Welcome to AikiWeb Aikido Information
AikiWeb: The Source for Aikido Information
AikiWeb's principal purpose is to serve the Internet community as a repository and dissemination point for aikido information.

Sections
home
aikido articles
columns

Discussions
forums
aikiblogs

Databases
dojo search
seminars
image gallery
supplies
links directory

Reviews
book reviews
video reviews
dvd reviews
equip. reviews

News
submit
archive

Miscellaneous
newsletter
rss feeds
polls
about

Follow us on



Home > AikiWeb Aikido Forums
Go Back   AikiWeb Aikido Forums > General

Hello and thank you for visiting AikiWeb, the world's most active online Aikido community! This site is home to over 22,000 aikido practitioners from around the world and covers a wide range of aikido topics including techniques, philosophy, history, humor, beginner issues, the marketplace, and more.

If you wish to join in the discussions or use the other advanced features available, you will need to register first. Registration is absolutely free and takes only a few minutes to complete so sign up today!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 09-20-2015, 06:36 PM   #1951
Demetrio Cereijo
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,075
Spain
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

LOL

You got me.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2015, 08:01 PM   #1952
rugwithlegs
Dojo: Open Sky Aikikai
Location: Durham, NC
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 326
United_States
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

I liked him better when he was making people eat deer penises on Fear Factor. Sell Out!
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2015, 08:05 PM   #1953
mathewjgano
 
mathewjgano's Avatar
Dojo: Tsubaki Kannagara Jinja Aikidojo; Himeji Shodokan Dojo
Location: Renton
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,212
United_States
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Demetrio Cereijo wrote: View Post
OK, I'll bite..

Who amongst you is going to show Rogan how wrong he is?
I totally would, but I got this thing at a place...and then after that I got this other thing...and these posts aren't going to type themselves. Very busy schedule you see, or I totally would.

To my mind, the issue of whether or not something is going to "work in a fight" comes down to a caveat or two: against whom, under what circumstances, etc.?

Gambarimashyo!
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2015, 08:27 PM   #1954
Rupert Atkinson
 
Rupert Atkinson's Avatar
Dojo: Wherever I am.
Location: New Zealand
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 892
United Kingdom
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Aikido - the techniques - as people know it to be - is not supposed to work in a fight. It is not Ai-ki-do; it is Aiki-do = The Way of Aiki -- a way to develop aiki. The techniques of Aiki-do are meant to help develop aiki. They are not techniques useful for fighting per se. I have been thinking, searching, messing with this for quite some time. There is the soft 'fluffy' type of aiki and there is a harder 'active' type that is practical. Both are necessary but the harder type is definitely good for fighting, if that is what you want to do.

Is there anybody out there ...

Last edited by Rupert Atkinson : 09-20-2015 at 08:31 PM.

  Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2015, 06:18 AM   #1955
Amir Krause
Dojo: Shirokan Dojo / Tel Aviv Israel
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 678
Israel
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Rupert Atkinson wrote: View Post
Aikido - the techniques - as people know it to be - is not supposed to work in a fight. It is not Ai-ki-do; it is Aiki-do = The Way of Aiki -- a way to develop aiki. The techniques of Aiki-do are meant to help develop aiki. They are not techniques useful for fighting per se. I have been thinking, searching, messing with this for quite some time. There is the soft 'fluffy' type of aiki and there is a harder 'active' type that is practical. Both are necessary but the harder type is definitely good for fighting, if that is what you want to do.

Is there anybody out there ...
Almost all techniques in Aikido are not unique, same techniques may be found in jujutsu and were used for fighting. Very similar techniques exist in various other fighting styles. It's not the techniques, it is how you train \ practice. And different places teach different things ...

Still amazed this old thread had come up again
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2015, 07:50 AM   #1956
jdm4life
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 52
United_States
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Amir Krause wrote: View Post
Almost all techniques in Aikido are not unique, same techniques may be found in jujutsu and were used for fighting. Very similar techniques exist in various other fighting styles. It's not the techniques, it is how you train \ practice. And different places teach different things ...

Still amazed this old thread had come up again
It comes up time and again because the same questions still arise about aikido and its purpose, effectiveness................ saying its not about fighting to people who practice is pointless........ Humans look for meaning and logic and aikido means different things to different people.........but why was it developed in the first place....in a post war era.......the emphasis may have been directed towards hugging trees and being nice, but the reality of the modern day contradicts that philosophy because there are a lot of nasty shits out there who hurt people on a daily basis...... peoples argument stands unchallenged or at least unexplained, its incomplete.

Aikido doesnt work in a fight.............depending how you approach that statement depends where the discussion goes......we know it isn't a fighting system...if you say aikido is of no use if you are attacked.....then what?

