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Old 10-30-2014, 05:54 PM   #76
Adam Huss
 
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Re: Wearing Hakama

Quote:
David Soroko wrote: View Post
Lifting his arm in despair for lack of hakamas
awesome

Ichi Go, Ichi Ei!
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Old 10-30-2014, 06:28 PM   #77
PeterR
 
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Re: Wearing Hakama

And then we have
Attached Images
 

Peter Rehse Shodokan Aikido
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Old 10-31-2014, 07:36 AM   #78
Greg Jennings
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Re: Wearing Hakama

Quote:
Adam Huss wrote: View Post
That would be naked.
Metaphor. Besides, I think perhaps naked would be more Greek than Roman.

Greg Jennings
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Old 10-31-2014, 09:38 AM   #79
Mary Eastland
 
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Re: Wearing Hakama

I wear hakama but no belt.

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Old 10-31-2014, 11:06 AM   #80
phitruong
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Re: Wearing Hakama

Quote:
Mary Eastland wrote: View Post
I wear hakama but no belt.
i wear belt but no hakama, in Greek style

"budo is putting on cold, wet, sweat stained gi with a smile and a snarl" - your truly
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Old 10-31-2014, 09:41 PM   #81
Mary Eastland
 
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Re: Wearing Hakama

You are just gross, Phi...consistently though

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Old 10-31-2014, 11:16 PM   #82
Dan Richards
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Re: Wearing Hakama

Phi brings so much to this community in terms of sobriety. He's like the dog that lies around at a big family reunion and licks his balls.
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Old 10-31-2014, 11:49 PM   #83
Adam Huss
 
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Re: Wearing Hakama

Quote:
Greg Jennings wrote: View Post
Metaphor. Besides, I think perhaps naked would be more Greek than Roman.
I was just making a joke. It does originate from Greece , the word gymnos, meaning naked, is where the Romans eventually got gymnasium from....where they would train for war naked and compete in gladiatorial events the same way. As sport, or training, were to help condition and prepare for combat.

Ichi Go, Ichi Ei!
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Old 11-01-2014, 08:53 PM   #84
Janet Rosen
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Re: Wearing Hakama

Quote:
Dan Richards wrote: View Post
Phi brings so much to this community in terms of sobriety. He's like the dog that lies around at a big family reunion and licks his balls.
Must be why I enjoy Phi so much. At family reunions and big parties I get bored or stupefied and look for the nearest dog to sit on the floor and hang out with.....(noting they are generally quick to stop licking their balls when a human is willing to talk and play)

Janet Rosen
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Old 11-18-2014, 08:49 PM   #85
TonyBlomert
 
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Re: Wearing Hakama

OMG - this hakama topic raises it's (ugly and graceful) head periodically. After reading everyone's posts, I just can't resist weighing in!

First and foremost, Aikido is considered by most to be a traditional martial art. Research into the hakama's history ties it to feudal Japan and the Samurai. Our budo is closely tied to our warrior roots! Aikido uses a joba hakama, to differentiate from other types and ceremonial formal wear. The joba hakama loosely translates into a "horse-riding type of contraption you step into (the divided skirt makes straddling a horse easier). Yes it was used by Samurai horseman and continued to be worn after the bushi become "on foot" soldiers. O'Sensei, being a traditionalist, understanding the formal wear of this times and based on his personal opinion chose to include the hakama as part of Aikido's training uniform. Because he wore a hakama (often white) it is part of Aikido today.

While it can be found in various colors, patterns and style variations - just like our traditional white / cream colored dogi - the most common color is black or dark navy. I don't know of any reason other than these colors are subtle and traditional to the martial arts. Perhaps they suggest a less ostentatious appearance. Again, just because it's common doesn't make it the only "proper" color. I've seen and trained with people wearing everything from "red and white" to "real tree camo" patterned hakama.

Those of use who are not native Japanese, need to keep in mind that overall Japanese society is conservative compared to our western/european way of thinking. What we may characterize as "sexist" relative to the different treatment of men and women, is just ingrained cultural habit to the Japanese. That said, I have not met a more polite and differential group of people than native Japanese.

Each Aikido organization (their leadership) can and should determine their own practices regarding all manner of things, including the use of hakama. In today's western world (IMHO), there is no valid reason for having different rules for men and women. As has been stated more than once on this thread, when in Rome do as the Romans. But organizations that have different gender rules should really reconsider the message they are conveying to their student / members.

