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Old 02-15-2006, 04:30 PM   #576
CNYMike
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Nick Simpson wrote:
If its in a 'fight' is it still aikido? Is it still aiki? .....
Yeah, to borrow a line from The Oracle, that one is guarunteed to bake your noodle. Has Zen Koan written all over it.

Well, if we assume for the sake of arguments that Ki exists and Aiki is one of the things you can do with it, then it can happen at any time -- you don't turn your ki off when you leave the dojo -- so yeah, it should be possible in an altercation.

Whether that inculdes an irimi/clothesline is another matter. [Robert Duval] I love the smell of brains baking, in the evening; clears out the lungs ....[/Robert Duval]
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Old 02-16-2006, 06:21 AM   #577
justinmaceachern
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

cant beleive this thread is still going. it shouldnt be Aikido doesnt work in a fight. It should be How can we use aikido in a fight
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Old 02-16-2006, 08:24 AM   #578
Dirk Hanss
 
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Justin,
my feeling is that the thread is being kept alive by many "rubbish-thread" comments, including a few of mine .
You can start the new one with your question and then probably one of the first replies would be: "study aikido, wwork hard and seriously, train more often!"
The second would be : "crosstrain BJJ, JuJustu, Chinese, etc.!"
And then your new thread would look like this one plus everything you can read in one of our 20 crosstrain-threads.

Maybe we just should ask Jun to move it to the humour-section LOL


Dirk
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Old 02-16-2006, 09:17 AM   #579
ian
 
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

After having read through all 577 posts I fell thoroughly into a deep and peaceful sleep....


z z z z z z z z z z z z z
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Old 02-16-2006, 09:38 AM   #580
justinmaceachern
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

thanks dirk, i just think it is a bit rediculouse. i want to say who cares, but obviously i do. Can any one tell me what "shugyo" means
If you could my mind would feel a lot better
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Old 02-16-2006, 12:23 PM   #581
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Michael Gallagher wrote:

Well, if we assume for the sake of arguments that Ki exists and Aiki is one of the things you can do with it, then it can happen at any time -- you don't turn your ki off when you leave the dojo -- so yeah, it should be possible in an altercation. [/Robert Duval]

Of coarse Ki exists, what do you think heats frying pans, turns on light, makes those little balls click back and forth, and makes sounds appear? If you replace all the trumped up mysticism attached to the word "ki" or "chi" and use the common english word energy we will no longer have a problem. And as far as Aiki being something you can do with "ki", if you've ever danced to a song you've experienced "Aiki", your rhythmic interaction with sound (energy).

-Chris Hein
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Old 02-17-2006, 12:01 AM   #582
xuzen
 
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Justin MacEachern wrote:
Can any one tell me what "shugyo" means
I googled it and it meant in martial art context to be
austere / spartan / hardship.

However, reading it in Kanji form, Shugyo reads in Cantonese (chinese) as Shao Hang. Literally it means Cultivating Merits. It is a word originated from buddhist ideology.

Boon.

