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Old 12-17-2013, 05:10 PM   #26
Alfonso
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Re: Jukka O. Lampila - Empty Force

Quote:
Demetrio Cereijo wrote: View Post
I'd say EFO is a different expression of Ki.

From what I've gathered Jukka's EFO combines his experience in Aikido (Hikitsuchi, Blaize and maybe Shapiro) and Kyusho Aiki Jutsu (a system headed by anoter finnish: Toni Kauhanen).
ok I think its delusional in any case.

Alfonso Adriasola
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Old 12-17-2013, 09:40 PM   #27
Kevin Leavitt
 
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Re: Jukka O. Lampila - Empty Force

Delusional if the criteria is an expectation of self defense. Yes, I'd agree with that.

Delusional if it opens your heart and makes you a nicer person. Gets you to consider your relation to the world or others? It may not be delusional in that sense as a form of interpersonal meditation.

They are not clear about this really. I think we all can conclude that the guy running this seems to be shifting his assertions around about what EFO will do for you. I hate when that happens, but it does.

While this is an extreme case. I find the same thing in many martial practices. Mainly ones that profess to be something that will use the word "Internal" or "ki" in the title as something that is produced that is intangible. That "cloud" produces an opportunity that ask people to suspend belief, if even slightly about concreteness. It insinuates that some how there is a better way of doing things. It leverages our belief in the duality of things...that somehow there is a "bad" way of doing things and a "good" way of doing things. that "cloud" creates enough of a gray area, that normal, rational people, that would not normally be delusional in any other way, have "hope" that there is something greater than what they know. If they can simply suspend belief...that if they set aside what they intuitively know as true, ignore the naysayers, and any evidence that is contrary to what is being presented...that they can unlock the secrets and "transcend" the ordinary.

Martial arts is leveraged IMO because violence is horrible. It is the worst thing in a supposed sentient, intelligent being that should be able to transcend it. Therefore, we have hope. We have hope that there is something external to us and internal that we can tap into to transcend the ordinary. Martial Arts is RIPE for picking. We can create an such an environment that people will come and suspend critical thought and belief because they have hope for becoming extraordinary personally and as a social group.

I'm all about the transcendent end state. I think how you avoid delusion is keep true to the measures and being clear about achieving them. If you honestly believe it works, then you should not strictly control the "cooperation" framework to such a degree that it becomes delusional. You should open it up until the point that it achieves failure and be willing to state "THIS is the CLIFF". "this is the end of the road where this appears to be helpful. That is how IMO you avoid delusion.

Most people...even if the cliff is there will ignore it. They don't want to go to the edge and admit they won't take that next step. IMO it is because they have fear. Fear that if they recognize that the cliff is there...they can no longer have hope and it scares the hell out of them.

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Old 12-18-2013, 08:07 AM   #28
Budd
 
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Re: Jukka O. Lampila - Empty Force

I just roll my eyes whenever I see too much made of the "belief system" oriented stuff. Most anything in martial arts should have a degree of tangible outcomes that can be measured (similar to Kevin's value-based statement above). Each person training should be able to benchmark their progress against some level of objective standard (even if it's a microset, e.g. "To do whole body strength, you have to limit the firing of inappropriate local muscle usage", then train a specific movement over time and have the ability to objectively check whether or not everything is moving together versus still using, say, shoulders to raise the arms), whether it's body skills or ability to apply them on another person via a degree of settings (static, moving, resisting).

