Welcome to AikiWeb Aikido Information
AikiWeb: The Source for Aikido Information
AikiWeb's principal purpose is to serve the Internet community as a repository and dissemination point for aikido information.

Sections
home
aikido articles
columns

Discussions
forums
aikiblogs

Databases
dojo search
seminars
image gallery
supplies
links directory

Reviews
book reviews
video reviews
dvd reviews
equip. reviews

News
submit
archive

Miscellaneous
newsletter
rss feeds
polls
about

Follow us on



Home > AikiWeb Aikido Forums
Go Back   AikiWeb Aikido Forums > General

Hello and thank you for visiting AikiWeb, the world's most active online Aikido community! This site is home to over 22,000 aikido practitioners from around the world and covers a wide range of aikido topics including techniques, philosophy, history, humor, beginner issues, the marketplace, and more.

If you wish to join in the discussions or use the other advanced features available, you will need to register first. Registration is absolutely free and takes only a few minutes to complete so sign up today!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 06-06-2007, 01:47 PM   #1
antonis paps
 
antonis paps's Avatar
Location: greece
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 56
Greece
Offline
Talking Surprise!

mm..
Is the element of surprise,
dangerous,?
for an instructor to use in training?
Meaning,
to surprise his uke into..
for instance a powerful breakfall.

Thank you,
Antonis Papas.

Τὰ πάντα ῥεῖ , What Flows, Is.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2007, 02:23 PM   #2
aikidoc
Dojo: Aikido of Midland
Location: Midland Texas
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 1,652
United_States
Offline
Re: Surprise!

Depends. Its it controlled or dangerous. Ukes should not anticipate but instructors should not injure by being out of control.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2007, 04:10 PM   #3
justin
Location: swansea wales
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 250
United Kingdom
Offline
Re: Surprise!

as long as the instructor picks a senior student who he knows can take good ukemi then surprise is good for response, i also think it has a lot to do with the personalilty of the student some would appreciate it whilst others might not, a good judgement call is required here.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2007, 04:34 PM   #4
MikeLogan
 
MikeLogan's Avatar
Location: Rochester, NY
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 281
United_States
Offline
Re: Surprise!

It is the role of the instructor to have a sense of their student's individual aptitudes, and for them to nurture/develop those aptitudes in a manner deemed by the instructor to be within the realm achievable by the student.

If a student is surprised by the outcome, well then yippee-kayay. (of course this assumes a preferable outcome) New knowledge should be a surprise.

michael.

If way to the better there be, it exacts a full look at the worst.

- Thomas Hardy
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2007, 04:51 PM   #5
Janet Rosen
 
Janet Rosen's Avatar
Location: Left Coast
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 4,339
Offline
Re: Surprise!

When I was 4th and 3rd kyu and starting to learn front breakfalls (as from koshinage), once my body had some familiarity with the landing position, the best breakfalls I had were from senior students or instructor giving me NO CHOICE, just throwing me into them. I was much more prone to mess up, mistime, or land badly with less secure nages "trying to take care of me" and in the process making ME partly jump into the fall.
There are other similar examples in my training that lead me to say that in the hands of a highly competent partner you trust, and who knows your capabilities, suprise is actually a GOOD thing for realizing what you can actually do!

Janet Rosen
http://www.zanshinart.com
"peace will enter when hate is gone"--percy mayfield
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2007, 09:01 PM   #6
Roman Kremianski
Dojo: Toronto Aikikai
Location: Toronto, Canada
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 404
Canada
Offline
Re: Surprise!

Why
do you
always
type like
this?

Or is something screwed up with your type in your browser?
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2007, 09:37 PM   #7
xuzen
 
xuzen's Avatar
Dojo: None at the moment - on hiatus
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 965
Malaysia
Offline
Re: Surprise!

Quote:
Antonis Paps wrote: View Post
mm..
Is the element of surprise,
dangerous,?
for an instructor to use in training?
Meaning,
to surprise his uke into..
for instance a powerful breakfall.

Thank you,
Antonis Papas.
In Kata practice it is a big NO. Simple reason being that we do not want to cause unnecessary injuries.