All that is a moot point aswell because I dont get into fights, I dont look to get into fights, Id avoid it at all costs but knowing your are participating in a self defense art that "could" get you out of a scrape if that situation ever presented itself feels better than knowing you are practicing a martial art which will be of no use to you whatsoever.

Despite or in spite of.

Last edited by jdm4life : 09-21-2015 at 07:58 AM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2015, 09:02 AM   #1957
Amir Krause
Dojo: Shirokan Dojo / Tel Aviv Israel
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 678
Israel
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Stephen Irving wrote: View Post
It comes up time and again because the same questions still arise about aikido and its purpose, effectiveness................ saying its not about fighting to people who practice is pointless........ Humans look for meaning and logic and aikido means different things to different people.........but why was it developed in the first place....in a post war era.......the emphasis may have been directed towards hugging trees and being nice, but the reality of the modern day contradicts that philosophy because there are a lot of nasty shits out there who hurt people on a daily basis...... peoples argument stands unchallenged or at least unexplained, its incomplete.

Aikido doesnt work in a fight.............depending how you approach that statement depends where the discussion goes......we know it isn't a fighting system...if you say aikido is of no use if you are attacked.....then what?

All that is a moot point aswell because I dont get into fights, I dont look to get into fights, Id avoid it at all costs but knowing your are participating in a self defense art that "could" get you out of a scrape if that situation ever presented itself feels better than knowing you are practicing a martial art which will be of no use to you whatsoever.

Despite or in spite of.
As someone who found interest in aikido history, trying to figure out the history of the Aikido I keep learning (Korindo Aikido) and it's connection to Ueshiba:
Ueshiba Aikido was mostly developed before WWII. It's true, the art kept changing, but it's doubtful the techniques themselves were changed. Especially since as pointed out before, same techniques appear in multiple Ju-Jutsu styles, and other systems have them too.

Hence - it's not the techniques, nor the history. It's the practitioner mindset, and those change across sub-styles, teachers and students. Some places teach Aikido which wouldn't work in a fight, others teach Aikido which could work, just like any other M.A. - if the student is good enough.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2015, 10:43 AM   #1958
lbb
Location: Massachusetts
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,058
United_States
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Again with this thread?

If you keep biting on the same old stinky bait, that should tell you something, shouldn't it?
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2015, 10:50 AM   #1959
kewms
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,316
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Some of the post-war aikido students used to work as strike breakers. Others used to go to the bars where longshoremen hung out and pick fights just to "see if this stuff works."

I do not personally recommend this strategy...

If you think aikido is "of no use whatsoever," why are you here?

Ultimately, the question is impossible to answer via an internet forum. Find a willing partner, think of a scenario that seems reasonable to you, and see what happens.

Katherine
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2015, 07:31 PM   #1960
jdm4life
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 52
United_States
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Katherine Derbyshire wrote: View Post
Some of the post-war aikido students used to work as strike breakers. Others used to go to the bars where longshoremen hung out and pick fights just to "see if this stuff works."

I do not personally recommend this strategy...

If you think aikido is "of no use whatsoever," why are you here?

Ultimately, the question is impossible to answer via an internet forum. Find a willing partner, think of a scenario that seems reasonable to you, and see what happens.

Katherine
I dont, I just find it strange that its subjected to so much scrutiny and not just by people who have never been to a practice session.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2015, 12:51 AM   #1961
kewms
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,316
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

There is a certain fraction of the aikido community that tends to look down their noses at students of other martial arts in general and combat sports in particular. The more vocal one is about "resolving conflicts without fighting," the more scrutiny one's ability (or lack thereof) is likely to attract. Especially among people whose fighting ability is an important part of their self-image.

There are also some demonstrations of aikido out there -- some of them by people with big numbers after their names -- that are frankly embarrassing, even to aikidoka. Someone who has personal experience with karate will be able to dismiss the bad karate videos that exist, but won't have any context for the bad aikido videos.

Katherine
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2015, 05:38 AM   #1962
jdm4life
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 52
United_States
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Katherine Derbyshire wrote: View Post

There are also some demonstrations of aikido out there -- some of them by people with big numbers after their names -- that are frankly embarrassing, even to aikidoka. Someone who has personal experience with karate will be able to dismiss the bad karate videos that exist, but won't have any context for the bad aikido videos.

Katherine
Indeed...... Good point. Ive seen some of these videos and it makes me cringe.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2016, 07:02 PM   #1963
SlowLerner
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 18
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

OP is right, you can't fight with Aikido.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2016, 07:22 PM   #1964
SlowLerner
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 18
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Is fighting self defence?
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2016, 10:55 PM   #1965
SlowLerner
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 18
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Keep in mind when you are practising that uke can't reach you with a free hand. They may draw a concealed weapon during the movement.
Aikido techniques and pins, like Ikkyo, if done correctly should address this. Technique is important.