SHOMEN-ATE (TM), the solution to 90% of aikido and life's problems.
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Old 02-20-2006, 10:41 AM   #583
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Well I must say ...Iam not sure if Joey Sola is still interested in hearing a reply . After all, his original post was quite a long time ago. However, I found not only his post, but all the replies so interesting...that I actually joined this site, just so I could reply to this. Well..first off lets be clear about certain things: 1) With words we are limited as to what we can convey (unless we do what one person suggested & get everyone together to actually test aikido techniques in mixed martial arts tournament). 2) Any technique can work ONCE in a real street fight...from any martial art..provided the timing is correct (it does not mean it will work again even under the exact conditions). 3) What was not mentioned to Joey Sola ...by anyone on this site ...is that there are other styles of Aikido which do included striking and grappling .Lets start with point # 3..there is the "Soft style" of Aikido and there is also the "hard style". For example, I would encourage Joey Sola to look up "Nihon Goshin Aikido"..which is a combination of Aikido, Judo, Jujutsu, and karate. As many of you are probably aware ..the japanese police are trained in the above "hard style" Aikido. Now Joey Sola..you tell me if this sounds like the kind of training that would be useful in a "real" street fight. I am going to describe an actual training drill from the Nihon Goshin Aikido School. Picture yourself sitting on the floor in a kneeling position...your opponent is allowed to go behind you and apply any grip,choke or techinque(no strikes) ..but wait..there is more...YOU ARE BLINFOLDED WHILE THIS GOING ON. Now you have to defend yourself purely on instinct. This type of instinct is what the fellow writes about that responded on this site ...with the actual fight he had with some drunk guys at the 7/11...or the type of instinct that Bruce Lee mentions in the unedited version of "Enter the Dragon", were he says the "it".."hits all by itself". It might seem extreme to perform groundwork blindfolfed..but Joey..that is Aikido. Aikido is a very misunderstood martial art because it borders on the abstract & esoteric. However, Joey I will give you this ..and here most Aikidoists on this site will disagree with me...but in my opinion ..even an experience aikido player will find it difficult to deal with a lightning fast straight jab (this statement is based from my actual training in the dojo). So yes I believe Aikido is limited...but then again every single martial art is. That is why mixed martial arts were developed...however ..to hone your fighting instinct, to learn about defense against armed attacks (guns,knives, etc. )..to learn to deal with multiple attackers..to learn to escape common grips and strangles..Aikido is in a class by itself. No other style is covers so wide an area in self defense. But the key here is "DEFENSE". I will quote Wally Jay, the founder of small circle jujitsu who said "it is not how much damage you can do to an opponent, but how little damage you can do while still controlling him". I think that quote (at least to me), really captures the spirit of Aikido. To control someone in a real street fight..were you beat him ..without harming him..as if saying I can beat without hurting you...is more humiliating that getting beat by getting bloody nose (at least to me).
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Old 02-20-2006, 12:58 PM   #584
Jorge Garcia
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

John,
You wrote,
"but in my opinion ..even an experience aikido player will find it difficult to deal with a lightning fast straight jab (this statement is based from my actual training in the dojo)."

You're right, I for one do disagree ( but only to a point).
You made somewhat of a blanket statement. You couldn't possibly know if your statement was true in every Aikido dojo in the world. I think you need to qualify which Aikidoists could handle a lighting fast punch. Having said that, I will say that it is true that the way many aikidoists train, they couldn't handle a lightening fast punch but you would have to have all knowledge for your first statement to be true.
I know of a shihan who was once known at the Aikikai Hombu dojo as the fastest man there. He was known within the dojo for being able to do any techniques faster than anyone else. I watched a tape from with his dojo when he was in his 50's and the ukes were running at him and attacking his as fast as they could and he was responding in kind. Some people have and do train within aikido for fas,t full speed attacks.
Secondly you said that mixed martial arts were created to cover the inadequacies of the separate martial arts. That may be true but just because that may have been the case doesn't mean that is legitimate. I don't happen to believe that a person needs mixed martial arts to adequately defend themselves against different arts or attackers if in fact they are good enough at one art. I actually believe the opposite. In my training in three martial arts, I have come to believe that each art is difficult to learn and the more arts you train in, the more diffused your effectiveness becomes overall. It may be that 10 years in one art will equal 10 years in 3 arts but again, that would depend on the natural talent and skill of the martial artist and not on the arts themselves.
Best wishes,

"It is the philosophy that gives meaning to the method of training."
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Old 03-21-2006, 10:53 AM   #585
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

First off I wanted to emphasize that Iam of the opinion, that it is imperative that we continue this thread...that ultimately (hopefully) it will lead to a better understanding of an often misunderstood art...Aikido. I wanted to clarify that because I stated that mixed martial arts were developed to try and cover the inadequacies of other specific arts, it does NOT mean Iam saying that I advocate mixed martial arts over any specific art including aikido. In point #2 of my first post I state that " Any technique can work once from any martial art, provided the timing is correct (this does not mean it will work again under the exact conditions)"...now the above applies to mixed martial arts as well. In fact personally, I prefer the traditional arts over the relative new fad of mixed martial arts (as prompted by UFC for example). Now lets examine what is it that makes any technique work in a real street fight? To answer that I would have to make reference to what I think is a pivotal book on aikido called "Aikido and the Dynamic Sphere". In it the author states that there are 3 stages which determine the outcome of any potentially dangerous physical confrontation: 1)Perception 2) Evaluation-Decision 3) Reaction..the author further states the lapse of time between these 3 stages is what determines how efficiently one can defend himself/herself. In addition, the author states that Aikido teaches the frame of mind in which all three stages become simultaneous. Now is it the art or the artist which determines if a technique works in a fight? I would have to say it is a combination of both, and not one specifically. Now to address another issue which was adressed in the response to my original post, and one which has personally plaqued me.... Aikido and lack of defense against the straigh jab. True I cant say that what I have seen in my dojo applies everywhere . From my experience and my research I dont believe that Aikido teaches any specific defense against a straight jab at full speed (and one which retracts at impact). At my particular dojo we did train in full speed realistic attacks, except when first learning a techique. In closing, it seems that Joey Sola still makes a valid point when he mentions the inadequacies of Aikido against the straight lead jab coming from an experienced boxer (who can make it more difficult by keeping you at bay with low kicks to the shin and knee area if he is also trained in that area).
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Old 03-21-2006, 11:56 AM   #586
Dirk Hanss
 