I personally think using the hakama as a training tool early is a good practice. As some folks have posted, wearing a hakama does effect footwork. I also believe that it is important to differentiate Aikido by appearance and action. Aikido should ooze TRADITION. Something that needs to be passed on to this and subsequent generations. The hakama is a symbol of our budo roots. Symbols should have meaning towards a purpose, ours being to develop physical and spiritual enlightenment.

Last edited by TonyBlomert : 11-18-2014 at 08:55 PM. Reason: typo clean up

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Old 11-19-2014, 09:30 AM   #86
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Re: Wearing Hakama

Quote:
Tony Blomert wrote: View Post
Aikido should ooze TRADITION.
It's less than a hundred years old. How much ooze can there be?
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Old 11-19-2014, 10:24 AM   #87
Carsten Möllering
 
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Re: Wearing Hakama

Quote:
Mary Malmros wrote: View Post
It's less than a hundred years old. ...
That depends ...
Exploring and using aiki in budō is much older than Ueshiba or Takeda.
The etiquette we are used to in most aikidō dōjō is much older than Ueshiba or Takeda.
The use of hakama is much older than Ueshiba or Takeda.
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Old 11-19-2014, 10:44 AM   #88
ken king
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Re: Wearing Hakama

While I think hakama gives a cool whooshing noise and looks fancy, I see little practical value in wearing them and many disadvantages. Added cost for training uniform, wasted time putting them on and folding after class and potential for injury to name a few. The only advantage I see is some added comfort during suwari waza due to fabric sliding.
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Old 11-19-2014, 11:26 AM   #89
Keith Larman
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Re: Wearing Hakama

When the wife commented that I needed a haircut, I just told her that I'm letting it grow out so I can do a proper top knot. I'm going to out Japanese all those folk at the dojo! Ha! So there! Now where are my geta and baka gaijin t-shirt...

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Old 11-19-2014, 12:21 PM   #90
phitruong
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Re: Wearing Hakama

Quote:
Mary Malmros wrote: View Post
It's less than a hundred years old. How much ooze can there be?
the ooze is very secret. we have to send in a bunch of mutant ninja to find out http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0103060/

"budo is putting on cold, wet, sweat stained gi with a smile and a snarl" - your truly
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Old 11-19-2014, 12:22 PM   #91
phitruong
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Re: Wearing Hakama

Quote:
Keith Larman wrote: View Post
When the wife commented that I needed a haircut, I just told her that I'm letting it grow out so I can do a proper top knot. I'm going to out Japanese all those folk at the dojo! Ha! So there! Now where are my geta and baka gaijin t-shirt...
dude! don't forget the loin cloth (if you know how to work the thing, otherwise, i would suggest duct tape).

"budo is putting on cold, wet, sweat stained gi with a smile and a snarl" - your truly
http://charlotteaikikai.org
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Old 11-20-2014, 09:15 AM   #92
Keith Larman
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Re: Wearing Hakama

I just find it interesting that this discussion comes up so frequently. I remember a guy a while back who was thoroughly disgusted that we didn't do all the clapping stuff as part of our etiquette. Another guy who thought warming up was the duty of the students prior to class and didn't understand our Aiki Taiso practice. Another guy constantly corrected my Japanese pronunciation even though you could hear his New York accent in his.

Now I couldn't possibly care less about what other folk do in their own dojo. We have our own history and as a result we have our own traditions and attitudes about them. And even though I'd grant that some of what is in Aikido goes way back, much of it simply doesn't -- I mean, seriously, aikido isn't some obscure koryu but is a fractured mess of all sorts of paths even from the early days of Aikido.

So I'm cool with those who seem to think that only black hakama are proper and they must flow exactly so many mm's from the floor and that one must only pee angling to the left side of the toilet bowl. Fine. When in Rome. But I'll reserve my incredibly anal attachment to the tiniest of details to other parts of my life where there really is a definite and significant long term history of any substance.

Yeah, I know that last sentence will bug some. So please, by all means take it as seriously as you wish. I just find the tone of some that *everyone* must do this or that, wear this or that, bow this way or that, kind of silly. Hell, most wear judo keikogi which is not exactly traditional Japanese clothing. With riding pants over it? It's like we're reproducing the look brought on by trends of judo being popular combined difficult time in Japanese history with WWII raging...

Now if I was studying a koryu, well, there's a sort of historical preservation society aspect to it. I get that one. Aikido? Kind of a stretch IMHO.

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Old 11-20-2014, 10:32 AM   #93
kewms
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Re: Wearing Hakama

Bleh. Whatever local etiquette you might encounter, critiquing someone in his own dojo is just rude.

Katherine
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