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Old 09-26-2012, 05:01 PM   #76
ChrisHein
 
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Quote:
Dan Harden wrote: View Post
Hi Chris
Meeting me is not the point.
I....am not any of my points.
With your history here and on Shen Wu, I would rather you went to see Sam Chin or Ark or some of the ICMA who are vetted as having power. The work is the point, not any individual.
BTW, I really appreciated the friendly exchange.
Dan
You've got to look at this from my perspective. I am pretty sure that I know what you're talking about. I don't think there is anything wrong with it. If what you are describing is on the video you posted I would describe that as chinese internal. I'm sure that Ueshiba was interested in and trained in this type of movement (this is one of the reasons I trained in it). But I believe it is only a part of what he was doing. He was also interested in training in koryu weapons and jujutsu. He was also interested in spiritual study/action. All of these things made up his art, Aikido. I don't believe he was only talking about the IP aspects of his training when he spoke of Aikido-or Aiki for that matter..

I understand that your main interest is internal, but that's not the whole of Aikido. My offer to peacefully meet with you next time you're in California still stands. Barring you meeting with me I'd rather not hear any more about my lack of understanding of IP. As you yourself often say, you don't know until you've felt them.

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Old 09-26-2012, 05:15 PM   #77
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Quote:
Chris Hein wrote: View Post
You've got to look at this from my perspective. I am pretty sure that I know what you're talking about. I don't think there is anything wrong with it. If what you are describing is on the video you posted I would describe that as chinese internal. I'm sure that Ueshiba was interested in and trained in this type of movement (this is one of the reasons I trained in it). But I believe it is only a part of what he was doing. He was also interested in training in koryu weapons and jujutsu. He was also interested in spiritual study/action. All of these things made up his art, Aikido. I don't believe he was only talking about the IP aspects of his training when he spoke of Aikido-or Aiki for that matter..

I understand that your main interest is internal, but that's not the whole of Aikido. My offer to peacefully meet with you next time you're in California still stands. Barring you meeting with me I'd rather not hear any more about my lack of understanding of IP. As you yourself often say, you don't know until you've felt them.
This comes around every once in a while, but Dan has never, to my knowledge, said anything about IP being limited to the technical, or that there was no crossover into the spiritual side. In fact, if you speak to him personally you may find that it is exactly the opposite.

I would say that the challenge is really to get to the universe without floating off into outer space - the technical method provides the base and the engine for the spiritual side, and without it mostly what you have is a figment of your imagination. Ueshiba actually talks about this in places in Take Musu Aiki.

Hiroshi Tada mentions this too, at various places in the translated interview that I've been putting up.

Here, for example:

Quote:
However, this is not something that can just be known vaguely, you must also be fully conversant with the concrete training methods relating to this method of thinking about the mind, the body, and technique.
And here, as well:

Quote:
What cannot be understood concretely, through a concrete method, cannot be trained.
There were a couple of other places as well, if you read the whole series.

Best,

Chris

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Old 09-26-2012, 05:35 PM   #78
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Chris, while I respect your efforts, one can read things in many ways. When I read your translations they speak to what I'm talking about as well.

Both of the quotes you just used seem to me to prove my point as well.

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Old 09-26-2012, 05:40 PM   #79
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Quote:
Chris Hein wrote: View Post
Chris, while I respect your efforts, one can read things in many ways. When I read your translations they speak to what I'm talking about as well.

Both of the quotes you just used seem to me to prove my point as well.
I'm getting confused - what do you think Tada is saying?

Anyway, Dan has never, to my knowledge said that there is no crossover, or that it is unimportant.

Best,

Chris

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Old 09-26-2012, 06:03 PM   #80
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Quote:
However, this is not something that can just be known vaguely, you must also be fully conversant with the concrete training methods relating to this method of thinking about the mind, the body, and technique.
What is he describing? Imagine it's what you guys call Aiki. Imagine it's what I call Aiki. Imagine he's describing NASCAR driving.

He could be talking about anything that involves mind body and technique. I don't think he's talking about NASCAR, but depending on who's reading it- that little clip you put up- it could be anything.

Quote:
"What cannot be understood concretely, through a concrete method, cannot be trained."
Also sounds like good advice. But what's he talking about, maybe learning fly fishing, or Japanese carpentry. I'm not trying to be a smart alec, but really, out of context, you can read anything anyway.