The trouble with even the above statement is that self-perpetuating groups will manipulate the above to make it seem like the "objective" criteria are being met --> which leads to the resultant that certain objective standards should be true regardless of whether someone believes the same thing or practices the same stuff that you do.
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Old 12-18-2013, 02:50 PM   #29
akiy
 
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Re: Jukka O. Lampila - Empty Force

Hi folks,

The subthread regarding "Measuring if/how martial arts helps one become a better person" has been broken off to a new thread: http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23224

-- Jun

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Old 12-18-2013, 02:52 PM   #30
chillzATL
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Re: Jukka O. Lampila - Empty Force

Quote:
Jun Akiyama wrote: View Post
Hi folks,

The subthread regarding "Measuring if/how martial arts helps one become a better person" has been broken off to a new thread: http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23224

-- Jun
probably still should have stayed in non-aikido as it's not aikido specific, but either or I guess.
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Old 12-19-2013, 12:15 PM   #31
Demetrio Cereijo
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Re: Jukka O. Lampila - Empty Force

This was posted today at EFO facebook page:
EFO_FAQs_v2

1.What does EFO mean?
EFO stands for Empty FOrce. It is a training method for human interaction employing body
and mind. The method differs from the other methods because two or more persons are
practising EFO together. EFO studies mind-body and mind-mind interaction.

2. Is EFO a combat art or self defence?
No, but it can be an additional tool for any self defence. Applying EFO's principles it may help to prevent a conflict or provocation from escalating to physical violence. EFO skills may also help in a situation where physical means cannot be used. In japanese terms, EFO is not 'bujutsu', but it correlates with the meaning of the word 'budo'. Rather than combat sport, EFO is a way for inner development and expansion of consciousness. EFO is a path inward to discover the power of the presence and state of being.

3. What are the EFO's principles?
When practising EFO, it is important to understand the concepts of Intention, Grounding, Heart and Knowledge.In brief, they could be translated as follows: Intention: The same as "KI" in japanese terms,
intention to do something, mental energy, willingness. For example aggression typically generates intention.Grounding: Relaxation of the whole body and mind acknowledging the gravity of hara, center
of the body. Heart: Japanese term Kokoro for heart, not only the organ but could be understood as "soul" or "spirit" etc.. Opening one's heart means a change in one's mind and body enabling acceptance and fearlessness.Knowledge: Ability to use intuition instead of thoughts, "the power of an empty mind". This becomes easier when the previously explained concepts are utilised. For example: "Flow" state in sports.

4. How is EFO practised?
Usually two or more people practise together. During the practise, another person's feedback helps another to understand the changes in one's state of mind and eventually the body.An example: Another trainer performs a formal attack with strong intention. The opponent studies how EFO principles can be applied to reduce the intention of the attacker. EFO promotes peace that neutralises all attacks through no reaction and no aggression, in order to avoid a situation where two forces collide and create tension between two counterparts. Practising is executed in a respectful and relaxed way and through joy. In EFO no physical power is used to dominate the other person. No pain to is caused to others during the practice.

5. Are there some physical techniques in EFO?
No. The physical appearance or form of the attack is not relevant. Training is mainly concentrating on observing the intention of the attacker, and on reducing the willingness to attack by using EFO's principles, of which one being acceptance.

6. Why is EFO practise conducted on Tatami?
Training EFO includes physical exercises and it is more convenient to have a soft floor to prevent injuries and bruises.

7. Is it neccessary to use an "EFO-suit"?
No, anyone training EFO can use their own suit from what ever martial arts or sports they practise, or any other convenient dress. It is also possible to get an EFO-ki if one does not have any other suitable training clothes. It is better if the texture is strong enough to hold a grip.

8. Is there competition or belt grades in EFO?
No.

9. Why does EFO "work" with someone but "does not work" with everyone?
When training EFO, two people are both training. For example a drill could be /ehdotus an attacker- a defender scenario. The attacker practises how to generate a genuine intention, which can be felt by the opponent applying EFO to alter the intention of the attacker. That is why EFO is also a mental practise for the attacker, to understand the meaning of intention. If one only performs a "fake" physical attack without a real intention, nothing should happen, because the aim of the practise is merely to reduce the intention of the attacker.

10. Why practise EFO?
Reasons to practise EFO may be manifold. For example:
- To improve the ability to relax in scary situations
- Nice hobby with people who are interested in similar things
- Soft training without pain
- To study and to develop mental skills.
For something that is not a self-defense, I can't help to wonder why they publish clips like this one under the title 'EFO in daily life'.

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