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Old 02-16-2004, 07:03 PM   #76
PeterR
 
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Disordered training is randori. I used the English term here because randori to Shodokan people is quite specific and different from the randori of Aikikai for instance. Of course Shodokan randori is best but we have other drills and methods besides randori which break down the kata learning. Aikikai style randori is also good in this regard.
Quote:
Justin McCarthy (justinm) wrote:
Peter, can you clarify what you mean by disordered training?

Peter Rehse Shodokan Aikido
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Old 02-19-2004, 03:48 AM   #77
fo2sh-nico
Dojo: body masters
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new aikidoka

hi everybody i just started aikido and i love it, and i was wondering when will i be able to use it in self defense

THAT WHICH DOES NOT KILL US MAKES US STRONGER
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Old 02-19-2004, 03:51 AM   #78
fo2sh-nico
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well i forgot to tell u that i am training with the best sensei in EGYPT , he has been to JAPAN for five years and he really s good, by the way i got into aikido after watching steven seagal in above the law NICO hes the best

THAT WHICH DOES NOT KILL US MAKES US STRONGER
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Old 02-19-2004, 01:35 PM   #79
vanstretch
Dojo: Kyushinkan
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just curious Fouad, how old are you, and what is your teachers/dojo name? thank you. good luck to you as well.
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Old 02-19-2004, 04:29 PM   #80
Jamie Stokes
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Welcome to Aikido and Aikiweb!

Steven Seagal had good moves in his early movies.

But the best isstill O sensei, for starting this art.

Enjoy your training.

Jamie
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Old 02-19-2004, 07:37 PM   #81
PeterR
 
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I like that movie too and coincidently or not - I started Aikido not long after.

My initial impression of Aikido was not favourable although I found kansetsu waza (joint techniques) very interesting. If anything those movies hinted that there was more out there.
Quote:
fouad basem (fo2sh-nico) wrote:
well i forgot to tell u that i am training with the best sensei in EGYPT , he has been to JAPAN for five years and he really s good, by the way i got into aikido after watching steven seagal in above the law NICO hes the best

Peter Rehse Shodokan Aikido
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Old 02-19-2004, 08:24 PM   #82
Bushi
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fouad basem, your homepaige is... um...

...interesting...
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Old 02-19-2004, 09:03 PM   #83
Jack Robertson
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Quote:
Mallory Wikoff (Bushi) wrote:
fouad basem, your homepaige is... um...

...interesting...
interesting indeed.............
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Old 02-20-2004, 12:15 AM   #84
Vincent Munoz
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comments

Aikidokas,

Learning a technique is different from mastering a technique. It is important to master each technique. And in every tecnique, the principle of aikido must be present, then only your aikido will be effetive. The Keno Nagare (Flowing of Ki). And always practice kamiwaza(not sure of the term), applying a technique without allowing an aggressor to complete his grab or any attack.

75% of what a student can learn is from the student itself, only 25% from the instructor. Burn a fire of interest, focus and be observant.

one in budo

bong
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Old 02-20-2004, 11:16 AM   #85
DanD
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Quote:
Jack Robertson wrote:
interesting indeed.............
Is that a new politically correct way to say "tasteless" ???
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Old 02-20-2004, 04:14 PM   #86
GabrielMar
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I am new Aikidoka. I didn't start until after I'd been in many fights. I grew up kinda' rough, fought in Persian Gulf I, and have been a bouncer in many clubs. I didn't realize I needed Aikido until about a year ago and when I was done being a bouncer. I found it to be the next step in my progression and to calm me down a little and stay outta' trouble.

As far as street stuff goes? IMO, Aikido is effective if taken in it's parts as opposed to a whole technique. Training will make all the techniques blend into one and street effective at that point. I know that with knowledge I have now, I'm glad I'm not a bouncer anymore 'casue I really coulda' hurt somebody and I'm glad I didn't. Aikido first taught me that all the fighting I did in the past was potentially deadly and I'm glad that no one got seriously hurt because of me.

-Gabriel
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Old 02-23-2004, 10:00 PM   #87
alecellis
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Its perfect for the street. It just depends which street....

No martial art will protect you against a bullet; and a crazy suicidal person with a knife or other vicious weapon is best left alone. But the best thing about Aikido compared to more kick and punch style is that you can RESTRAIN people.... thereby not landing in front of the magistrate or judge pleading it was self defence why I kicked his head in!!

We had two nurses train with us, they worked in a mental home, and fortunately for the residents they took up Aikido and not taekwando or whatever.

If you enjoy Aikido and it all clicks, the moves you learn are just a catalyst. You become very confident, you look and feel different to your friends, and an air of warning comes out to potential opponents.

