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Old 09-29-2017, 05:44 AM   #1
"anon wbelt"
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Anonymous User
Predator Sensei

Hi,

I am a white belt who is married and my sensei is a married man as well as significantly older than me. He hits all the points on this list

http://thinklikeablackbelt.com/blog/...nal-predators/

Long and short is I have always had affections and strong admiration for his aikido (very beautiful), the dojo is a key part of my life, he is a handsome man and embodies authority. But up until recently this was not a problem because we both had our situation and he is newlywed (last year). However lately I was spending more time alone with him after training and he offered a therapy (he is a trained therapist) because he sensed I was stressed. I accepted and after lots of feeling - initially for the therapy - he must have detected my attraction, because he started to hold me intimately. I pulled away because I am a married woman and he told me to go, but then I stopped at the door and he pulled me to him again until again I pulled back and left. Since then we spoke about it twice, once from me telling him we can never be alone again because this can't happen but I want to remain his student. He said this is fine and nothing will change on his part, no problem. But the next day, again briefly alone (I was last out of the dojo), he is touching my hair, my arm, breathes in my ear that I am close (not consciously, putting something on the pc), using me as uke a lot ever since.

When we spoke the second time (his request) he explained that he doesn't think this is a bad thing, there should be no guilt or shame, it is natural and enjoyable, fun even. He said it is like technique, you can resist or you can embrace it. I told him he is playing games. He seems to enjoy very much my discomfort and distraction during the last days. I have not told my husband, because he would make me quit the dojo and it is my life and nothing has happened. But I feel terribly because yes, a part of me wants him very much, even if it would just be sex, but I cannot do that to my loving husband. I have one friend I trust very much and spoke with him about it (he knows and hates the sensei) and he anticipated everything that happened. He told me sensei will not give up because he always gets what he wants. I don't know what to do. I would like to hear opinions

Thanks
Anon
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Old 11-21-2017, 03:42 PM   #2
Mary Eastland
 
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Re: Predator Sensei

Find another dojo.

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Old 11-21-2017, 04:38 PM   #3
Peter Goldsbury
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Re: Predator Sensei

Ditto to what Mary advised.

P A Goldsbury
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Old 11-21-2017, 05:16 PM   #4
Demetrio Cereijo
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Re: Predator Sensei

Quote:
Anonymous User wrote: View Post
I don't know what to do. I would like to hear opinions.
Run away.
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Old 11-21-2017, 08:35 PM   #5
lbb
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Re: Predator Sensei

Leave. This cannot end well.
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Old 11-21-2017, 09:19 PM   #6
robin_jet_alt
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Re: Predator Sensei

Quote:
Mary Malmros wrote: View Post
Leave. This cannot end well.
Agreed. Don't delay.
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Old 11-22-2017, 02:15 AM   #7
shizentai
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Re: Predator Sensei

Quote:
He said it is like technique, you can resist or you can embrace it.
Leave Sensei Weinstein right now.

Quote:
a part of me wants him very much, even if it would just be sex
While you're making change, consider re-evaluating what exactly do you want from a partner at this point in time... husband or otherwise.
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Old 11-22-2017, 06:10 AM   #8
erikmenzel
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Re: Predator Sensei

Ditto to what Mary said.

Erik Jurrien Menzel
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Old 11-22-2017, 08:52 AM   #9
lbb
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Re: Predator Sensei

Um, also...this is up to you, but if your dojo is part of a larger association, it should have a harassment policy. Birankai North America does, it is posted in every dojo and contains contact information. If there is a way to report this sensei's behavior to the association, please consider doing so. You will be helping others. And if you don't feel safe or okay doing this now, please document what happened. One day you may feel like speaking out.
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Old 11-22-2017, 05:46 PM   #10
Ellis Amdur
 
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Re: Predator Sensei

Part of what makes people like this so good at what they do is they convince you that their art (in this case aikido) is unlike any other, uniquely graceful, powerful, etc. They put you in a false dilemma (actually, you put yourself in that dilemma) when you believe that if you leave, you will never have another chance in life at something so special.

The proof of this is you making your husband to be the bad guy. "He'll make me leave the dojo" - the bad guy is the man who has such disrespect for your marriage that he has you 'agreeing' to keep a secret from your husband, one that is, without him knowing affecting you and thus your relationship with him.

If budo - aikido - should be instruction on integrity, you are getting instruction on the lack of integrity. Hence you are not in a budo dojo. And if aikido is a budo, then you are not, in fact, in an aikido dojo either. Just an imitation of one.