Last edited by SlowLerner : 10-18-2016 at 11:03 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2016, 02:24 AM   #1966
Tim Ruijs
 
Tim Ruijs's Avatar
Dojo: Makato/Netherlands
Location: Netherlands - Leusden
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 463
Netherlands
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

september 22nd 2015...
revived!

In a real fight:
* If you make a bad decision, you die.
* If you don't decide anything, you die.
Aikido teaches you how to decide.
www.aikido-makato.nl
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2016, 12:00 AM   #1967
ryback
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 243
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

This has gone so long, I can't even remember if I have already posted in this thread, so I hope I am not repeating myself here...
Anyway, what I would like to say applies generally, no matter how many times this subject will be addressed or how long this thread will end up to be.
If the OP, or anybody else who have posted on the thread thinks that Aikido doesn't work in a fight, then the only thing they can actually mean is that THEIR Aikido doesn't work. In my experience Aikido works perfectly in any form of a fighting situation, against one or multiple attackers, against armed or unarmed people, against other martial artists if need be. The only factor is how good the Aikidoist is.
There are many dojos out there that have a sign outside their doors that says "Aikido" and some of them are teaching a watered down Aiki Yoga of, some kind just fat people trying to...harmonize their asses together. Some of these dojos have legitimate Aikikai recognitions. Some of those...teachers have legitimate ranks and that fact alone shows how...legitimate a rank can be. In Martial Arts, the only rank that counts is effective technique that has the potential to work against anything.
So what do you mean by saying "Aikido doesn't work in a fight"? What do you mean when you say the word Aikido? Because, to me, what those dojos mentioned above teach, have nothing to do with Aikido.
So if people stop running around incompetent teachers who are promising great recognitions and start pursuing a serious training, a deep study of the Art in a dojo that teaches the practical application of Aikido, they will see that it works!
There are plenty of examples out there, Steven Seagal Sensei, Larry Reynosa Sensei, Nenad Ikras, Lenny Sly.... I don't necessarily agree with everyone's approach but technically they prove that Aikido actually works!
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2016, 10:26 PM   #1968
Mark Harrington
Dojo: Aikido Arnis of Farmville
Location: Greenville, NC
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 16
United_States
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work...

Why would you visit a forum for a martial art to denigrate it? This is simply irimi trolling and should be blended away from.

But since we're here...

When a pitcher throws a strike, do we say baseball worked for him? Or do we say baseball didn't work for the batter?

On the next pitch, if the batter puts it in play, do we say baseball worked for the batter? Or do we say baseball didn't work for the pitcher?

Now the ball is in the air, we can ask the same questions about the fielders, on and on.

Similarly, in a fight, it is the fighter and his skills, his fitness, and to some degree, the element of surprise. Win or lose, it is not an indictment of the art. The most the original poster can honestly say is that the aikidoka he has seen were not effective in their fights.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2016, 10:05 AM   #1969
sakumeikan
Dojo: Sakumeikan N.E. Aikkai .Newcastle upon Tyne.
Location: Newcastle upon Tyne
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,266
United Kingdom
Offline
Re: Aikido does not work at all in a fight.

Quote:
Stephen Irving wrote: View Post
He has a black belt in BJJ.....not me.
A Black belt nowadays is hardly a sign that anybody is an expert..Judo grades for example are almost like hire purchase agreements ie you get one over time period like an instalment plan..In my day you had a line up test.Only when you did the business on your opponents did you get upgraded.

Some Aikido schools are useless.The teachers give themselves high grades and in general some of them would be knocked about by an angry fly.The Aikido teachers I have met were no soft touches.If required they could be quite formidable.As for Joe Rogan how much personal experience has he had in terms of Aikido?I dont criticise MMA .Reason I do not practice this discipline.
  Reply With Quote

Please visit our sponsor:

AikiWeb Sponsored Links - Place your Aikido link here for only $10!



Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 2 (0 members and 2 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What exactly is an independent dojo? David Yap General 64 11-14-2011 03:05 PM
failed? Leon Aman General 15 09-28-2006 06:15 AM
Aliveness in Martial Arts Video Clip Richard Langridge Open Discussions 60 08-10-2006 10:28 PM
Omoto-kyo Theology senshincenter Spiritual 77 12-04-2005 10:50 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:22 AM.



vBulletin Copyright © 2000-2016 Jelsoft Enterprises Limited
----------
Copyright 1997-2016 AikiWeb and its Authors, All Rights Reserved.
----------
For questions and comments about this website:
Send E-mail
plainlaid-picaresque outchasing-protistan explicantia-altarage seaford-stellionate