If you are in the habit of going out looking for battle, then practice!!! There are enough who are willing to take you up on it.... but the element of shock is the first thing that determines the result.

My daughter and I practice (for fun she thinks) dodging a rubber knife.... this is a practice knife... I have shown her the basics and she thinks she is so cool being able to get out of the way, and at most times now, able to counter my attack, and is now throwing me... with a little help from the victim <grin>.

BUT... what she is learning besides the obvious is that if or when she is threatened with a knife, the 75% shock factor is in her favor.... she will not (hopefully) be rooted to the spot, she will have the edge, even enough to frighten the attacker.

Then... she can run... or attack... depending on the advantage she has gained.

I agree... if you know where the thugs are then go another way... but in case... most thugs are opportunists, they dare the situation, if you take up Aikido, at the very worst you will gain a confidence, which bullies hate, and perhaps catch the Aikido bug....

Cheers
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Old 02-24-2004, 03:11 PM   #88
mantis
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Aikido, karate, judo boxing etc...

What matters most is the individual not the art!

NO style will make YOU a good fighter. Real FIGHTING will!

One needs to have developed good reaction skills, and obey certain principles within their art to make their art effective. if you 'lose it' in a fight, then whatever art you study will not help you.
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Old 02-24-2004, 03:34 PM   #89
Ted Marr
Location: Providence, RI
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Alec-

I am worried for your daughter's safety.

While it is all well and good to try to train away the shock response of being attacked, anyone who knows anything about using a knife will not attack the way Aikidoka do during tanto practice. There will be no committed strikes, no shomen- or yokomen- type attacks. Aikido's weapons work assumes that your enemy is wearing armor that must be pierced to affect them. And, more dangerously, that you are wearing armor too. It is dangerous to think that you can deal with a knife wielding attacker with Aikido techniques unless they are unskilled and/or enraged. Watch a few Kali classes and you'll see what I mean.
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Old 02-24-2004, 11:32 PM   #90
Nafis Zahir
 
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Re: comments

Quote:
Vincent Munoz wrote:
Aikidokas,

75% of what a student can learn is from the student itself, only 25% from the instructor. Burn a fire of interest, focus and be observant.
This is correct! I have often done the same technique over and over and discovered some interesting ways to make it more effective simply by trial & error. Chiba Sensei once said at a seminar to always search for a better way to do a technique. I have recently realized that how I apply ikkyo to someone big & strong is slightly different than applying it to someone my size or smaller. I learned this in practice one day just by trying. Learning comes thru practice.

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Old 02-24-2004, 11:36 PM   #91
Nafis Zahir
 
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Quote:
james bennington (mantis) wrote:
Aikido, karate, judo boxing etc...

What matters most is the individual not the art!

NO style will make YOU a good fighter. Real FIGHTING will!

One needs to have developed good reaction skills, and obey certain principles within their art to make their art effective. if you 'lose it' in a fight, then whatever art you study will not help you.
Excellent point James! As you stated, a person must obey certain principles within their art to make it effective. A person must also be "true" to these principles and must understand that these principles cannot be compromised in a street attack. If they are, then that's when you "lose it." As far as fighting goes, if you remain true to Aikido, you won't have to fight.

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Old 02-25-2004, 06:32 PM   #92
RachelCarmack
Dojo: Ronin Bushido
Location: Frankfort, ky
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Jack Robertson

I'm glad you see where i am coming from. I have a question for you Jack, how old are you? I am assuming you're male? Are you of small stature? The point i am getting at is i feel inadequate because i am still at the beginning stages, when muscles are still a valuable asset. i am 130 lbs. and 5'2, and the thought of a hulking, menace of an attacker coming down on me with the fury is a little unnerving. I don't have the strength to match a man, and i freeze when i am attacked with any speed. I am not a naturally timid person, i am assertive and confident, but not with this. If all we have is the art of surprise, what will we do if the are aware of our abilities and can anticipate them? Will they overpower my minimum amount of channeled ki? So many things to worry about
Rachel
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Old 02-25-2004, 08:10 PM   #93
Jack Robertson
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Hi Rachel,

I'm 15 years old, male, and I'm about 5'10.

The only real advice I could give you is to just keep training hard.

Slowly try to break the freezing impulse. It's just like dealing with an addiction, you have to keep fighting it. When you train, try to completely empty yourself of any kind of fear. This is easier said than done of course, but keep working on it and it will come in due time.

Don't even worry about your muscle strength. With hard training comes good technique and with good technique there is no need for excessively strong muscles.

If someone is aware of your abilities, there's not much they can do about it, unless they have a gun. I mean, in hand to hand, they would have to be a pretty good Aikidoka themselves to be able to accurately anticipate what you would do and chances are that if they were a good Aikidoka, they wouldn't be attacking you.