Yes, you should leave. Staying will damage your marriage, your sense of respect and eventually, quite likely you'll be so burned out, very possibly will quit not only the dojo, but aikido itsel.

There is nothing good for you there.

Ellis Amdur

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Old 11-22-2017, 06:39 PM   #11
Mary Eastland
 
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Re: Predator Sensei

Your wrote: I have not told my husband, because he would make me quit the dojo and it is my life and nothing has happened. But I feel terribly because yes, a part of me wants him very much, even if it would just be sex, but I cannot do that to my loving husband. I have one friend I trust very much and spoke with him about it (he knows and hates the sensei) and he anticipated everything that happened. He told me sensei will not give up because he always gets what he wants. I don't know what to do. I would like to hear opinions

This sounds tricky to me. You are a grown up. If you lied or cheated you would be hurting yourself.

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Old 11-22-2017, 07:43 PM   #12
Peter Goldsbury
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Re: Predator Sensei

Again, ditto to what Ellis Amdur and Mary Eastland stated, in Posts #10 and #11.

I have always understood aikido to be about integrity, and honesty with oneself, developed through training. The way you treat your opponents in the dojo is supposed to have a direct and mutual relationship with the way you handle your relationships outside the dojo. In this respect, instructors have a double responsibility. In the dojo, they have to teach their own students to cultivate these virtues, but to do this, they have to display the virtues in good measure themselves.

All my teachers have been Japanese, and have rigidly separated their own 'private lives' from their 'training lives' on the tatami. They never gave me any opportunity to make negative judgments about the former. I once had an occasion to confront a Japanese aikido shihan about the rough way he treated his students, but this concerned the way he treated students in the dojo: the way he conducted his own domestic relationships was absolutely no concern of mine. (Though I knew much about this aspect of his life also, I knew it because the shihan himself asked me to do so, introducing me to some of his non-aikido friends. However-and this point is very important, when this happened I moved from being his student to being a friend.)

For your dojo instructor to interfere in your relationship with your own husband is, in my opinion, a cardinal sin, well up on the same level as the seven deadly sins. An instructor simply should not do this, despite all the temptations involved. Being able to resist such temptations is, my opinion, part of what it means to be an instructor. This is especially important in a full-body art like aikido.

P A Goldsbury
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Old 11-23-2017, 07:24 AM   #13
Demetrio Cereijo
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Re: Predator Sensei

Quote:
Peter A Goldsbury wrote: View Post
Being able to resist such temptations is, my opinion, part of what it means to be an instructor.
A very important part, IMO.
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Old 11-24-2017, 03:33 PM   #14
Janet Rosen
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Re: Predator Sensei

Quote:
Ellis Amdur wrote: View Post
The proof of this is you making your husband to be the bad guy. "He'll make me leave the dojo" - the bad guy is the man who has such disrespect for your marriage that he has you 'agreeing' to keep a secret from your husband, one that is, without him knowing affecting you and thus your relationship with him.
THIS.

Your sensei is a sick fuck and he is playing on exactly the strings he knows will work.

OF COURSE your husband will want you to leave the dojo. ANYBODY who cares at all about either you as a person or about the integrity of martial arts will tell you to leave the dojo.

Get out, no explanation to Sick Fuck Sensei is needed and in fact you should absolutely NOT engage in further discussions with him. Report to any larger organization. And look around for a better place to train.

Janet Rosen
http://www.zanshinart.com
"peace will enter when hate is gone"--percy mayfield
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Old 11-24-2017, 03:36 PM   #15
Janet Rosen
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Re: Predator Sensei

Quote:
Peter A Goldsbury wrote: View Post
Again, ditto to what Ellis Amdur and Mary Eastland stated, in Posts #10 and #11.
Being able to resist such temptations is, my opinion, part of what it means to be an instructor. This is especially important in a full-body art like aikido.
Understand that the predator has no interest in resisting temptation. He only pretends to be in conflict in order to play this tug-release-tug game with you, much more effective for snaring you than simply taking what he wants.

Janet Rosen
http://www.zanshinart.com
"peace will enter when hate is gone"--percy mayfield
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Old 11-25-2017, 06:18 AM   #16
SeiserL
 
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Re: Predator Sensei

Bow out and walk away ...

