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05-13-2003, 10:22 AM
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#26
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Location: Commerce City, Co
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 47
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I meant no offence Rachel, merely bad wording on my part. My apologies.
I am still a baby in terms of my training time compared to most everyone here, and I still have a few lessons to learn. Back at home I never train with our group wearing a hakama. I respect those elder and senior to me and they respect me too. Hakama becomes a choice at 3rd kyu and above, I merely wear mine in ultra informal occasions. Mainly when I practicing with a few close friends of mine.
I suppose I'm used to training our way, since we pretty much don't deal with rank issues. Many many lessons.. and perhaps even a kyu test in my future.
Best regards,
K
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~~No smile is as beautiful as the one that struggles through tears.~~
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05-13-2003, 10:40 AM
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#27
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Location: Quebec City
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 96
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My view on this is very similar to the one of Craig. So I refer to his post for my general opinion on that point...
As for seminar, as a rule, I check what is the rule of the home dojo/association about hakama and simply follow it. If the seminar is hold at a dojo where only shodan and above wear hakama, I leave mine at home. I think it's only a matter of respect toward the dojo receiving you...
It may be more difficult to identify advanced students from beginners, but after one or two throws you ususally have a fairly good idea of the rank of the guy who is in front of you.
Anyway, in seminar, you usually don't have much time to choose your partner and end up with the nearest person. So, it don't really matters to know exactly the rank since it don't really influence to who you will be matched. At least, it's my experience...
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05-13-2003, 11:03 AM
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#28
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Dojo: Aikido of Cincinnati/Huron Valley Aikikai
Location: Somerset Michigan
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 794
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Thanks for clarifying this Kaitlin, I appreciate your comments and they have merit. It was just the "gift" part that was grating on me, and the experience I had a seminar a few years back when a woman who was wearing a hakama (granted, I am in an org. that typically doesn't wear hakama until dan grade) and told me "don't thow me hard, I can't take ukemi", and I thought she was joking. Even though I threw her quite softly the first time, it was evident that she was really inexperienced and couldn't take even a basic roll (so of course I was even more gentle after the first throw). Fortunately she realized after the first class that she was in a dangerous situation wearing a hakama in a huge seminar full of very gung-ho aikidoka, and took it off. Seminars are definately not a place to wear a hakama unless a) you are a dan rank or b) it is tradition for the org/host (previous post addressed this nicely).
Kaitlin, I too really revolt against being treated poorly on the mat. Poor behavior (note: not equality) in my estimation is when an obvious junior starts to instruct a senior; when someone instructs differently than what the teacher is showing; when someone turns their back on me when I've bowed into them (because they think they are somehow above working with me-or whatever else they've got up their...); when my partner doesn't give me their full attention and committment in the practice; basically any disdain. I hope you don't ever experience these, and most likely in your own dojo you won't. It is at seminars or camps that I find these behaviors, not typically within the dojo. At the same time though, I guess I don't equate hierarchy as having anything to do with poor behavior (unless of course someone is disdainful of me because they are a higher rank).
Anyways, thanks for listening, and for voicing your opinion; all opinions on this site are equally important, and I learn a lot from you, as well as everyone else who posts.
And lastly, hakama length; I would love to hear from Mr. Goldsbury, Mr. Linden, or Mr. Hooker about what they consider the traditional length.
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05-13-2003, 11:16 AM
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#29
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Dojo: Kokyu Aikido Association.
Location: Oldham, UK
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 85
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At our dojo Hakamas are worn from 1st Kyu (Black Tag) and above. We have a Black belt (of which nth Dan I am unsure.) who chooses not to wear a Hakama, and several others who do.
To someone such as myself, only just preparing to take a first test (7th Kyu), the Hakamas are an obvious sign of, not superiority, but of supervision, and experience. Not only are they quite magnificent to look at, and watch as the sweeping movements simply flow through the billowing Hakama, but they add a grace that is simply missing from simple dogi trousers.
I find that the Shodan(+?) who chooses not to wear a Hakama, looks more of a streetfighter, than those who choose to wear them. This is by no means a bad thing, but for an art that uses fluidity, and the aforementioned sweeping movements, and all, the Hakama without question, adds that special something.
I'm sorry I couldn't add anything further, as obviously I've never worn one, only observed those around me, but several things are for sure;
i) I haven't seen anyone trip
ii) I await the day when 1st Kyu may arrive, and I too can find new graces, responsibilities, and make those cool swooshy noises
Best,
-Daniel.
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05-13-2003, 03:56 PM
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#30
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Dojo: guernsey aikido club
Location: guernsey/channel island,s uk
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 4
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hi there ,just to say ,that in the club that i train ,we wear a hakama after green belt for women and men,not as a sign of rank but as a sign of your commitment to the club and art .
Last edited by nial forsyth : 05-13-2003 at 04:03 PM.
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05-13-2003, 09:16 PM
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#31
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Location: Indonesia
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 245
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If you get to wear a hakama, I think we should take a cue from those folks in the Japanese sword arts. They don't wear dogi pants under their hakama; just a pair of speedos or something like that under there...