I know you are a scholar, and I believe you can add much to this debate, but you have to understand the limitations of what written word is. Even if we all spoke the same language, things can be read many different ways. People miss understand me all the time, and we speak the same language, live in the same country, at the same time, are of the same culture, and they know me on a personal level. Language is so complex, it's never black and white.

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Old 09-26-2012, 06:53 PM   #81
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Quote:
Chris Hein wrote: View Post
What is he describing? Imagine it's what you guys call Aiki. Imagine it's what I call Aiki. Imagine he's describing NASCAR driving.

He could be talking about anything that involves mind body and technique. I don't think he's talking about NASCAR, but depending on who's reading it- that little clip you put up- it could be anything.

Also sounds like good advice. But what's he talking about, maybe learning fly fishing, or Japanese carpentry. I'm not trying to be a smart alec, but really, out of context, you can read anything anyway.

I know you are a scholar, and I believe you can add much to this debate, but you have to understand the limitations of what written word is. Even if we all spoke the same language, things can be read many different ways. People miss understand me all the time, and we speak the same language, live in the same country, at the same time, are of the same culture, and they know me on a personal level. Language is so complex, it's never black and white.
Of course, you can read the context, which is provided - I was just pointing out what I was talking about.

In any case, I think that you're missing my point. My point was that Tada is pointing out the necessity of progressing through a concrete, clearly defined method.

That doesn't mean that Tada is limiting what he's doing purely to the technical side.

Dan, IMO, is doing something quite similar, stressing the need for a concrete method. That doesn't mean that he's saying there's no crossover to the spiritual side or that he thinks that is unimportant.

But without the base there's nothing to build on.

Best,

Chris

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Old 09-26-2012, 07:30 PM   #82
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

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Stan Baker wrote: View Post
Hi Graham
It might look the same but it is not
you need to experience this level sometmes
more then once to understand.

stan
Hi Stan. It was an example given and in principle it is similar. I understand what it is not and therefor no need to feel it. However, many do need to as you say if that is their want so no argument there. Enjoy.

Peace.G.
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Old 09-26-2012, 08:00 PM   #83
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Quote:
Charles David Henderson wrote: View Post
I have a few questions I'd like to put out there, and I'm sincerely interested in hearing anyone's answers as the questions arise whenever this discussion about "what is aiki" comes around.

Here is my premise: One of the things about O Sensei that his students seemed to find remarkable was his ability to "disappear" from where they thought he was and "reappear" suddenly, often right beside them, as when surrounded by a group of armed or unarmed attackers.

1. Are these accounts creditable? They seem to me to be, as reflected in films I've seen.

2. Is it appropriate to consider this an aspect of "aiki" in your view?
A. If not, is it fair to talk about it as a "higher level" skill at least as he manifested it?
And
B. If the answer to that second question is "yes," then how did he train it and why did he seem to regard it as a significant element of his budo?
3. Is this kind of ability connected, in your view, to internal training -- that is, is this something that internal training either helps to impart or otherwise enhances?

Disclaimer: I'm quite interested in the whole IP/IS paradigm, although I'm still working at what has been referred to as "baseline skills." I'm not trying to score points or get into a debate with people who are more skilled or knowledgeable. Still, I keep wondering whether this aspect of training explains everything that I, with my limited experience, find remarkable about Ueshiba's budo.
Yes those accounts are quite credible as far as I am concerned.

Yes it is an aspect of aikido.

He trained with the spiritual elements and applied them in action to do so. He had it as significant because it demonstrated many things and statements he made on the subject of his Aikido. ie: "When a person attacks they have already lost, when another attacks I am already standing behind them, the spirit of loving protection, they come I meet, I turn, they follow........etc.etc.etc.

In my view internal gives a totally different thing. It will lead to 'ip' or 'is' but is not Aikido as he described and did.

For some it may 'open the door' but personally I feel it only leads in the wrong direction.

Such is my view, sincerely. Small steps long journey.

