Welcome to AikiWeb Aikido Information
AikiWeb: The Source for Aikido Information
AikiWeb's principal purpose is to serve the Internet community as a repository and dissemination point for aikido information.

Sections
home
aikido articles
columns

Discussions
forums
aikiblogs

Databases
dojo search
seminars
image gallery
supplies
links directory

Reviews
book reviews
video reviews
dvd reviews
equip. reviews

News
submit
archive

Miscellaneous
newsletter
rss feeds
polls
about

Follow us on



Home > AikiWeb Aikido Forums
Go Back   AikiWeb Aikido Forums > Techniques

Hello and thank you for visiting AikiWeb, the world's most active online Aikido community! This site is home to over 22,000 aikido practitioners from around the world and covers a wide range of aikido topics including techniques, philosophy, history, humor, beginner issues, the marketplace, and more.

If you wish to join in the discussions or use the other advanced features available, you will need to register first. Registration is absolutely free and takes only a few minutes to complete so sign up today!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 05-17-2007, 04:16 AM   #1
Aran Bright
Dojo: Griffith Aikido Yuishinkai
Location: Brisbane
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 120
Australia
Offline
Lines of power

I have searched for anything on the shapes of aikido and the lines and angles that ueshiba sensei lectured on. I have found nothing, surely this has been hammered out some where before, any suggestions?

Also, it occured to me that the basic shapes of aikido don't exist in two dimension but are more likely three dimension, eg the dynamic sphere, does anyone have any ideas on the 'irresistable cube' for example?

http://brisbaneaikido.com

Brisbane Aikido Republic
Brisbane
Australia
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2007, 08:02 AM   #2
George S. Ledyard
 
George S. Ledyard's Avatar
Dojo: Aikido Eastside
Location: Bellevue, WA
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 2,670
Offline
Re: Lines of power

Quote:
Aran Bright wrote: View Post
I have searched for anything on the shapes of aikido and the lines and angles that ueshiba sensei lectured on. I have found nothing, surely this has been hammered out some where before, any suggestions?

Also, it occured to me that the basic shapes of aikido don't exist in two dimension but are more likely three dimension, eg the dynamic sphere, does anyone have any ideas on the 'irresistable cube' for example?
Actually, O-Sensei talked very little about technical issues like this. He did talk about the triangle, circle, square but more in terms of the energetic significance. Saotome Sensei says that in fifteen years of training with the Founder, he can remember three times when O-Sensei talked about how to do technique.

George S. Ledyard
Aikido Eastside
Bellevue, WA
Aikido Eastside
AikidoDvds.Com
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2007, 04:57 PM   #3
graham
 
graham's Avatar
Dojo: Northampton Ki Aikido Club
Location: Northampton
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 134
United Kingdom
Offline
Re: Lines of power

Terry Dobson wrote that even though O Sensei spoke of the triangle, circle and square, it was difficult to get a clear explanation of what he meant.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2007, 03:14 AM   #4
Aran Bright
Dojo: Griffith Aikido Yuishinkai
Location: Brisbane
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 120
Australia
Offline
Re: Lines of power

Do you know that diaghram that is basically a circle inside a square that has the four lines cutting across it?

Does that mean anything to you?

I have heard teachers talk about cutting along the diagonals, does this ring a bell?

http://brisbaneaikido.com

Brisbane Aikido Republic
Brisbane
Australia
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2007, 11:01 AM   #5
Walker
 
Walker's Avatar
Dojo: 鷹松道場|Takamatsu Dojo ATL
Location: ATL--GA
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 221
United_States
Offline
Re: Lines of power

I'll share a model using the that has come down to my dojo as a model of the training progression.

The first stage which is concerned with acting as a wedge that is strong, stable and piercing with its sharp point.
The next in which action becomes more plastic and dynamic while still containing the triangle.
The last in which the entire space is filled and one has already mastered and controlled each situation; again containing both the circle and triangle within it.

Take it for what it's worth.

-Doug Walker
新道楊心流の鷹松道場
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-2007, 10:03 AM   #6
jennifer paige smith
 
jennifer paige smith's Avatar
Dojo: Confluence Aiki-Dojo / Santa Cruz Sword Club
Location: Santa Cruz
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,049
United_States
Offline
Re: Lines of power

Quote:
Aran Bright wrote: View Post
Do you know that diaghram that is basically a circle inside a square that has the four lines cutting across it?

Does that mean anything to you?

I have heard teachers talk about cutting along the diagonals, does this ring a bell?
These symbols together are found in the American Indian medicine wheel and Spirit Catchers. Follow the lines precisely, the very simple diagrams that you have seen photograghed with O'Sensei lecturing near the chalkboard, find them and work 45degree angles for a while. Then consider how they are related to a natural concept of 'the whole ', using nature, like a flowing stream, as your guide. Listen, you can hear it. Quiet your spirit through sword cuts and then allow natural inspiration to flow in.

