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Old 03-30-2002, 10:41 PM   #1
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 45
Exclamation Just a comment on one of the poles

I was reading the results of one of the poles this morning and it said,"Do you think running away from an attacker is a valid method of resolving conflict using aikido?"
and the result was 477 votes (64%). now according to the Art of Peace -
By Morihei Ueshiba it says "In the Art of Peace we never attack. An attack is proof that one is out of control.Never run away from any kind of challenge, but do not try to suppress or control an opponent unnaturally. Let attackers come any way they like and then blend with them. Never chase after opponents. Redirect each attack and get firmly behind it."

now if you do not know that paragraph you have not read nor studyed the art of peace.

now after reading that and seeing the results of the poles.... is there somthing I am missing here?
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Old 03-31-2002, 08:50 AM   #2
Gene McGloin
Dojo: Bond St. Dojo
Location: Bronx, NY
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 23
Just a side note. "The Art of Peace" was not written by Ueshiba Morihei. That book was written by John Stevens and is a compilation of Ueshiba osensei poems which Mr. Stevens had translated.


Gene McGloin
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Old 04-02-2002, 10:56 AM   #3
Bruce Baker
Dojo: LBI Aikikai/LBI ,NJ
Location: Barnegaat, NJ
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 893
results of poles

There is a double meaning in what O'Sensei writes, and what he apparently means ... some times even he admitted that he didn't know what he was saying, it was the gods speaking through him.

As for John Steven sensei, he too admits to translating to the "meaning of the words", not the exact translation of the text. Supporting these translations are supporting statements by K. Ueshiba, who approves of the these interpretations.

( If you get a chance to do a seminar with John Stevens do it, it is quite a lot of fun. He sometimes brings materials not readily available in bookstores, plus you can speak to him after the seminar, a very nice man is he.)

The two edged sword is written word, verses the practiced methods of society. Hey, the communist manifesto was one of the great freedom documents of the twentieth century, but the implimentation of freedon for communism was quite different, wasn't it? So too, it is up to all of us to establish the spirit of the word over the letter of the word as to its meaning and implimentation. Aikido tend to be the practice which creates meaning.

Something like, I went to the Circus from another country. I didn't understand what they were saying, but I laugh, I cried, and I cheered none the less at what I saw.

Isn't Aikido like that, we "get it", even without the words?
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Old 04-03-2002, 10:18 AM   #4
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 45
mabye it iwas a mis translation or somthing?. or its like the bible and can be interprested in many different ways. well anyway I have work now thanks for the information it clears up alot for me..... sorta haha.
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Old 04-03-2002, 10:25 AM   #5
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 45
mabye he ment to say "do not give up with any kind of challenge" instead of "Never run away from any kind of challenge" then it can be interpreted... like it means run like to hinder just not literaly run like one would to get away from an opponent. mabye? well thats what I assume. any way tell me what you think.....
(I am late for work now )
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Old 04-03-2002, 12:58 PM   #6
Brian Vickery
Dojo: Aiki-Buken Aikido
Location: Gilbert, Arizona
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 208
Thumbs up Re: Just a comment on one of the poles

Originally posted by njnoexit
Never run away from any kind of challenge

now after reading that and seeing the results of the poles.... is there somthing I am missing here?
Hello Adrain,

Yes, I do believe you are missing something ...you must apply this 'philosophy' based on the context of the situation.

If you're in the dojo, and are challenged to prove the effectiveness of a particular technique, or aikido as an art itself, then I feel you must/might address the challenge (...again, it all depends on the context of the challenge - challenger).

BUT, if you're attacked out in the street, particulary by someone weilding a weapon, this is a self defense situation ...and in my humble opinion, if you do the have the opportunity to turn & run, yet decide to stand & fight, you've made a grave mistake! (...no pun intended!!!)

Also, depending which state you happen to be in, laws concerning 'self defense' are very specific. Some states REQUIRE you to run away if you have the opportunity to do so; and practically every state removes your right to self defense if you're engaging in combat by agreement (aka: a fight!). The bottom line is that you're going to end up in jail if you attempt to defend 'aikido' against a challenge!

If you are interested in looking into your states statutes concerning self defense, try this website to get you started:


...just my 2 cents worth!

Last edited by Brian Vickery : 04-03-2002 at 03:20 PM.

Brian Vickery

"The highest level of technique to achieve is that of having NO technique!"
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Old 04-03-2002, 01:59 PM   #7
Paul Clark
Dojo: Yellow Springs Aikido
Location: Dayton, Ohio
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 52
What's all this about Poles running away? They fought bravely against the German invasion in '39 . . .

sorry, couldn't resist.
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Old 04-12-2002, 10:40 PM   #8
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 45
hahaha very intelegent!
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Old 04-12-2002, 10:44 PM   #9
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 45
Ohh yea and brian thanks alot It helped clear up it alot. and Naturally i would run from som guy saying give me your money while pointing a knife at me. good thing I do a mile everynight but there are interactions through everyday life that can not be avoided. and the best was to solve them is to act.... so I figure that you should only run away from some situations not all.
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Old 04-13-2002, 10:15 AM   #10
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 28
What if he had a knife, but you were just coming home from Kenjitsu practice?


"Expect Nothing, Be Ready For Anything"
-Samurai Battle Chant
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Old 04-13-2002, 11:51 AM   #11
Johan Tibell
Dojo: Aikido Dojo Gamlestaden
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 56
Originally posted by ndiegel
What if he had a knife, but you were just coming home from Kenjitsu practice?

Have given this one some thought.

1. The I have a bigger knife than you scenario (Crocodile Dundee). Someone going home after iaido practice...

2. We usualy go out to some pub after a yearly training camp we arange in Gothenburg every year. 60 or so under-cover martial artists. Now if only someone just could pick a fight with one of us...

- Johan

Pour your spirit and heart
Into daily technical training
To approach the many through a single principle
This is "The Way of the Fighting Man"
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