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

John,
if the experienced Boxer/Karateka/mmartist is too fast for the specific aikidoka to react, none of the techniques would work. If the aikidoka is reacting instinctly, every technique against a tsuki would work against a jab, always adapted to the speed and flow of energy of the jab.

In practise, what is the standard technique of a boxer against a jab? Either to step back just a bit or a counterjab, right? In aikido these techniques are called ma-ai and atemi and work as well, if trained at the dojo. As long as it is a perfect jab that would be the preferred techniques, unless you really know how to step in. If it moves on that way for a while, it is a question, who is getting tired first. A boxer would try to find a point, where he could enter with a full power punch of the second hand and in most professional fights that I have seen, if those do not hit, there is a week point for a counter or an aikido technique.

Probably the better fighter will win and in my case, it might be the boxer, as it is a long time ago that I trained full contact.

If I thought I needed it, I probably would change dojo or ask for extra training. Fortunately the few street rowdies, I met in the recent years were very bad fighters. So for me it would be more dangerous to train full contact combat, than getting severe injuries in street fights.

I know, aikido works in a fight, I do not claim, that aikido works better than any other MA.

Don't take it too serious, but I can tell you that I only heard about one shodokai aikidoka, who was defeated in a MMA or UFC fight. There might be one or two more, that I have not heard about. But I have seen a lot of wrestlers, boxers, jujustuka, bjj'ler, jusoka, karateka, Mouay Tai fighter, and original MMArtists who looked bad and were awfully defeated in those fights. So do you know, why only few aikidoka lost a fight? The others knew how to avoid it

HAND

Dirk
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Old 03-22-2006, 02:10 PM   #587
Kevin Leavitt
 
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

John thought I'd offer my perspective on a few things.

John Block wrote:
Quote:
called "Aikido and the Dynamic Sphere". In it the author states that there are 3 stages which determine the outcome of any potentially dangerous physical confrontation: 1)Perception 2) Evaluation-Decision 3) Reaction..the author further states the lapse of time between these 3 stages is what determines how efficiently one can defend himself/herself.
I have no problem with this theory and in a sense much of it is true. I really need to go back and review this material again...but i'd also add this:

This is a scholarly dissection of the dynamics of a fight. Some what "romanticized" by what most people percieve how fights start and end. there are a few other elements/factors that play into fights that cannot be ignored. The author does state that time is the main factor that determines the outcome. I think this is probably the most important and often overlooked thing in a fight. Here are some thoughts:

Suprise, stealth, superior fire power...etc. You can percieve whatever you want to, but if someone "ambushes" you...your perception does not matter at all...only theirs. You have no choice to do anything other than what they do to you. (I believe the authors wrap all this up under the "time" aspect of things.

Evaluation and Design: again, i really probably need ot review this to completely understand where the authors are coming from...evaluation: if you are still alive and conscious after being attacked...yes you can evaluate your situation and figure out a strategy for minimizing your losses and trying to turn the tables to gain a degree of control. not sure how design plays into it? anyone? Does this refer to weapons/no weapons...distance etc..things like the situation you are presented with.? That has a huge factor for sure!

Reaction. real important. I think one of the biggest criticisms outsiders have of aikido is that we do not spend time conditioning the proper reactive responses under stress. I agree. I also don't believe that this has much place in aikido since in order to condition yourself to respond appropriately to learn Aikido (not fighting) you need to move slowly, methodically, and learn good habits. If your goal is to be a good (insert your favorite reality based scenario here), then you practice things that are geared toward developing those appropriate responses.

Personally I think there is room for slow/methodical training and for trainng for overstress. I think that it does not fit well in most aikido dojos however, nor should it necessarily.


