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11-02-2007, 05:20 AM
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#1
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,415
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Harmony with Nature and the Universe
Is the universe and nature harmonious and peaceful? When you look at the stars at night do you see harmony and peace. In the forest, desert, lakes and oceans do the creatures that live there do so in a nonviolent way with each other?
David
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Go ahead, tread on me.
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11-02-2007, 07:54 AM
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#2
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Dojo: Washinkai (Kizu)
Location: Osaka
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 123
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
reality is what you make it. I choose peace and harmony, but not everyone sees it that way.
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11-02-2007, 08:52 AM
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#3
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Dojo: Aikido of Santa Barbara
Location: Santa Barbara, California
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 94
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
IMO there is balance, but harmony and peace, not so
much. The universe was born in and still is in chaos.
From a very outside perspective you can see it in many
different ways. We are born to die. In the physical
realm, we are flawed. Be it because we are born in sin
as the bible says, or be it that we have not tuned
ourselves into enlightenment as Buddhists believe.
Like us, the universe is dying, and transforming.
There has to be a balance somewhere or it just
wouldn't work at all.
How much of us is in the realm of real harmony,
balance, and peace I don't know. But it exists.
Just my opinion on the matter. I am by no means a seasoned Aikidoka.
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11-02-2007, 09:04 AM
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#4
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Dojo: None at the moment - on hiatus
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 965
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
Quote:
David Skaggs wrote:
Is the universe and nature harmonious and peaceful? When you look at the stars at night do you see harmony and peace. In the forest, desert, lakes and oceans do the creatures that live there do so in a nonviolent way with each other?
David
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When I am swirling a glass of Henessy XO while smoking a Cuban, sitting at my pateo with wife while listening to Eric Clapman... I see harmony and peaceful in everything.
When my sales report is due tomorrow and I just got back at 10pm while entertaining a client, the peace and harmony things get shove out the window.
Boon.
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SHOMEN-ATE (TM), the solution to 90% of aikido and life's problems.
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11-02-2007, 11:37 AM
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#5
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Dojo: Aikido Eastside
Location: Bellevue, WA
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 2,670
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
Quote:
David Skaggs wrote:
Is the universe and nature harmonious and peaceful? When you look at the stars at night do you see harmony and peace. In the forest, desert, lakes and oceans do the creatures that live there do so in a nonviolent way with each other?
David
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The whole issue depends on your point of view... In the larger sense the whole Universe is in a balance in which every piece is connected to every other piece.
Yet, the whole is made up of component parts which are constantly being created and uncreated in the sense that there is nothing which isn't changing form all of the time. Nothing is static or unchanging.
So from the limited human perspective which is fragile and transitory in the extreme, it all seems incredibly violent. But that is within our own hearts not really a reflection of what is. It is an emotional reaction of fear that comes from attachment, an attempt to find permanence where there is none.
Spiritual practice is largely about trying to come to terms with this issue. In the end "harmony" is how you describe what is out there but "peace" needs to be in your heart. It's how you choose to relate to the constant change which is a fact of existence.
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11-02-2007, 01:58 PM
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#6
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Location: Portland, OR
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 532
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
Quote:
George S. Ledyard wrote:
The whole issue depends on your point of view... In the larger sense the whole Universe is in a balance in which every piece is connected to every other piece.
Yet, the whole is made up of component parts which are constantly being created and uncreated in the sense that there is nothing which isn't changing form all of the time. Nothing is static or unchanging.
So from the limited human perspective which is fragile and transitory in the extreme, it all seems incredibly violent. But that is within our own hearts not really a reflection of what is. It is an emotional reaction of fear that comes from attachment, an attempt to find permanence where there is none.
Spiritual practice is largely about trying to come to terms with this issue. In the end "harmony" is how you describe what is out there but "peace" needs to be in your heart. It's how you choose to relate to the constant change which is a fact of existence.
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Yes . . . and still it is perhaps best if one guards against even this becoming an extreme view that can potentially allow for, or excuse, the worst potentials of human behavior in a way similar to those adopting the reverse view in the extreme. In other words, if I create suffering in the name of "truth" or if I create suffering because, in the end, there is no "ultimate truth," I've still created suffering.
