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Old 02-15-2016, 03:00 PM   #1
kewms
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The best way to win is not to play

I spent a substantial chunk of time this morning escorting a neighbor, because she needed to get some things from her house and was afraid to be there alone with her husband.

As it turned out, he decided that sulking in a back room was better than provoking a confrontation, so I didn't have a chance to apply Aikido in Real Life (tm). Except of course to whatever extent my merely being there helped. And so I don't have any great anecdotes about how brutal a koshinage takedown is for untrained people.

Oh well.

I don't have any upcoming court dates or doctor visits, either. And I do have a neighbor who is on her way to a safer place without any (additional) untoward incidents. I guess that will have to do.

Katherine
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Old 02-15-2016, 04:09 PM   #2
Cliff Judge
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Re: The best way to win is not to play

Bravo, Katherine. That's living Aikido right there.
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Old 02-15-2016, 04:52 PM   #3
rugwithlegs
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Re: The best way to win is not to play

Well done. You took a terrible highly volatile situation and didn't make it worse. That is very difficult to do! It sounds like you were ready either way.

I'm glad you could be there for your friend and I hope the best for her going forward.
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Old 02-15-2016, 05:35 PM   #4
kewms
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Re: The best way to win is not to play

Living budo, maybe. I would hope any martial artist would do the same.

Or any human, really.

I didn't post the story so you all could pat me on the back -- though of course I don't mind that -- but rather as a counterexample to some of the never-ending "Aikido vs. X" threads.

Out in the real world, you don't know what training the other person has (if any). You don't know what he's going to do (if anything). But then, he doesn't know those things about you, either.

Katherine
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Old 02-15-2016, 06:56 PM   #5
Rupert Atkinson
 
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Re: The best way to win is not to play

Fighting is rarely necessary. Your internal strength gave you what you needed to get through the situation. If you had been some bad-ass boxer/NHB fighter you would likely have actively provoked confrontation and beaten up the guy.

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Old 02-16-2016, 04:52 AM   #6
rugwithlegs
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Re: The best way to win is not to play

Quote:
Katherine Derbyshire wrote: View Post
Living budo, maybe. I would hope any martial artist would do the same.

I didn't post the story so you all could pat me on the back... but rather as a counterexample to some of the never-ending "Aikido vs. X" threads.

Katherine
I still feel the compliment, but okay, I'll follow the counter example of Aikido versus _______.

1. What part of the situation is an example of your Aikido? A result of your specific training?
2. What is it you feel you did that lead to a non-violent incident? Were you an active part or did you get lucky while just letting things run their course?
3. Would anyone regardless of Aikido, or training have had the same outcome with the husband acting the same?

I remember a class by a karate shihan years ago where he said aikido and karate people were rare, so never yell, "Help!" He advised instead that we all yell, "Fire!" Because people love watching flames and come running over, but he also said that people are scared and not willing to risk themselves for others in a dangerous situation so yelling for help makes people stop or hide or pretend they never heard anything.

I do share your frustration over the narrative that is out there - that many a business trying to sell their brand is declaring they are the only truth and way, and aikido students and prospective students are buying in to that conversation. If some online troll declared they sold the World's Greatest Hamburger, Better Than Any Other, most people wouldn't take it seriously or even invest time in the conversation. Violence is not trademarked, or even clearly definable. We give the trolls the power here. It was good to see an infusion of reality.
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Old 02-16-2016, 07:33 AM   #7
dps
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Re: The best way to win is not to play

Standing up to a bully and a coward does not take any kind of martial arts training ( not to diminish Katherine martial arts capabilities ).

I stopped a younger man bigger and stronger than me who was in my face threatening me and asking " What are you going to ******* do, What are you going to ******* do.?"
I took out my cellphone and dialed 911.
Fight over before it began.

What it does take is the guts to do it and the wisdom to know when and how.

Political correctness aside, you are one of the "good guys".

dps
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Old 02-16-2016, 10:26 AM   #8
kewms
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Re: The best way to win is not to play

Quote:
John Hillson wrote: View Post
I still feel the compliment, but okay, I'll follow the counter example of Aikido versus _______.

1. What part of the situation is an example of your Aikido? A result of your specific training?
2. What is it you feel you did that lead to a non-violent incident? Were you an active part or did you get lucky while just letting things run their course?
3. Would anyone regardless of Aikido, or training have had the same outcome with the husband acting the same?
Unknown and unknowable. Which is my point.