Quote:
In addition, the author states that Aikido teaches the frame of mind in which all three stages become simultaneous.
Again, in theory i'd say this is true, and over time i'd say this is true. How much time? 5, 10, 20 years of dedicated practice..then still are there any guarantees? no?

I think if you are focused on some reality based scenario or have a goal to mitigate a particular risk...you focus on developing a training methodology around that. Aikido is a DO art that is philsophically based to develop things such as spirit or character (good things IMHO), but don't try and bend the art to address "Self defense" scenarios...there are simply more efficient ways to train for this stuff if you have identified a particular risk.

Quote:
Now is it the art or the artist which determines if a technique works in a fight? I would have to say it is a combination of both, and not one specifically.
I'd say it is much more complicated than that. It could be the 300lb dude that jumped out from behind a door with a huge crowbar and just bashed in your brains before you could "precieve" what just happened to you.

In all seriousness, I am not trying to attack you, only point out that we all have paradigms about the world and how it works, much of it is based on us unconsciously trying to mitigate our fears. We like for things to be neat tidy. Us intelligent aikido types like to think that we can mentally figure all this out, get the whole thing put together and be able to take care of ourselves. The fact is that for some of us, it may just be that our luck ran out and our time is up!

We probably can't even begin to prepare ourselves at all for the real threat that will take us out! All we can do is make ourselves better people, live good lives, reduce risk where we can, and be prepared to die or get mugged with dignity hopefully when the time comes! I think M/As and aikido prepare us more to deal with things from this standpoint than for any self defense standpoint.

Quote:
Now to address another issue which was adressed in the response to my original post, and one which has personally plaqued me.... Aikido and lack of defense against the straigh jab.
I know I cut out alot of your post...but why concentrate on a straight jab? Aikido will fail mostly because you are focused on the wrong things. There are many more questions to ask, and to me it is much more complicated than that! Why are you standing there squared off with a guy that want to throw a jab? Apparently he has no weapon if he is throwing a jab? why not run away? why not talk him down? list can go on? Maybe he is throwing a jab and has a weapon...so why do you want to engage?

The point is, again as the authors point out perception is important. We must make sure we are framng it right. Evaluation and Design...also important..as well as your reaction. I think aikido trains our minds more to deal with people on a interpersonal level than defend against the romantic notion of a jab.

There is a reason the military doesn't spend time with aikido, nor the UFC type guys...there are simply more effective ways to deal with raw physical confrontation than aikido.

That is not to say that there is nothing to learn on the interpersonal level through aikido that can go along way from avoiding or de-escalating certain situations that can turn phyisical, but that is another issue all entirely.

I think we just need to really evaluate why we study aikido...to me it never is about self defense. Good stuff, I like having these conversations. Good material to evolve an intelligent conversation. I only hope my ramblings make some sense!
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Old 03-22-2006, 02:21 PM   #588
Ron Tisdale
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

I'm sorry, not pick any nits, but

Quote:
the romantic notion of a jab.
That just struck me as funny...there has never been anything at all romantic about any jab I've ever been hit with. Including a few from a woman kickboxer I knew long, long ago and far, far away...

Best,
Ron

Ron Tisdale
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"The higher a monkey climbs, the more you see of his behind."
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Old 03-22-2006, 03:55 PM   #589
Kevin Leavitt
 
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

yea looking at it a guess it is kinda funny! I always picture a early 1900s boxer with his fist up turned with a slight british acent asking his opponent if he wants to engage in fistacuffs!
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Old 03-22-2006, 04:11 PM   #590
marduk
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Sorry. It works.

After training for 3 years I found myself in a bar between 3 guys that wanted to fight a friend for some reason. Being younger, I stood my ground between them asking them to walk away. The 3 didn't. Two of them immediatly tried to push me out of the way while the third went after my friend. Without thinking, I did sokomen iriminage on both of them at once. They were caught completely off guard and flew off the dance floor onto their ass.

The third put up his hands and backed away. Because I wasn't aggressive, the bouncers didn't even give me a hard time.

Like anything, you do have to train hard and with a martial intent.

That was 8 years ago now.
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Old 03-22-2006, 04:47 PM   #591
Ronin007
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Hi,

This is my first post so please done rip into me to much , and to be honest I coud'nt think of a better subject to first post on, being deep and complicated as one is prepared to make of it.

