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Old 08-03-2018, 08:43 AM   #1
mike costley
Dojo: Tri-City Aikikai Petersburg,Va
Location: dinwiddie,virginia
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Moving beyond kihon waza

Many doubts as to aikido effectiveness often are the result of the reluctance to move beyond the kihon waza taught. After a few years, aikidoka must focus on the principles within beginning techniques and reduce the time spent practicing kihon waza in the same manner as they always have. That approach, though it will polish basic technique, will lock instinct at that particular level. Kihon waza is to introduce the student to aiki principles; it will not take the student to being free in response to changing situations. As a variety of training partners is essential, so then is the expansion of basic principles through henkawaza and kaeshi waza. Making aikido truly a reflection of the individual will never happen if one trains only on one prescribed method, irregardless of the teacher that method came from. Learn to mirror the art, not the teacher.
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Old 08-03-2018, 09:17 AM   #2
dps
 
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Re: Moving beyond kihon waza

Quote:
David Costley wrote: View Post
Many doubts as to aikido effectiveness often are the result of the reluctance to move beyond the kihon waza taught. After a few years, aikidoka must focus on the principles within beginning techniques and reduce the time spent practicing kihon waza in the same manner as they always have. That approach, though it will polish basic technique, will lock instinct at that particular level. Kihon waza is to introduce the student to aiki principles; it will not take the student to being free in response to changing situations. As a variety of training partners is essential, so then is the expansion of basic principles through henkawaza and kaeshi waza. Making aikido truly a reflection of the individual will never happen if one trains only on one prescribed method, irregardless of the teacher that method came from. Learn to mirror the art, not the teacher.
You should never stop practicing the basic principles of Kihon waza. You can even practice them by yourself. I used to practice the kihon waza foot work while standing at my computer station at the call center I used to work at and whenever I went clothes shopping with my wife while waiting for her to pick out and try on the clothes.

dps

Trust only movement. Life happens at the level of events not of words. Trust movement. --Alfred Adler
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Old 08-03-2018, 01:21 PM   #3
phitruong
Dojo: Charlotte Aikikai Agatsu Dojo
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Re: Moving beyond kihon waza

yes, should move beyond kihon waza, forget the principles and join MMA programs. it makes you cooler and mellow and can dish aikido folks. at the very least, you don't have to wear pajamas. you might even get cool name, like Bang Bang Bob or Master Blaster Mike or January Jane. mine is Dead Pond.

"budo is putting on cold, wet, sweat stained gi with a smile and a snarl" - your truly
http://charlotteaikikai.org
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Old 08-06-2018, 05:59 AM   #4
StephanS
 
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Dojo: Enighet
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Re: Moving beyond kihon waza

Quote:
David Skaggs wrote: View Post
You should never stop practicing the basic principles of Kihon waza. You can even practice them by yourself.
It's not about the principles underlying kihon waza, it's about the principles underlying Aikido.
People often assume that kihon waza is easier than kinonagare. I think this assumption is incorrect, because you get less to work with when doing kihon (no inital dynamic).
At least in my training it's important not to bring the rigidity of kihon waza to kinonagare, but to bring the fluidity of kinonagare to kihon waza (to generate a flow out of a static starting position).

At least that's what kihon waza should - imho - become, once you revisit it after having encountered kinonagare. If you use it the first time around to show the basic pattern of movement, that's fine as well.

My favorite quote regarding kihon waza comes from a Karate blog. It was along the lines of: "To build a house, build a fundament first. But then build a house on it! I see so many people who build fundaments on top of fundaments on top of fundaments!"

There might be a language issue here as well. People seem to use "basic" as in "basic kihon waza" at the same time in two completely opposite ways.
basic:=simple, easy, beginner, initial, starting point
and
basic:=underlying, fundamental, refined, end product

David, you seem to be happy with your training, so by all means continue with what you love. But I'm more with Mike on this one.

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Old 08-06-2018, 08:02 AM   #5
lbb
Location: Massachusetts
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Re: Moving beyond kihon waza

This isn't an introduction, is it? Maybe a good topic for general forum?
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Old 08-06-2018, 10:10 AM   #6
shizentai
Location: CA
Join Date: Oct 2017
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Re: Moving beyond kihon waza

IMO practicing only the kihon waza leads to many bad habits. Jiyu-waza seems vastly underplayed in Aikido, and yet IMO past a certain point, whole classes MUST consist of jiyu-waza only. It won't make you win an MMA match, but it vastly expands one's ability to spontaneously react to ambush attacks which happen in real life.

Dojos which focus solely on kihon waza, develop these weird ideas about "when done right, no can defend", to quote Mr. Miyagi. That you have to wrangle the technique into perfection even when the attack's energy was completely unsuitable for it. This results in wasted training time, pointless struggle, and bad habits in general.

Jiyu-waza teaches you to detect the energy more accurately and faster, so you produce the movement that actually suits the attack. Introducing more realistic attacks and some "playful resistance" from uke goes a long way to enhance jiyu-waza and that feeling of spontaneous, no-mind movement.
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