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Old 01-28-2013, 01:49 PM   #1
lars beyer
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Tao, english translation ?

Hi, I donŽt know where to post this question so I decided for this forum.
Can anyone recommend a good english translation of Tao ?
I have read 2 different translations in danish, and I would like an english one as well.
Any recommendations ?

best regards
Lars
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Old 01-28-2013, 03:28 PM   #2
Malicat
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Re: Tao, english translation ?

Quote:
Lars Beyer wrote: View Post
Hi, I donŽt know where to post this question so I decided for this forum.
Can anyone recommend a good english translation of Tao ?
I have read 2 different translations in danish, and I would like an english one as well.
Any recommendations ?

best regards
Lars
Lars,

The translation I have uses Stephen Mitchell translating. I got him specifically because I liked his translation of the Bhagavad Gita. I'm not sure if the Amazon link works for you, but hopefully this is useful.

http://www.amazon.com/Tao-Te-Ching-L...s=tao+te+ching

--Ashley
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Old 01-28-2013, 03:28 PM   #3
oisin bourke
 
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Re: Tao, english translation ?

I presume you mean the Tao Te Ching?

The translation by Red Pine (the nom de plume of Bill Porter) is excellent IMO. His translations of Chinese zen poetry are great too. A generally all round cool dude

http://www.amazon.com/Lao-tzus-Taote.../dp/1556592906
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Old 01-28-2013, 03:50 PM   #4
lars beyer
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Re: Tao, english translation ?

Quote:
Ashley Hemsath wrote: View Post
Lars,

The translation I have uses Stephen Mitchell translating. I got him specifically because I liked his translation of the Bhagavad Gita. I'm not sure if the Amazon link works for you, but hopefully this is useful.

http://www.amazon.com/Tao-Te-Ching-L...s=tao+te+ching

--Ashley
Hi Ashley,
Thanks for the link, IŽll look into that, seems like an interesting guy Stephen Mitchell
Best
Lars
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Old 01-28-2013, 03:55 PM   #5
lars beyer
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Re: Tao, english translation ?

Quote:
Oisin Bourke wrote: View Post
I presume you mean the Tao Te Ching?

The translation by Red Pine (the nom de plume of Bill Porter) is excellent IMO. His translations of Chinese zen poetry are great too. A generally all round cool dude

http://www.amazon.com/Lao-tzus-Taote.../dp/1556592906
Hi Oisin, yes I mean the Tao Te Ching.
Based on a short wiki-read, Red Pine sounds interresting as well.
Do you know if there excists a "Cannonised / Officially acknowledged version" in english / american as well or is this the one, Red Pine I mean ?
Lars
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Old 01-29-2013, 03:39 AM   #6
oisin bourke
 
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Re: Tao, english translation ?

Quote:
Lars Beyer wrote: View Post
Hi Oisin, yes I mean the Tao Te Ching.
Based on a short wiki-read, Red Pine sounds interresting as well.
Do you know if there excists a "Cannonised / Officially acknowledged version" in english / american as well or is this the one, Red Pine I mean ?
Lars
Sorry, I"m not sure what you mean. The Translation by Arthur Waley seems to be well respected though.

Some of the sommentaries are very interesting if applied to Aikdo and budo in general.

For example, T'e Ching's commentary on the first verse:

"Lao Tzu's philosphy is all here. The remaining five thousand characters merely expound on this theme."(p3)

This can be applied to traditional transmisson in Budo (and other arts) where the essence to the school is contained in the first one or two techniques.

Also, this commentary on the second verse;

Sung Chang H'sing:

"Those who practice the way put and end to distinctions, get rid of name and form, and make of themselves a home for the Way and Virtue."(p6)

Sounds like something Ueshiba Morihei would say!
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Old 01-29-2013, 10:54 AM   #7
Walker
 
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Re: Tao, english translation ?

The Tao that can be translated is not the true Tao.

-Doug Walker
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Old 01-29-2013, 11:42 AM   #8
phitruong
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Re: Tao, english translation ?

Quote:
Doug Walker wrote: View Post
The Tao that can be translated is not the true Tao.
damn it Doug! you beat me to the punch.

i wondered what Tao translated in Bushman of the Kalahari language be?

"budo is putting on cold, wet, sweat stained gi with a smile and a snarl" - your truly
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Old 01-29-2013, 12:14 PM   #9
Fred Little
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Re: Tao, english translation ?