Katherine
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Old 02-16-2016, 10:51 AM   #9
Demetrio Cereijo
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Re: The best way to win is not to play

Quote:
Rupert Atkinson wrote: View Post
If you had been some bad-ass boxer/NHB fighter you would likely have actively provoked confrontation and beaten up the guy.
And then set fire to the house, kill the dog and shot the milkman.

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Old 02-16-2016, 10:58 AM   #10
phitruong
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Re: The best way to win is not to play

Quote:
Katherine Derbyshire wrote: View Post
As it turned out, he decided that sulking in a back room was better than provoking a confrontation, so I didn't have a chance to apply Aikido in Real Life (tm). Except of course to whatever extent my merely being there helped. And so I don't have any great anecdotes about how brutal a koshinage takedown is for untrained people.
it could have gone bad in another direction. he could have coming out shooting.

a few folks I knew in LEO told me that many of the domestic violent situations were great deal more dangerous. sometimes, the folks, that they came to protect, turned against the LEOs, sort of Stockholm syndrome.

"budo is putting on cold, wet, sweat stained gi with a smile and a snarl" - your truly
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Old 02-16-2016, 11:47 AM   #11
kewms
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Re: The best way to win is not to play

Quote:
Phi Truong wrote: View Post
it could have gone bad in another direction. he could have coming out shooting.
I knew going in that there were no guns in the house. Had there been, my approach would probably have involved calling the professionals.

Katherine
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Old 02-16-2016, 05:30 PM   #12
Le Samourai
 
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Re: The best way to win is not to play

As others have noted, domestic violence situations are very risky for all those involved, including Good Samaritans and police officers. You were very wise to handle it like you did.

To offer a POV from a different martial tradition: Most of my training has been in the Filipino martial arts, many of which are quite different philosophically than Aikido. They tend to be, essentially, killing and maiming arts. Perhaps paradoxically, I will choose "not to play" precisely because of this. I know where things could go and how they could end, and I have no desire to kill or main another living thing (or be killed or maimed myself!) if it is at all possible to avoid doing so.

And David… I've done the exact same thing with my cell phone when faced with an irate meth addict.

—Le Samourai

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http://www.agentintraining.com/
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Old 02-17-2016, 12:40 PM   #13
kewms
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Re: The best way to win is not to play

Quote:
Brandon Bosworth wrote: View Post
To offer a POV from a different martial tradition: Most of my training has been in the Filipino martial arts, many of which are quite different philosophically than Aikido. They tend to be, essentially, killing and maiming arts. Perhaps paradoxically, I will choose "not to play" precisely because of this. I know where things could go and how they could end, and I have no desire to kill or main another living thing (or be killed or maimed myself!) if it is at all possible to avoid doing so.
Makes perfect sense to me. The more you understand the downsides of a possible confrontation, the less attractive confrontation becomes.

Katherine
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Old 02-17-2016, 10:57 PM   #14
Janet Rosen
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Re: The best way to win is not to play

Well done. Many times doing night time street patrols, it was enough to simply stand quietly next to a woman waiting alone at a bus stop to keep opportunists walking on. Having Presence and having presence of mind, however we learn these things, is key.

Janet Rosen
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"peace will enter when hate is gone"--percy mayfield
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Old 03-10-2016, 12:52 PM   #15
Mary Eastland
 
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Re: The best way to win is not to play

[quote=Katherine Derbyshire;346917]Living budo, maybe. I would hope any martial artist would do the same.

Or any human, really.

I didn't post the story so you all could pat me on the back -- though of course I don't mind that -- but rather as a counterexample to some of the never-ending "Aikido vs. X" threads.

Out in the real world, you don't know what training the other person has (if any). You don't know what he's going to do (if anything). But then, he doesn't know those things about you, either.

Katherine[/QUOTE

I am not sure why the assumption is made that anyone should do the same.

Domestic situations can be really dangerous. It sounds like you had foreknowledge about the situation and made your choices based on that.

And not getting involved in other people domestic squabbles could also be considered good self- defense because the dynamics, as we all know, are based on a lot more that just physicality.

This is not a judgment of your choice but a counterpoint of your observation that anyone should do the same.

Each situation could be carefully considered and then the choice made with the individual putting their own safety first.

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Old 03-21-2016, 07:48 AM   #16
earnest aikidoka
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Re: The best way to win is not to play

When is a bluff scary?

When it is called.
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