Jennifer Paige Smith
Confluence Aikido Systems
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-2007, 02:03 PM   #7
mathewjgano
 
mathewjgano's Avatar
Dojo: Tsubaki Kannagara Jinja Aikidojo; Himeji Shodokan Dojo
Location: Renton
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,276
United_States
Offline
Re: Lines of power

Quote:
Aran Bright wrote: View Post
I have heard teachers talk about cutting along the diagonals, does this ring a bell?
I'm not sure if it's been mentioned, but there's a good Shinto cosmology at the Tsubaki America web site regarding , if you're interested.
Also, to me it sounds like maybe you're describing the shikaku (dead angles). For example in the forearm, relatively speaking the ulna and the radius can be thought of as constituting a "vertical" axis; perpendicular to that axis would be the "horizontal" and bisecting those axes are the shikaku...as I think I understand it anyway. Theoretically, your structure should be strong to the sides even when you're facing forward. The example I'm most familiar with is a static stance where you have someone push from the front, back and sides (shoulders/upper arm), then they push on the shikaku and the posture begins to twist.
Then again you might be refering to the idea that it's harder to side-step a diagonal cut than a vertical one?
At any rate, one thing that sparked my initial interest to Aikido was the beautiful geometry. Reading Aikido and the Dynamic Sphere did a lot to give me some of my initial appreciation for Aikido.
Take care,
Matthew

Last edited by mathewjgano : 05-24-2007 at 02:07 PM.

Gambarimashyo!
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-2007, 07:10 AM   #8
Aran Bright
Dojo: Griffith Aikido Yuishinkai
Location: Brisbane
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 120
Australia
Offline
Re: Lines of power

Quote:
Matthew Gano wrote: View Post
I'm not sure if it's been mentioned, but there's a good Shinto cosmology at the Tsubaki America web site regarding , if you're interested.
Also, to me it sounds like maybe you're describing the shikaku (dead angles). For example in the forearm, relatively speaking the ulna and the radius can be thought of as constituting a "vertical" axis; perpendicular to that axis would be the "horizontal" and bisecting those axes are the shikaku...as I think I understand it anyway. Theoretically, your structure should be strong to the sides even when you're facing forward. The example I'm most familiar with is a static stance where you have someone push from the front, back and sides (shoulders/upper arm), then they push on the shikaku and the posture begins to twist.
Then again you might be refering to the idea that it's harder to side-step a diagonal cut than a vertical one?
At any rate, one thing that sparked my initial interest to Aikido was the beautiful geometry. Reading Aikido and the Dynamic Sphere did a lot to give me some of my initial appreciation for Aikido.
Take care,
Matthew
That's exactly what I am getting at, Shikaku. Are you able to tell me more?

http://brisbaneaikido.com

Brisbane Aikido Republic
Brisbane
Australia
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2007, 03:22 AM   #9
Adam Alexander
Dojo: none currently
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 499
United_States
Offline
Re: Lines of power

Triangle=The lower points represent uke and sh'te's points of contact with ground while in midst of attack/defense? The upper point represents their connection upon contact?

Circle=Uke and sh'te create a circle with the technique?

Square=Upon completion of the technique, uke and sh'te return to where they should be naturally? Each with their stability of two points represented by their corners?

Maybe.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2007, 12:40 PM   #10
Walker
 
Walker's Avatar
Dojo: 鷹松道場|Takamatsu Dojo ATL
Location: ATL--GA
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 221
United_States
Offline
Re: Lines of power

Quote:
Jean de Rochefort wrote: View Post
Triangle=The lower points represent uke and sh'te's points of contact with ground while in midst of attack/defense? The upper point represents their connection upon contact?

Circle=Uke and sh'te create a circle with the technique?

Square=Upon completion of the technique, uke and sh'te return to where they should be naturally? Each with their stability of two points represented by their corners?

Maybe.
From my own perspective I would caution against such ideas. If you analyze the way you have structured the interaction both uke and shite are equally balanced in each geometric figure. You even posit an ending in "square" where each has the "stability of two points." In other words an aikidoka has gone though an interaction and nothing has changed. What is the point of that?

You posit a triangle in which two persons have formed a stable arch-like structure. At such a point neither has any advantage and most likely a stalemate will result. Same with your idea about the circle.

I would recommend structuring your thinking into models in which you are the dominant component.

-Doug Walker
新道楊心流の鷹松道場
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Omoto-kyo Theology senshincenter Spiritual 80 06-10-2022 08:32 AM
What is Weight Transfer(Taijuuidou)?? Upyu Training 87 10-17-2008 10:13 AM
Training the Body for Martial Movement Upyu Training 25 01-03-2007 11:24 AM
Discussion of Summer Camp 2006 on AJ Mike Sigman General 20 11-24-2006 08:04 PM
Spiritual power Jonathan General 46 01-31-2002 02:39 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:52 AM.



vBulletin Copyright © 2000-2024 Jelsoft Enterprises Limited
----------
Copyright 1997-2024 AikiWeb and its Authors, All Rights Reserved.
----------
For questions and comments about this website:
Send E-mail
plainlaid-picaresque outchasing-protistan explicantia-altarage seaford-stellionate