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Old 06-23-2003, 08:02 AM   #51
Dave Miller
 
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Dojo: UCO Budo Society
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With kote gaeshi especially, we have a dispute among senseis (albeit a friendly dispute) as to how it should go. Some suggest that there should be some movement by uke into the technique whereas others advocate a more direct throw by nage. I have learned it both ways and can do it either way but the more direct throw makes more sense to me for the reason you gave. If uke isn't trying to attack further but rather attempting to escape (as in the first scenario) then there is really no reason for the throw. In the second scenario, uke is attacking throughout the entire technique which not only makes the throw make more sense, it also makes it technically easier for both uke and nage, IMHO.

DAVE

If you're working too hard, you're doing it wrong.
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Old 06-24-2003, 02:04 PM   #52
Paula Lydon
Dojo: Aikido Shugenkai
Location: Colorado
Join Date: Jun 2002
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~~Hi Ryan,



Over the past couple of years I've really been fascinated with the role of uke. How to save my own butt, feeling openings in nage's movement, the mirror image of nage/uke, etc. Lately I've been noticing the value of clearly understanding the role in each technique that uke must play for learning to occur. Giving the appropriate attack and movement for nage to work on a particular tech. both logically and as realistically as we can make it in a dojo setting.

Often I find my partner giving movement that is either counter or not fully exicuted for what we're working on and I realized that most of that simply comes down to them not fully understanding the dynamic we're working on. So, for my part, I'm making an effort to go back and make sure I understand, as uke, my side of techniques. Nage is working on this move BECAUSE I'm giving them this action or responding to them thusly.

Take care!

~~Paula~~
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Old 07-15-2003, 06:02 AM   #53
rafaelgrativol
Dojo: Associaçăo Budôkai de Aikidô
Location: Vitória - ES, Brazil
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My sensei is always saying that what is important in being a uke are mostly perform a good (realistic) attack and while the tori is performing the movement the uke is supposed to deffend himself/herself...
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Old 07-15-2003, 07:34 AM   #54
jxa127
Dojo: Itten Dojo -- Mechanicsburg, PA
Location: Harrisburg, PA
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Quote:
Rafael Grativol (rafaelgrativol) wrote:
My sensei is always saying that what is important in being a uke are mostly perform a good (realistic) attack and while the tori is performing the movement the uke is supposed to deffend himself/herself...
Rafael,

That's interesting. I've been taught the opposite: like you say, uke should perform a good, realistic, attack, but then uke should continue to attack until thrown! If uke is defending him or herself, they he or she is not attacking. A defending uke is a lot easier to deal with than an attacking one.

Regards,

-Drew

----
-Drew Ames
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Old 07-15-2003, 08:18 AM   #55
Charles Hill
Dojo: Numazu Aikikai/Aikikai Honbu Dojo
Location: Three Lakes WI/ Mishima Japan
Join Date: May 2003
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I think that the ideal ukemi combines the ideas in both Rafael and Drew's posts. One should attack and continue that attack until there is somekind of positive motion by nage. Then the uke should react to that. If that positive motion is let up, then uke continues an attack. I think one way uke defends him/herself is by taking a fall when they have no other choice.

BTW, I just got Donovan Waite's first Ukemi video and it is excellent.

Charles
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Old 07-15-2003, 08:44 AM   #56
Mel Barker
Dojo: University of Louisville Aikido Club
Location: Louisville, KY
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Quote:
Dave Miller wrote:
If uke isn't trying to attack further but rather attempting to escape (as in the first scenario) then there is really no reason for the throw.
Why not? How do you study against resistance (which is someone not attacking by my reckoning, i.e. escaping)?

Mel Barker

Last edited by Mel Barker : 07-15-2003 at 08:52 AM.
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Old 07-15-2003, 08:51 AM   #57
Mel Barker
Dojo: University of Louisville Aikido Club
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Quote:
Drew Ames (jxa127) wrote:
A defending uke is a lot easier to deal with than an attacking one.
I have the exact opposite experience. Throwing someone attacking is a breeze, but even a relative newcomer that tries not to be thrown, but not attacking is most problematic.

Mel Barker
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Old 07-15-2003, 09:17 AM   #58
Dave Miller
 
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Quote:
Mel Barker wrote:
Why not? How do you study against resistance (which is someone not attacking by my reckoning, i.e. escaping)?

Mel Barker
If the person is trying to escape, i.e. move away, I just let go. They will stumble back, possibly falling, and then decide what they want to do next. The point is that I'm not gonna try to force the technique but rather just flow with uke.

DAVE

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