A key factor is attitude (shin). Remember, you are a WARRIOR!!! As a warrior, whatever battle you fight, it's a forgone conclusion, you ALREADY WON!!!

Good luck Rachel! Train hard!

P.S. Remember, Arnold Schwarzenegger isn't going to randomly decide to attack you!
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Old 02-25-2004, 09:11 PM   #94
Steven
 
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That's Govenator Arnold Schwarzenegger young lad.

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Old 02-25-2004, 10:14 PM   #95
alecellis
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Hi Ted,

I agree, there is a huge difference between facing a homicidal knife wielding maniac and "thug" which was the essence of the question. My daughter knows that my policy is "Get out of there quickly if you can", no actually, my policy is dont get there in the first place if you can help it.

As most people know a thug is usually a bully, a person that didnt get punched at school, who thinks they can and still does carry on the threats in their mature life.

A bully relies on people being afraid, a knife and a gun really helps!!

If you tell a bully with a knife to p'off they will suffer the shock themselves, all be it small (maybe) but you have the upper hand.... I have seen this with a bully with a shotgun in the pub I worked in when I was younger. The person that stood up to him was very confident and in fact was a weapon wielder himself.

I lived in Penge, London. Not the nicest of places; where people were tested everyday physically and psychologically by 'opportunists'.

I dont want my daughter to meet some of the types of people I have met, you cant fight them without commiting your life, with these people you have to make the correct decision, backdown or make a stand, its their world.

With thugs, they tend to be out to show off, not really commited to the end result, these types of people can be overcome with a quick slap in the face and a knee to the crutch if you can gain the edge.... this is what I would hope that my daughter might have in a bad situation with a thug.

Still, I have experienced it myself and would like her NOT to be in tht situation.

Conclusion: There are a million diferent situations, its what happens on the day. Aikido I thinks trains you to feel rather than perform. In a fight you have a split second to remeber a move, a counter and a counter to that. If you can feel the flow you can see a bigger picture.
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Old 02-26-2004, 03:23 AM   #96
Johnny Chiutten
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Challenger?

Enough of talking about if Aikido works or not.Time to prove your theories! There is an individual in Australia by the name of Tony Bonello. He has challenged anyone from any art to fight him. He has offered $50.000 to anyone who can beat him. Any offers? Check him out. http://www.xfc.com.au/fighters.php?view=56
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Old 02-26-2004, 02:38 PM   #97
L. Camejo
 
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Well my Aikido worked very well just this week when I got attacked by 8 guys who tried to rob me at the yearly Carnival celebrations in our country.

I learnt something new about multiple attacker randori too - sometimes all you need to defeat/ward off many attackers is to effectively scare the first one with a well-placed shomen ate and kotegaeshi (which is exactly what happened). I'm happy that they had no weapons though, or things may have gotten nasty. Also realised that their MO was to get me on the ground where they could have encircled me and kicked my brains in.

Also realised that after practicing in class to get attacked on a regular basis (with someone who is resisting), when it happened for real it did not unsettle me at all really. I was back in the party again after a couple of minutes.

Anyways, it was fun (for me anyway) and no one got seriously hurt, I think. But I guess they will think twice next time.

Train hard all - you get out what you put in.

L.C.

Last edited by L. Camejo : 02-26-2004 at 02:41 PM.

--Mushin Mugamae - No Mind No Posture. He who is possessed by nothing possesses everything.--
http://www.tntaikido.org
http://www.mushinkan.ca
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Old 02-26-2004, 02:50 PM   #98
Ron Tisdale
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Good goin' Larry! Glad it came out alright.

Best Regards,

Ron

Ron Tisdale
-----------------------
"The higher a monkey climbs, the more you see of his behind."
St. Bonaventure (ca. 1221-1274)
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Old 02-26-2004, 03:02 PM   #99
Andy
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Quote:
Jack Robertson wrote:
The only real advice [etc etc etc]
Aren't you at least several years too early to be dispensing Aikido advice? Have you even started training yet?
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Old 02-26-2004, 03:41 PM   #100
shihonage
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Quote:
Jack Robertson wrote:
If someone is aware of your abilities, there's not much they can do about it, unless they have a gun. I mean, in hand to hand, they would have to be a pretty good Aikidoka themselves to be able to accurately anticipate what you would do and chances are that if they were a good Aikidoka, they wouldn't be attacking you.
Thank you for for visiting my "Self-defense theory and dreams" class.

In case you didn't get my name, it's Jack.

Professor Jack.

Make sure to stay for my next class, "Virgins discussing sex", where you can expect to get the same quality of sharp and life-changing commentary on subjects I have watched videos about.
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