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Old 09-20-2002, 07:32 PM   #1
Cristian
Dojo: Hakusan / Chile
Location: Chile
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art?

My wife is artist, she paint like Monet (i love she so much! ). Yesterday she ask me ┐why the aikido is an art? ┐O'sensei was an artist? ┐in what way?.

I realise that i don't have a good sence about this question.

What do you see?
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Old 09-21-2002, 05:38 AM   #2
DaveO
Dojo: Great Wave Aikido
Location: Alberta, Canada
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No prob on the English, Cristian, it's a lot better than my French, or spanish, or Russian, or any other language I've tried to learn.

Aikido is an art because once the basics are learned, it becomes a very personal thing in how you choose to perform and use it. Among skilled aikidoka (I'm not one of them), each person's aikido is very individual - some are wide, sweeping and flowing, others tight and aggressive. For the truly advanced, the techniques and waza of Aikido are just the beginning - they are not Aikido in themselves, they become the tools a practicioner uses to make Aikido.

That's not a great answer, but it's the best I can come up with. Ciao!

Dave

Answers are only easy when they're incomplete.
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Old 09-21-2002, 11:58 AM   #3
TomE
 
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Speaking as both aikidoka and artist myself: Art isn't what you do, it's how you do it.

To do is to be. (Nietzsche) ... To be is to do. (Descartes) ... Do be do be do. (Sinatra).
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Old 09-21-2002, 01:35 PM   #4
Don_Modesto
Dojo: Messores Sensei (Largo, Fl.)
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Re: art?

Quote:
Cristian Gomez (Cristian) wrote:
┐why the aikido is an art?
Linguistic infelicity.

Even at the time of the Greeks, art had split into art and techne, or something done for its own sake v something done for utility.

Are doctors who work in medical arts buildings artists?

Of course, being truly anal, we could point out that even the translation (forgetting for a moment the maze of problems accompanying translation itself) is wrong. It's a "way", not an "art", which, perversely, relfects the distinction opposite to that held in Western Culture that art is not a matter of utility but the ways are practiced for something other than the value of their techniques.

Don J. Modesto
St. Petersburg, Florida
------------------------
http://www.theaikidodojo.com/
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Old 09-21-2002, 02:22 PM   #5
Bruce Baker
Dojo: LBI Aikikai/LBI ,NJ
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What makes a painter an artist and a painter of rooms and buildings a painter?

When the basic performance reaches a height or performance level that entertains the eye, and mind, along with bringing light to the soul, I would say that watching or performing this is art.

Find the common denominators for an artist, and watch a performance of Aikido to see if you think it is beyond dance, or simple manipulation?

Indeed, the depth of learning and performance becomes the same as anyone who can call themselves, artist.
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Old 10-09-2002, 10:36 PM   #6
Cristian
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Gracias
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Old 10-10-2002, 02:57 AM   #7
Genex
 
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Talking

Aikido is an art for so many reasons, it is an art you can see, for instance see the gracefull flight of the uke...

is it an aural art, hear the melodious sound of your uke hitting the mat...

it is a touchable art, feal the tendons react as you press a pressure point...

although i'd say aikido is an art because, well its individual everyones interpritation is different everyone sees something different in aikido, and everyone has a different level of style or experience which blends with others to create something.

that'll prolly account for it.

otama shimini!

pete

like having your brains smashed out by a slice of lemon wrapped round a large gold brick. - The hitchhikers guide to the galaxy on the Pan-galactic Gargleblaster!
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Old 10-10-2002, 04:03 AM   #8
Mr. P
 
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Thumbs down

I like the definition of Don_Modesto .

When you practice only to be able to defend youself, to keep shape, a´kido is useful.

When you practice to canalize bad energies (anger , hatred , ...), to make you better , to reach a part of heavens, I think we can call it an art .

Thanks for your attention ...

Last edited by Mr. P : 10-10-2002 at 04:05 AM.

Mr. P

Never pay attention to someone using smileys...
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Old 10-10-2002, 06:36 AM   #9
mike lee
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being there

Consider war. How could we ever call that "an art." But centuries ago, a Chinese general named Sun Tzu wrote what is now considered a classic -- "The Art of War."

I guess it becomes an art when the basic principles are understood and mastered, and one begins to instinctively know the best course of action to take in a given situation.

In fact, two generals who have mastered the art of war could take two different courses of action in the same situation, and both could be right. This would be because the individual creative natures of their given personalities would come into play.

The failure of the novice is that he hasn't mastered the basics and he doesn't know how to view the situation clearly and from numerous different perspectives.

Aikido becomes an art when we have developed enough skill to respond to the same situation in a wide variety of ways, and all are correct.

Last edited by mike lee : 10-10-2002 at 06:41 AM.
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Old 10-10-2002, 07:33 AM   #10
justinm
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It's an art because, I can't do it, I don't understand it, I'm never satisfied with what I've done, other people stand and stare with a confused, quizzical look on their face, I'll probably be appreciated more after I'm dead, only the very best can make a living out of it, and my wife helps me laugh at myself when I get too serious about it.

Justin

Justin McCarthy
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Old 10-10-2002, 07:43 AM   #11
Creature_of_the_id
 
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Art, to me, means an expression of yourself.

In this case the means by which I express myself is martial.

I am using art within the medium of a conflict, to come to a conclusion or resolution.

The outcome of the conflict, is directly related to the intent with which both parties enter, or in other words directly related to how each person expresses themselves within that moment.

The moment can start with one expressing anger and the other expressing a peaceful demeanor. Both use their body and the 'forms' that they have or have not been taught in that moment.

The outcome or technique is not necissarily the picture, the picture is influenced by the presence of the other.

Until aikido is mastered, and it is realised that no ones presence can influence the outcome. The outcome becomes a choice and true self expression, in which the other persons body becomes the canvass. freedom of self expression within any situation... I think that can be classed as an art

but.. I'm going on because I dont want to do any more screen captures at work.. argh

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Old 10-10-2002, 08:47 AM   #12
aikigreg
Dojo: Mizu Aikido
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I think to some degree an "art" is something not everyone can do well. Anyone can dip a brush in paint and put it to canvas, but can you do anything someone cares about? (I know I can't)

So there definately are "War Arts." A battlefield general conducting a campaign is definately an artistry in the way things are manipulated.

And on the field, the warrior with the most technical skill does not always win the fight. There are factors you can't measure like heart, awareness of surroundings, reaction time, etc. So the "martial practitioner" of course can become a "martial artist."

If that makes any sense at all, which I highly doubt
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Old 10-10-2002, 07:19 PM   #13
Pretoriano
 
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Post Is Aikido Art?

Aikido Is Art, Not because you look like dancing!! is Art because is endless and you must be Creative.

Praetorian
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