In my short time of practise it has proven difficult to use Aikido in a 'Sparring' situation, i.e. Kumite, perhaps that fact that i.e. Karate can been seen with a slightly more aggressive, punch kicks etc, not that I'm implying Aikido to be soft (As we all know, its not - if my Sensei thought that what I was implying then I would have Ukemi practise for a week ) Karate would seem to have more of a 'Face Value'.

When Jason was forced to use his Aiki, it came to his aid successfully, surely if it didnt this doesnt make Aikido ineffective, every situtaion has different facts, the main one, the Aikidoka.

Just for example if a more combative/aggressive Art would of 'failed' would this make that Art ineffective?

To be honest this is'nt what I had in mind to write but I hoped I managed to get my some of my view across.

Thanks

Sam
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Old 03-22-2006, 05:18 PM   #592
Mark Freeman
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Kevin Leavitt wrote:
yea looking at it a guess it is kinda funny! I always picture a early 1900s boxer with his fist up turned with a slight british acent asking his opponent if he wants to engage in fistacuffs!
And what pay tell, my good man, is so funny about a british accent and for that matter a good old bout of fisticuffs

kindest regards, from one of her majesty's loyal subjects
Mark

p.s i enjoyed your previous post (#587) Kevin, alot of good points, thanks.

Success is having what you want. Happiness is wanting what you have.
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Old 03-23-2006, 05:11 PM   #593
Kevin Leavitt
 
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Kinda more like a fake british accent like Niles Crane from Fraizer.

Sam, welcome!

When I first started aikido, I approached it from the paradigm of judging each and every move and technique for it's efficiency and effectiveness. Seems only logical right? I mean from a logical standpoint we should be able to "reverse engineer" and slow things down, break it down into small tiny pieces, dissect things to the very base elements and put it all back together in a methodology that works.

Why waste your time with things that are ineffective?

That is the way we are wired to think. Humans are problem solvers by nature. We were cold and we discovered radiant heat from fire, so we figured out how to process and make fire....that is what we do!

Why should martial arts be any different?

That is the logic of it all! it should be like that!

Unfortunately, with life there are things that get in the way...that cloud and muddy the waters. Situations, emotions, fears, factors...that we either cannot control or that we simply cannot understand or process (or percieve to use the Aikido and the Dynamic Sphere example).

So emotion, irrationality, and paradigms become a big part of what influences conflict.

I submit that when you enter a fight it is certainly possible to apply aiki principles, but not aiki technique. I may look at the situation and say..."yeah I used a irminage or a shionage", So "yeah...aikido works".

An outsider may look at it, not understanding aikido and say "that SOB just twisted that guys arm!". Another person may say "wow, that guy sure is patient and calm!".... it is all based on perceptions.

I think when we try and label things as "this is aikido" "that is not" "it works"..."no it doesn't" we limit ourselves mentally and physically to a very narrow set of rules and options.

The whole point of aikido, IMHO, is to expand that set of rules and the options we have available. To seek to understand conflict and the cause. To exist in the moment of the interaction we have with another person...if that interaction is a good one (positive) or a bad one (negative).

If we can do that, we can better understand the situation closer to the truth and more skillfully deal with our interaction. that to me, is the highest form and use of aikido. It may involve a basic technique we use to practice the principles that we recognize, or it may involve something more subtle that we don't recognize....what is important is that we deal with the situation with the appropriate response.

That, to me, is what we should focus on when we study...not limit ourselves...nor beat ourselves up over the most trival things like "techniques".

When we focus on our techniques...we are at probably our most "ineffectiveness" as we are not focused on the "now" or the present situation.
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Old 03-23-2006, 07:01 PM   #594
Travis Johnson
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

i'm sure many of you have heard this kinda thing being said before, but it's a good one! in fact, at a seminar i even heard william gleason sensei say something like this:

aikido works. if you say it doesn't work, than it's your aikido that doesn't work!

in other words, if you are in a "fight" and you think you are doing aikido but it's not working, than your body is doing something else other than aikido, maybe just failing techniques imitating aikido, etc.
but as we know aikido uses timing and blending and all these other things, so ofcourse it works. aikido blends with the moment. simply, if it doesn't work, it's not blending/joining/ with the motion, and that is not aikido!

this is hypothetical, but do you think this makes sense? someone that deeply feels it that much should be able to execute whatever kind of aikido the situation calls for! whadda' ya say, mon?