Quote:
Doug Walker wrote: View Post
The Tao that can be translated is not the true Tao.
Indeed. Moreover, it has been known for over two decades that the oldest extant version of the manuscript is the Te Tao Ching, not the Tao Te Ching. Best translation, bar none?

http://www.amazon.com/Lao-Tzu-Transl.../dp/0345370996

The implications of the discovery that the oldest version is actually the Te Tao Ching are significant. What had long been regarded as "the first verse" is actually "the first verse of the second section," and what had been regarded as "the minor second section on governance following the major first section on matters philosophical" is actually "the executive summary of the applications relevant to ruling princes" while the "Tao" section is actually the "additional appendix of philosophical material unlikely to be ready by a busy executive."

Mitchell's various translations are lovely poetry in their way, but inasmuch as he speaks none of the languages from which he is translating, they do have significant limitations.

Hope this helps.

FL

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Old 01-29-2013, 02:00 PM   #10
lars beyer
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Re: Tao, english translation ?

Quote:
Fred Little wrote: View Post
Indeed. Moreover, it has been known for over two decades that the oldest extant version of the manuscript is the Te Tao Ching, not the Tao Te Ching. Best translation, bar none?

http://www.amazon.com/Lao-Tzu-Transl.../dp/0345370996

The implications of the discovery that the oldest version is actually the Te Tao Ching are significant. What had long been regarded as "the first verse" is actually "the first verse of the second section," and what had been regarded as "the minor second section on governance following the major first section on matters philosophical" is actually "the executive summary of the applications relevant to ruling princes" while the "Tao" section is actually the "additional appendix of philosophical material unlikely to be ready by a busy executive."

Mitchell's various translations are lovely poetry in their way, but inasmuch as he speaks none of the languages from which he is translating, they do have significant limitations.

Hope this helps.

FL
Interresting, maybe IŽll just buy all the translations and see which one suits my taste the best...
Afterall.. the Tao that can be named is not the real Tao.. :-)
Lars
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Old 01-29-2013, 02:47 PM   #11
Fred Little
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Re: Tao, english translation ?

Quote:
Lars Beyer wrote: View Post
Interresting, maybe IŽll just buy all the translations and see which one suits my taste the best...
Afterall.. the Tao that can be named is not the real Tao.. :-)
Lars
You are, of course, free to do just that, and a broad survey is often better than a singularly bad selection. Please be sure that you don't choose your map based on which one has the prettiest colors!

FL

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Old 01-29-2013, 03:05 PM   #12
lars beyer
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Re: Tao, english translation ?

Quote:
Fred Little wrote: View Post
You are, of course, free to do just that, and a broad survey is often better than a singularly bad selection. Please be sure that you don't choose your map based on which one has the prettiest colors!

FL
I ALLWAYS preferred black.
;-)
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Old 01-30-2013, 07:44 AM   #13
edutton
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Re: Tao, english translation ?

I am certainly not a scholar of the Tao or the Chinese language, but if it's at all helpful here's a link to a short comparison I did a couple of years ago, of several English translations...

Peace,
Erik
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Old 01-31-2013, 11:05 PM   #14
lars beyer
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Re: Tao, english translation ?

Quote:
Erik Dutton wrote: View Post
I am certainly not a scholar of the Tao or the Chinese language, but if it's at all helpful here's a link to a short comparison I did a couple of years ago, of several English translations...

Peace,
Erik
Thanks a lot Erik, very interresting and very telling indeed. The online translator comparison app is
good fun. I guess I can sprend some time with that ! :-)
Thanks again
Best
Lars
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Old 02-12-2013, 01:13 PM   #15
Patrick Hutchinson
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Re: Tao, english translation ?

I always liked this, from Witter Bynner's translation:

The invincible shield
Of caring
Is a weapon from the sky
Against being dead.
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Old 02-27-2013, 09:48 AM   #16
dreamborn
 
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Re: Tao, english translation ?

Quote:
Oisin Bourke wrote: View Post
I presume you mean the Tao Te Ching?

http://www.amazon.com/Lao-tzus-Taote.../dp/1556592906
Oh! That's too bad I was going to recommend
"The Tao of Meow" by Waldo Japussy is a collection of 81 reflections on life and the way to total self-gratification as only a cat can tell it. :^)

http://www.amazon.com/The-Tao-Meow-W.../dp/0898048001

風柳 剣人
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Old 05-12-2013, 05:23 PM   #17
JLRonin
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Re: Tao, english translation ?

Tao of jeet-cun-do?
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Old 05-13-2013, 03:22 PM   #18
Andrew S
 
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Re: Tao, english translation ?

This site
http://wengu.tartarie.com/wg/wengu.php?l=intro
has the Waley and Lau English translations, plus French by Julien and German by Wilhem. It also gives a Chinese rendering of the text.

A useful point to start without having to invest any money!

Warning: Do not bend, fold or otherwise abuse... until we get to the dojo..


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