Peace.G.
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Old 09-26-2012, 08:10 PM   #84
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

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Chris Hein wrote: View Post
You've got to look at this from my perspective. I am pretty sure that I know what you're talking about. I don't think there is anything wrong with it. If what you are describing is on the video you posted I would describe that as chinese internal. I'm sure that Ueshiba was interested in and trained in this type of movement (this is one of the reasons I trained in it). But I believe it is only a part of what he was doing. He was also interested in training in koryu weapons and jujutsu. He was also interested in spiritual study/action. All of these things made up his art, Aikido. I don't believe he was only talking about the IP aspects of his training when he spoke of Aikido-or Aiki for that matter..

I understand that your main interest is internal, but that's not the whole of Aikido. My offer to peacefully meet with you next time you're in California still stands. Barring you meeting with me I'd rather not hear any more about my lack of understanding of IP. As you yourself often say, you don't know until you've felt them.
I have looked at it from your perspective, Chris. For decades.
Your responses to Chris and me and others over the years don't really discuss internal strength, they discuss external principles. Which is why the OP vid was discussed soley as external principles. It's all anyone really knows and can discuss... and then it was "stamped" as IS.
You keep bringing up...you... in the conversations and saying you get it and can do it. So...I, like everyone else...watched your videos.
Secondly we have entered into so many discussions about it that your descriptions have been laid out. They are unrecognizable to me as anything internal, instead they are Chinese internal art principles. Which have nothing at all to do with internal strength. In and of themselves they make some damn good jujutsu. But they are taught to westerners in Taiwan specifically to teach them decent martial arts, but also to prevent them from getting the goods.

You can read story after story about some of the "famous" CMA guys in Taiwan who don't have it, but who can fight really well. Its common knowledge among certain people. As one masterclass guy was fond of saying about a well known ICMA fighter who was all external. "He impresses all the foreigners, which is good, it keeps them from coming here and bugging me."

There are certain aspects of internal movement that are obvious and transparent. When someone doesn't have connection...BANG..it's in your face. It is inescapable.
So for many who have actually felt those with internal power not internal martial arts waza and principles...The one overriding argument is that when someone is connected..anyone....there are certain tells. They move with a certain basic tenent of connection that is unaviodably obvious or absent.

People who are connected respond to load a certain way. It drives people absolutely nuts when I say it....but I have never been wrong about it. And once I felt the guy or others have..it was settled. This is as true of Menkyo's as it is in BJJ all stars. Center and connection cannot be hidden nor can it be pretended. People can be great at their art, or great fighters. None of which is a qualifier for IS or aiki.
It's just...the way it is.
As LCD says "You cannot pretend dantian, you will be found out."

When you suffer from lack of connection certain things happen when you:
Encounter load
Gradually fail against load and move
Move someone else
Move someone you really cannot move and certain things happen to you (see the above)
And those are just basic at the start tells.
You see it.
Then the more advanced stuff comes into play....

This isn't difficult to understand from a martial arts perspective.
If someone claims to be a shihan in this or that art...all you have to do is watch him move right? You know if he is moving in accord with expected attributes of a given art. At a point things he either fits his skill level or doesn't. Guys watch vids and comment on stuff like that....all the time. Its the same with someone claiming to have internal strength or aiki.

Quote:
Barring you meeting with me I'd rather not hear any more about my lack of understanding of IP. As you yourself often say, you don't know until you've felt them.
I didn't say you had to feel them. Someone else said that. I do agree that certain things do have to be felt, but not all. And the most basic are obvious.
Dan

Last edited by DH : 09-26-2012 at 08:22 PM.
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Old 09-26-2012, 09:21 PM   #85
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

One last more simple way to look at it from my view, Chris
If someone is wobbling under load while they do waza...what does that tell you?
That they're connected?
Or disconnected?
Now
What if they are one side weighted?
Then
Why do so many budo people wobble and purposefully place themselves in a one side weighted type of movement?
Once you know and can prevent these things from happening what are you supposed to think when you see Shihan doing it.
Then
Shihan love what you show them and want to train it TO FIX THEIR OWN MOVEMENT?
And again, these are just baby steps in building a bujutsu body. The fun stuff happens later.
Dan

Last edited by DH : 09-26-2012 at 09:23 PM.
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Old 09-26-2012, 10:33 PM   #86
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

When I was a kid, I used to have this neighbor kid I would play with. Every time we would play something, like say cowboys, when I shot him, he would tell me I missed. Then I would get closer and shoot him again, and he would tell me that he had an invisible force field. This would go on and on. He always won the games we played.

I don't know why I thought of him just now...