--travis
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Old 03-26-2006, 04:16 PM   #595
Kevin Leavitt
 
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

I'd say you are right!

The physical principles of aikido are based on universal princples of physics. The spiritual and philosophical principles are aligned with those that produce harmony, or attempt to resolve conflict with least possible injury, mentally, spiritually, and physically.

You can apply the physical principles or aikido and still not "be doing aikido" if the mental and the spiritual aspects are not aligned and in harmony with the situation.

We tend to focus on the external or technical aspects that we all recognize as aikido, but it is the other two aspects that are equally, if not more important. Remember the triangle, circle and the square!
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Old 03-29-2006, 09:48 AM   #596
Raspado
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

OMG you guys dribble on aimlessly over the what -if's. Aikido as it's practiced in most aikido schools today won't work in a MMA fight against a trained fighter-boxer, kickboxer- most of them--because the training is different. You can't compare doing randori to actual ring work where you are REALLY getting hit. Please--please tell me what aikido dojo practices that--and don't give me the "oh you can't do that in aikido because you will really hurt someone" excuse either.

That being said--is aikido good self defense? Absolutely. Will aikido work in a fight- absolutely. Will aikido work in the UFC or Pride? Nope- and it's not meant too.
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Old 03-29-2006, 10:06 AM   #597
Ron Tisdale
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Aikido as it's practiced in most aikido schools today won't work in a MMA fight against a trained fighter-boxer, kickboxer- most of them--because the training is different.
I agree. Where was someone saying it would work in that environment? Seems a straw man arguement to me. That said, I also agree with your last two lines, in general.

Best,
Ron

Ron Tisdale
-----------------------
"The higher a monkey climbs, the more you see of his behind."
St. Bonaventure (ca. 1221-1274)
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Old 03-29-2006, 10:12 AM   #598
Raspado
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

It seems to me Ron that that's where the original post came from with regards to what Joey wrote(then he subsequently disappeared). I practiced Aikido 13 years- 8 in Aikido schools of Ueshiba and 5 under Larry Reynosa. I am a shodan. I now practice bjj and judo. I hear a lot of "noise" about aikido not working in a fight in bjj circles-- but it goes back to what I was saying before--will an aikido technique work against a bjj guy? Of course--but in a fight with a bjj person 90% bjj wins. It comes down to the training. Originally Fusen Ryu newaza beat Kodokan Judo- which is why Kano then incorporated newaza into judo.

But--what people don't get is just because it won't work against some arts-doesn't mean it's not a valid self defense system.
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Old 03-29-2006, 12:20 PM   #599
Kevin Leavitt
 
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

No problem with what you are saying Mike. Actually you and I have very similar backgrounds. ASU for many years and now BJJ.

I think people really get emotionally wrapped up in what fighting is without really understanding it. When you try and frame it and break it down from the paradigm of your experiences that you gain in the dojo, you will find that you have "issues" with resolving many, many points.

You fight a fight with what works and what advantages you have. Not a training methodology like Aikido, BJJ, or anything else!

Aikido people sometimes it seems tend to limit themselves to the small framework of experience they have in a few hours a week practice. I think it is good to do this mental exercise as it causes you to question and think about real issues. It becomes a good meditation to help you develop yourself mentally and spiritually.

We all need to develop conditional responses and trigger points that are appropriate for the situation at hand. I think aikido is wonderful because at least philosophically it gives us a methodology to expand our ability to resolve conflict skillfully as possible.

Other arts do this as well, but as you know, they are not for all people, and each person must find what works for them.

I think the saddest things is when we close our minds to possibilities and things outside of our comfort zone and don't consider them options, and then we fool ourselves into thinking that we are something that we are not!
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Old 03-30-2006, 08:21 AM   #600
Michael Neal
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Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

If any of you are interested this same discussion is going on over at judoinfo.com right now. As a former Aikidoka I do realise the limitations of Aikido but also that it has many principles that can be used in any situation and the techniques can be very effective as well. Recently I have been using a modified version of one of the kokyunage throws I learned in Aikido with good success in Judo randori, it is not an ippon throw for competition purposes since I let go of the person during the throw but they slam on their back quite hard and is quite effective. This throw has worked on people who have competed and placed well in Judo on the national level.

http://judoforum.com/index.php?showtopic=10079

Last edited by Michael Neal : 03-30-2006 at 08:25 AM.
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