Lynn Seiser PhD
Yondan Aikido & FMA/JKD
We do not rise to the level of our expectations, but fall to the level of our training. Train well. KWATZ!
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Old 11-25-2017, 05:46 PM   #17
Susan Dalton
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Re: Predator Sensei

Yes, to all of the above. Many years ago I was heartbroken to learn that some of my friends in the dojo did not see aikido from the same point of view I did. My sensei told me that people get into martial arts for all kinds of reasons, some to practice budo and become better human beings, some for the power they can exert over others. Run.
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Old 11-27-2017, 07:41 AM   #18
philipsmith
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Re: Predator Sensei

abuse of position pure and simple.
Walk away now
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Old 11-28-2017, 04:03 PM   #19
Michael Hackett
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Re: Predator Sensei

You've already defined just what kind of a person your teacher is and recognize what a danger to your marriage he represents. Now, is aikido as important to you as your marriage? Are there other dojo in your region where you could continue your training safely? If not, so what? Aikido is an important part of my life - something I can't conceive of abandoning, but I would instantly find another art if my marriage were threatened by aikido.

One of the concepts in aikido training is developing the ability to avoid conflict when possible. Here is a great opportunity for you to practice that component of the art. Leave this teacher and his dojo and never look back. Nothing he has to offer is worth the pain and suffering you and your husband will experience.

Best wishes

Michael
"Leave the gun. Bring the cannoli."
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Old 12-04-2017, 01:55 PM   #20
Larry Feldman
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Re: Predator Sensei

Anon - Aside from the consistent excellent advice you received, I wanted to mention that Ellis and Lynn are 'mental health professionals'. LISTEN TO THEM.

Any short term discomfort in a move will be well offset by long term sanity.
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Old 12-04-2017, 02:37 PM   #21
ChrisMoses
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Re: Predator Sensei

Get the eff out and make sure you tell the rest of the women training there about it. Even money you're not the only one who he's doing this with. Totally unacceptable. There's a teacher in my town who years ago decided to "rededicate" himself to his marriage. So before he bowed in class, kicked all of the women he was dating on the side out of his dojo. People still don't want to talk about it, but everyone training at the time knew about it.

Chris Moses
TNBBC, "Putting the ME in MEdiocre!"
Budo Tanren at Seattle School of Aikido
Shinto Ryu Iai-Battojutsu
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Old 12-05-2017, 09:26 AM   #22
Mary Eastland
 
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Re: Predator Sensei

Sound advice is to get out now.

The other advice about telling what is happening may not be so good. Whistle blowers are not embraced.

You may be feeling vulnerable because a place where you sought strength and empowerment turns out to be not safe. Adding to that shakey feeling by telling "authorities" may not be helpful.

I like Mary M's thought about documenting the process and deciding if you want to tell or may want to share at a later time.

I don't think you have any responsibly to other women or an organization at the moment. The main thing is help yourself. Only you can do that.

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Old 12-05-2017, 09:55 AM   #23
Demetrio Cereijo
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Re: Predator Sensei

Quote:
Mary Eastland wrote: View Post
I don't think you have any responsibly to other women or an organization at the moment.
At the moment?

Maybe after that predator actually victimize someone would be a good moment? After the third victim? The fourth?

Please do tell us what is the number of victims needed to take action.
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Old 12-05-2017, 10:25 AM   #24
RonRagusa
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Re: Predator Sensei

Quote:
Demetrio Cereijo wrote: View Post
At the moment?

Maybe after that predator actually victimize someone would be a good moment? After the third victim? The fourth?

Please do tell us what is the number of victims needed to take action.
Perhaps you've never had any experience being a whistle blower. If she (the original poster) publicizes the sensei's behavior most likely she will be ostracized by the rest of the dojo. Without concrete proof of predatory behavior by her sensei, it's her word against his and that rarely ends well for the accuser.

One only look to the news to see how women who come forward with accusations of sexual harassment are publicly vilified; even when the alleged harasser is taped bragging about his exploits.

Ron

Last edited by RonRagusa : 12-05-2017 at 10:35 AM.

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Old 12-05-2017, 10:39 AM   #25
Demetrio Cereijo
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Re: Predator Sensei

Quote:
Ron Ragusa wrote: View Post
Perhaps you've never had any experience being a whistle blower. If she (the original poster) publicizes the sensei's behavior most likely she will be ostracized by the rest of the dojo. Without concrete proof of predatory behavior by her sensei, it's her word against his and that rarely ends well for the accuser.

Ron
So what? If what OP said is true, she needs to get her ass outside of that dojo ASAP. The risk of being ostracized by her former dojo members is the less worrying of her problems.

Quote:
One only look to the news to see how women who come forward with accusations of sexual harassment are publicly vilified; even when the alleged harasser is taped bragging about his exploits.
Err... as I don't want to be banned, at least until Prof Goldsbury publishes his last TIE column, I better stop posting in this thread.

Last edited by Demetrio Cereijo : 12-05-2017 at 10:44 AM.
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