However, in RAN-DORI, element of surprise is a part and parcel of trying to get the IPPON (winning point)!

Boon.

SHOMEN-ATE (TM), the solution to 90% of aikido and life's problems.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2007, 12:35 PM   #8
ramenboy
Dojo: midwest aikido center
Location: chicago
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 347
Offline
Re: Surprise!

Quote:
Roman Kremianski wrote: View Post
Why
do you
always
type like
this?
hahahahahahahahahahaha

anyways,

antonis, in answer to your question, maybe. if the instructor is trying to prove a point, like pointing out a good time for atemi, or for an opening to counter if the technique is sloppy. maybe. and if the uke is more experienced. maybe.

but in regular practice, no. in any of the stuff we practice, uke has a roll and nage has a roll. we both know exactly what the technique is gonna be. the instructor tells us. so in the practice, uke works on his ukemi , giving an honest, sincere attack, and nage works on his technique.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2007, 01:18 PM   #9
Aikibu
Dojo: West Wind Dojo Santa Monica California
Location: Malibu, California
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,295
United_States
Offline
Re: Surprise!

Quote:
Xu Wenfung wrote: View Post
In Kata practice it is a big NO. Simple reason being that we do not want to cause unnecessary injuries.

However, in RAN-DORI, element of surprise is a part and parcel of trying to get the IPPON (winning point)!

Boon.
Agreed.

William Hazen
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2007, 02:22 PM   #10
Marc Abrams
Dojo: Aikido Arts of Shin Budo Kai/ Bedford Hills, New York
Location: New York
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 1,302
United_States
Offline
Re: Surprise!

The instructor is responsible for the safety of his/her students. My teacher does not tell us what technique he is going to demonstrate on us and to what level of intensity it will be applied. He is acutely aware of not only the overall ability of the chosen uke, but what that uke is capable of receiving at that moment. This real connection has meant that NONE of his ukes have ever been injured by his demonstrating a technique on that person.

If teaching is done in this manner, then the level of "surprise" should be managed in a safe and controlled environment.

marc abrams
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2007, 02:59 PM   #11
antonis paps
 
antonis paps's Avatar
Location: greece
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 56
Greece
Offline
Re: Surprise!

Quote:
Roman Kremianski wrote: View Post
Why
do you
always
type like
this?

Or is something screwed up with your type in your browser?
nihil
ad
rem

I
like
it.

Τὰ πάντα ῥεῖ , What Flows, Is.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2007, 01:25 AM   #12
xuzen
 
xuzen's Avatar
Dojo: None at the moment - on hiatus
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 965
Malaysia
Offline
Re: Surprise!

Speaking of surprises...

I was doing JIYU-WAZA with a lowly shodan yesterday in aikido class and somehow he came in and clinched (ala bear hug manner). Lowly shodan is a young lad... full of muscle but not so full of experience.

I manage to pull of a unconspicious Kosoto Gake (Small outside hook) and floored lowly sho-dan. He sprained his ankle and had to sit out the remaining class. He was full of surprise because I never telegraph at all what I was going to do next.

Surprises HURTS.. that is why I hate surprises.

Boon.

SHOMEN-ATE (TM), the solution to 90% of aikido and life's problems.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What a Surprise ~RIYO~ Humor 2 08-03-2005 02:52 PM
Poll: Do you prefer your aikido rank tests announced (planned) or unannounced (surprise)? AikiWeb System AikiWeb System 15 12-09-2004 04:19 PM
Surprise Ikkyo and Ukemi musing willy_lee Training 4 06-03-2004 06:50 PM
Suprise grading. Genex General 11 10-07-2002 09:58 AM
Surprise Ni Kyu Test! Sherman Byas Training 5 05-21-2002 04:47 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:01 PM.



vBulletin Copyright © 2000-2024 Jelsoft Enterprises Limited
----------
Copyright 1997-2024 AikiWeb and its Authors, All Rights Reserved.
----------
For questions and comments about this website:
Send E-mail
plainlaid-picaresque outchasing-protistan explicantia-altarage seaford-stellionate