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~ Allen Beebe
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11-02-2007, 02:38 PM
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#7
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Dojo: AikiSpirit Dojo
Location: Coral Gables, Florida
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 196
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
Somebody said to me and it made alot of sense:
"There are two options, either we are physical beings having a spiritual experience or we are spiritual beings having a physical experience."
I read once in a book about the chaos theory that within any system of organization, there is an underlying chaos, and within that underlying chaos, an even more profoundly disturbing system of organization. And so on and so on, amen.
In the Art of War, Sun Tzu proposes that the only surefire method of controlling one's own mind is to realize that in times of violence there will follow a time of peace, and in times of peace there will follow a time of violence.
I believe that I create my "reality" on a moment to moment basis and how I perceive that reality is dependant on my internal condition. The world is unfolding exactly as it should, if I see a problem with it, then that is my problem, not the world's, and if I want to change it, then the change should be exacted within myself.
Who am I to offer suggestions for improvement on perferction? I just don't know enough to. The cosmos far too large and myself far too small and ignorant.
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11-02-2007, 04:12 PM
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#8
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Dojo: North Winnipeg Aikikai
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 265
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
Quote:
Is the universe and nature harmonious and peaceful? When you look at the stars at night do you see harmony and peace. In the forest, desert, lakes and oceans do the creatures that live there do so in a nonviolent way with each other?
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When I look at the stars at night I see countless points of light. They remind me of how tiny, and insignificant I am in the vast expanse of the universe. Its a good reminder not to take myself too seriously; in the grand context of the universe none of us is really that important.
I dunno' about the universe, but I've watched enough animal specials on Discovery Channel to know that there is plenty of violence in the forests, deserts, lakes and oceans of our world. Ever watch a pride of lions chow down on a zebra? Or witness a crocodile snatch a wildebeest from the shore of a river? Or see a shark chomp a chunk out of a tuna? Whoohoo! "Nature" is nothing if not brutal and violent (of course it isn't only these things).
Why do you ask?
Jon.
Last edited by Jonathan : 11-02-2007 at 04:21 PM.
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"Iron sharpens iron; so a man sharpens the countenance of his friend."
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11-03-2007, 08:29 AM
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#9
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Dojo: Big Green Drum (W. Florida Aikikai)
Location: West Florida
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,619
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
Quote:
William Prusner wrote:
I believe that I create my "reality" on a moment to moment basis and how I perceive that reality is dependant on my internal condition.
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I am reminded of a dramatized portrayal of an interview of a historic person, along the lines of Steve Allen's "Meeting of the Minds." (dates me I suppose).
Asked by the interviewer, if he ascribed to the Eastern way of thinking about reality and truth he said,
"What? You mean the idea that reality is not really real? It's all an illusion? --- They dodge spears, don't they?"
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Cordially,
Erick Mead
一隻狗可久里馬房但他也不是馬的.
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11-03-2007, 01:28 PM
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#10
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Location: Florida Gulf coast
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 3,902
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
IMHO, harmonious does not necessarily mean nonviolent as illustrated in nature. When it is appropriate to be violent, then do so with just enough to get the job done. When the job is over, be a peace.
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Lynn Seiser PhD
Yondan Aikido & FMA/JKD
We do not rise to the level of our expectations, but fall to the level of our training. Train well. KWATZ!
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11-04-2007, 07:38 AM
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#12
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Dojo: Big Green Drum (W. Florida Aikikai)
Location: West Florida
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,619
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
Quote:
David Skaggs wrote:
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Well truth to be told in your metaphor -- destruction is inherent in creation as creation is inherent in destruction -- IF they occur in their natural order. The elements composing our bodies were quite literally born the death spasms of collapsing and exploding stars.
The trick of it all is, of course, first perceiving and then adhering to the natural order in which creation and destruction synthesize to new creation. In Aiki, as in all warfare, the will to attack must be thoroughly and irrevocably destroyed, even while the entry into the arena of destruction is complete. If this spiritual destruction is not accepted, physical destruction begins, because that rejection is out of the natural order. However, the creativity that flows from acceptance of that destruction is nearly infinite.
Haruo Matsuoka made an especially interesting statement in light of your metaphor and my extension of it:
"Aiki is not rejection or resistance, but fusion."
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Cordially,
Erick Mead
一隻狗可久里馬房但他也不是馬的.