Hmmm...in fact, getting rid of the dogi pants might not be a bad idea, hakama or no hakama. Just uwagi and speedos...I like it.
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05-13-2003, 10:10 PM
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#32
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Dojo: Aikido of Petaluma, Petaluma,CA
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 834
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Daniel that was beautiful.
My home dojo uses a colored belt system, the one i am learning weapons at is white belt-Hakama.Its pretty obvious i'm a beginner but i find it helpful to have a clue about the people i'm training with.Anyway i'' be a little old lady by the time i get my hakama...
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05-14-2003, 12:28 AM
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#33
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Location: Bay Area
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 1,200
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Quote:
John Kuo (jk) wrote:
If you get to wear a hakama, I think we should take a cue from those folks in the Japanese sword arts. They don't wear dogi pants under their hakama; just a pair of speedos or something like that under there...
Hmmm...in fact, getting rid of the dogi pants might not be a bad idea, hakama or no hakama. Just uwagi and speedos...I like it.
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Shorts under a hakama are a no-brainer unless the evil spectre of knee walking looms. In that scenario the more the merrier between one's knees and the mats. Of course some folks have definite ideas about what should be worn under one's hakama and it's not unrare to get some grief from the unenlightened.
I seem to recall one relatively well-known instructor (not aikido) who routinely put his jockey underwear on display while leading a seminar. He wore colorful garb as well and near as I could tell the world has not swallowed him up.
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05-14-2003, 08:27 AM
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#34
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Dojo: Baltimore Aikido
Location: Baltimore
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 586
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So, with a lot of people using speedos or underwear under the hakama, you could take a really funny picture of people folding their hakama on the mat after a big seminar.
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Yours in Aiki
Opher
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05-14-2003, 12:29 PM
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#35
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Dojo: Phoenix Coventry
Location: Coventry, England
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 303
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The Hakama is a Dan grade thing at our club. I think it is a right royal pain in the ass but it looks so cool. I've broken both little toes in the damn thing, more than once, as well.
Have fun.
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Vir Obesus Stola Saeptus
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05-14-2003, 12:38 PM
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#36
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Dojo: Houston Ki Aikido
Location: Houston,TX
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 1,038
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hmmm...
generally in Iai people are wearing pants.
It those kendo guys that wear only speedos. :-)
I sometimes wear old gi pants that have been cutoff into shorts, but I draw the line at underwear !
Craig
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05-14-2003, 12:46 PM
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#37
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Dojo: Houston Ki Aikido
Location: Houston,TX
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 1,038
Offline
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Quote:
Opher Donchin (opherdonchin) wrote:
So, with a lot of people using speedos or underwear under the hakama, you could take a really funny picture of people folding their hakama on the mat after a big seminar.
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Good point !
In iaido and kendo, you are supposed to put on and take off you hakama in the dressing room, never in the practice hall so what you wear underneath stays private. Besides the matter of etiquette, seminars are often on wood floors that aren't necessarily clean enough to lay out your outer clothes anyway like people do in aikido.
Craig
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10-29-2014, 10:17 AM
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#38
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Location: San Jose
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 14
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Re: Poll: What do you think of wearing a hakama during aikido training?
For purposes of temporarily exposing the feet, the hakama may be rolled upward to the inside at the top, or pulled up on the sides and tucked under the ties.
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10-29-2014, 12:21 PM
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#39
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Dojo: Aikido of Fresno
Location: Fresno , CA
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,646
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Re: Poll: What do you think of wearing a hakama during aikido training?
I think when doing classical forms a Hakama is just what we wear, like chimney sweeps wear hats or sailors wear stripped shirts. It does get in the way, and tear when doing heavy randori, I've stopped wearing my hakama for this.
Also people now a days want to wear comfortable clothes. Gi's were cool when I started training, but now they are not so much so. I teach a "modern" class where we don't wear a uniform at all, just workout clothes. People like it a lot.
But I'm also a traditionalist, I think wearing a gi and hakama are important parts of our Aikido culture.
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11-07-2014, 04:58 PM
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#40
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Dojo: Wasabi Dojo
Location: Houston, TX
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 290
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Re: Poll: What do you think of wearing a hakama during aikido training?
Personally, I treat my training in a martial way, with a direct and traceable path to the great outdoors (in the urban sense) where the bad guys live and do their thing.
When I go out there, I don't wear the hakama, though I did so in training a bit to satisfy the perceived need for formalism at demonstration time in the past. But, standard training it's an extra thing that you don't have, won't want when you are cruising down to the local 7-11 to get a slurpee at 11:25 p.m. and a bad guy jumps at you the one time in your life when you'll "need your stuff."
In fact, oftentimes we train in our street clothes, and the clothes we wear most often. For me, that'll be a suit, complete with front handle, read necktie, wich which I have to deal with in a combat situation. You do NOT want a bad guy getting a good hold of a tie, pretty good head control from a distance that way, to say nothing of the shime-waza potential.
No hakama in our training. But, I DO still think it looks pretty. If that's what you like, knock yourself fout.
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I find it interesting that the kanji character for kuzushi illustrates a mountain falling on a house.
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