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Old Yesterday, 02:36 PM   #51
Cass
 
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Dojo: Aikido Academy
Location: Athens
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 36
Greece
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Re: Injuries in aikido

Clarification on the aforementioned nikkyo incident.

Quote:
Mary Malmros wrote: View Post
And if she hadn't faced the other way, you would have kneed her in the back of the skull: not as dramatic as a gushing nosebleed, perhaps, but as nage, it's your responsibility to not knee your partner on any part of their head when doing a pin.
Never happened before or after while my ukes had their head the right way. Perhaps that was just coincidence, or maybe she had her head leaning further along her shoulder in a kind of "combo". Not sure which it was, either way it remains something I think about briefly every time I do that pin now and she lies correctly now, so lesson learnt for both I suppose. Also at that early stage, mistakes are very expected, so I may be in the wrong - I would know if I saw it now - and at that point too, it is worth noting that I think most beginners minds are stuck on "where does my hand go now?" "are my feet right?" rather than where uke is and what they are doing.

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Mary Eastland wrote: View Post
Wow. That is scary to me that 2 beginners would be dong nikkyo so fast and unsupervised that one would be able to give the other a bloody nose in the nikkyo pin. I don't blame the first women for being "fragile and hesitant".
Supervised, but big class, our sensei was there straight away after, but he can't be everywhere at all times. He didn't see what happened, I wasn't asked and neither was she, though I think he could see there were no hard feelings between us, sometimes these things happen. It was not a hard knee in the face and she was not in pain/bruised afterward or anything like so. Speed is not discouraged so long as you are performing the technique correctly. As to to description, I think that may be a poor communication on my part - she did not become thusly after this incident and not specifically in this technique etc. I mean "don't close your hand fully around my wrist in katate dori" esq fragility, not to be confused with fear. Hesitant due to lack of confidence in her own ability also.

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Old Today, 08:51 AM   #52
Mary Eastland
 
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Dojo: Berkshire Hills Aikido
Join Date: Aug 2002
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Re: Injuries in aikido

Hi Cass:

I appreciate your clarification.
However, I don't think a knee to the face that causes a nose bleed could be considered a soft knee to the face.
Having kneed myself in the face once when I was demonstrating a back roll ( not my most shining teaching moment to be sure, ) I can attest it hurts bad.

Just a caution to you...speed is not encouraged until you have control. Slowing down never hurt anyone.

I love to hear about your experiences.

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Old Today, 12:28 PM   #53
lbb
Location: Massachusetts
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,094
United_States
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Re: Injuries in aikido

Quote:
Cassia Rose Heatley wrote: View Post
Never happened before or after while my ukes had their head the right way. Perhaps that was just coincidence, or maybe she had her head leaning further along her shoulder in a kind of "combo". Not sure which it was, either way it remains something I think about briefly every time I do that pin now and she lies correctly now, so lesson learnt for both I suppose. Also at that early stage, mistakes are very expected, so I may be in the wrong - I would know if I saw it now - and at that point too, it is worth noting that I think most beginners minds are stuck on "where does my hand go now?" "are my feet right?" rather than where uke is and what they are doing.
Indeed, most beginners are focused on their own movements, to the exclusion of what's going on around them. That's why it's important to go slowly and carefully, and not get stuck on your own plan about what you're going to do with your body -- because there's another body involved. As nage, when doing a technique, you have more choices than uke, and you also have a choice, more generally, in how you approach these situations. You can choose to focus on what your partner did wrong, or you can focus on what you're doing with what your partner gives you, without trying to assess whether what they did is "right" or "wrong".
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Old Today, 02:16 PM   #54
"Kei Thrace"
IP Hash: 9c04b197
Anonymous User
Re: Injuries in aikido

What a fantastic summary.

"[Nage] has more choices than uke" - and this holds true regardless of rank, but also, a more senior student will have even more options than his/her junior counterpart, and thus even more responsibility to choose an option that will not hurt uke.

"[Y]ou can focus on what you're doing with what your partner gives you" - and that puts the focus right where it should be: on your partner, not on the technique you're performing, your audience, or whatever was on your mind before you stepped onto the mats.

Quote:
Mary Malmros wrote: View Post
Indeed, most beginners are focused on their own movements, to the exclusion of what's going on around them. That's why it's important to go slowly and carefully, and not get stuck on your own plan about what you're going to do with your body -- because there's another body involved. As nage, when doing a technique, you have more choices than uke, and you also have a choice, more generally, in how you approach these situations. You can choose to focus on what your partner did wrong, or you can focus on what you're doing with what your partner gives you, without trying to assess whether what they did is "right" or "wrong".
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