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11-04-2007, 08:35 AM
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#13
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,415
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
Creation and destruction is the results of the natural work of the energy of the Universe. I don't see how we can harmonize with the results, we harmonize with the energy.
Do we control that energy or does the energy control us? Do we flow with this energy of creation and destruction or do we direct it?
David
Last edited by dps : 11-04-2007 at 08:38 AM.
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Go ahead, tread on me.
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11-04-2007, 08:52 PM
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#14
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Dojo: Yoshin-ji Aikido of Marshall
Location: Wisconsin
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,224
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
Even the peaceful glow of a candle flame is caused by tiny explosions going off in the center of the flame.
In gassho,
Mark
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- Right combination works wonders -
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11-04-2007, 10:47 PM
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#15
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Dojo: Big Green Drum (W. Florida Aikikai)
Location: West Florida
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,619
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
Quote:
David Skaggs wrote:
Creation and destruction is the results of the natural work of the energy of the Universe. I don't see how we can harmonize with the results, we harmonize with the energy.
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Creation/destruction IS the natural energy of the universe. Entropy salvaged by novelty. Rescue destruction with preemptive creativity. Temper creativity by destroying impossible fantasy.
Quote:
David Skaggs wrote:
Do we control that energy or does the energy control us? Do we flow with this energy of creation and destruction or do we direct it?
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Respectively - yes and yes. And not necessarily, and hardly ever.
I do not create the wave. I do not control the wave. I only control my relationship to the wave.
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Cordially,
Erick Mead
一隻狗可久里馬房但他也不是馬的.
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11-04-2007, 11:17 PM
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#16
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Location: Aichi-ken, Nagoya-shi
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 644
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
There is no spoon.
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Josh Reyer
The lyf so short, the crafte so longe to lerne,
Th'assay so harde, so sharpe the conquerynge...
- Chaucer
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11-05-2007, 04:36 AM
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#17
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,415
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
Quote:
Erick Mead wrote:
I do not create the wave. I do not control the wave. I only control my relationship to the wave.
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You ride the wave wherever it takes you.
David
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Go ahead, tread on me.
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11-05-2007, 05:40 AM
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#18
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Location: Aichi-ken, Nagoya-shi
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 644
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
Quote:
David Skaggs wrote:
You ride the wave wherever it takes you.
David
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Ueshiba Morihei would say, " Be the wave."
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Josh Reyer
The lyf so short, the crafte so longe to lerne,
Th'assay so harde, so sharpe the conquerynge...
- Chaucer
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11-05-2007, 10:06 AM
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#19
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Dojo: AikiSpirit Dojo
Location: Coral Gables, Florida
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 196
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
This conversation makes me want to go surfing.
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11-11-2007, 08:54 AM
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#20
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Dojo: Team Combat USA
Location: Olympia, Washington
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 4,376
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
"All I need are some tasty waves, a cool buzz and I'm fine." Jeff Spicoli
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01-21-2010, 01:28 PM
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#21
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Location: Red Deer
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 59
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
To be or not to be a nihilist: that is the question.
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Self-discipline is the chief element of self-esteem; and self-esteem the chief element of courage. Thucydides
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01-21-2010, 11:25 PM
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#22
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Location: Red Deer
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 59
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
Some species of ants make war.
There are no athiests in foxholes.
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Self-discipline is the chief element of self-esteem; and self-esteem the chief element of courage. Thucydides
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01-22-2010, 10:25 AM
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#23
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Location: Red Deer
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 59
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
You can tune a piano but you can't tuna fish.
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Self-discipline is the chief element of self-esteem; and self-esteem the chief element of courage. Thucydides
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01-22-2010, 11:59 AM
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#24
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Location: Tulsa, OK
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 166
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
Quote:
David Skaggs wrote:
Do we control that energy or does the energy control us? Do we flow with this energy of creation and destruction or do we direct it?
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Quote:
You ride the wave wherever it takes you.
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You *are* the wave.
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01-22-2010, 01:52 PM
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#25
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Dojo: Tsubaki Kannagara Jinja Aikidojo; Himeji Shodokan Dojo
Location: Renton
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,276
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Re: Harmony with Nature and the Universe
Quote:
Eugene Leslie wrote:
You can tune a piano but you can't tuna fish.
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Gambarimashyo!
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