I will use it in my life, and my expression of my physicality, my way through life with energy that works well. Not as an add-on, but as a change in foundation. And to impress the hot chicks in my aikido class. And beer.
Yes, It Has To Be Felt. When several of my friends are telling me something is the goods, and I read other folks saying they're having good results, I am curious, and want a look. I'm still going to be a skeptic, the metaphors better just be metaphors and be useful metaphors, and I had better feel a quantitative as well as qualitative difference. But I will give it a look. Thanks for avoiding any hucksterism or condescension.
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