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Old 09-26-2012, 10:45 PM   #87
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Well, that was an unfortunate commentary. Remember though-in public now over a thousand people, many of whom (from shodan to shihan, from MMA to ICMA) were coming to discredit me. I don't have the force field, Chris and I am open book trying to help.
Okay then
Dan

Last edited by DH : 09-26-2012 at 10:49 PM.
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Old 09-27-2012, 08:37 AM   #88
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Quote:
Chris Hein wrote: View Post
When I was a kid, I used to have this neighbor kid I would play with. Every time we would play something, like say cowboys, when I shot him, he would tell me I missed. Then I would get closer and shoot him again, and he would tell me that he had an invisible force field. This would go on and on. He always won the games we played.

I don't know why I thought of him just now...
No offense dude, but you need to get yourself and get over your obsession with Dan. Dan has repeated so many times that it is not about him.

To stay on topic, Liu Cheng De is awesome.

Unless stated otherwise, all wisdom, follies, harshness, malice that may spring up from my writing are attributable only to me.
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Old 09-27-2012, 09:14 AM   #89
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Question: Is heaven/earth/man a commonly enough and openly enough discussed concept in CIMA that anyone doing an CIMA should be familiar with it on a physical level?
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Old 09-27-2012, 09:19 AM   #90
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Quote:
Dan Harden wrote: View Post
Secondly we have entered into so many discussions about it that your descriptions have been laid out. They are unrecognizable to me as anything internal, instead they are Chinese internal art principles. Which have nothing at all to do with internal strength. In and of themselves they make some damn good jujutsu.

Dan
Can someone explain me why Chinese internal art principles have nothing to do with internal strenght. As I understand IS is based upon "principles" (=some knowledge) and "correct" training.
Or is did mere a typo mistake?

Just curious,
Eddy
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Old 09-27-2012, 09:59 AM   #91
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Hi Eddy
I am glad someone else notice that
Stan
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Old 09-27-2012, 12:04 PM   #92
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Quote:
Jason Casteel wrote: View Post
Question: Is heaven/earth/man a commonly enough and openly enough discussed concept in CIMA that anyone doing an CIMA should be familiar with it on a physical level?
Well, that gets tricky - they may be familiar with their definition of what that principle means, which in reality then does not translate into any demonstrable physical skill. It's like the buzzwords in aikido - someone can say I use "ki" or "kokyu" in a technique, but then it's all externally powered movement with a big exhale at the end.

Strictly speaking, the heaven/earth/man notion of internal strength principles is kind of a classically written in stone thing that many martial artists (including Ueshiba) referenced to show 1) They were in the club with the buzzwords 2) Their skill and practice were in accordance with the buzzwords. (I'm being facetious about the buzzwords, go ahead and insert your own terms - universal principles, laws of reality, physics, yadda yadda). Of course your ability to discern to what level someone's words and skills were in accordance with the buzzwords also depended on your own understanding and achievement in what the buzzwords were describing.

Simple, really.

Last edited by Budd : 09-27-2012 at 12:05 PM. Reason: was/were confusion/anal retentiveness
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Old 09-27-2012, 06:35 PM   #93
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Quote:
Chris Hein wrote: View Post
When I was a kid, I used to have this neighbor kid I would play with. Every time we would play something, like say cowboys, when I shot him, he would tell me I missed. Then I would get closer and shoot him again, and he would tell me that he had an invisible force field. This would go on and on. He always won the games we played.

I don't know why I thought of him just now...
Well that certainly explains a lot - maybe if you took a lesson out of Kirk's performance in the Kobayashi Maru simulation you may have learned to think out of the box to overcome the no win scenario; as well open the door for some insight into other things that may not agree with your initial view and understanding as you progress through life.

Greg
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Old 09-28-2012, 05:33 PM   #94
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Well, I'm pretty happy I had this conversation. I think, at least for myself, I hashed out some issues I was having.

Frankly I don't know why I cared what you guys call what you are doing, or what you call what I am doing. For some reason I had a major hang up on that. I hope I've gotten over it, as I've done some serious thinking about it the last few days.

You have your practice, and I mine. Your reasons for training are yours and mine are mine. Seems simple, but I wasn't seeing it clearly. Anyways, thanks for the chat, it was appreciated!

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Old 09-29-2012, 08:57 AM   #95
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

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David Orange wrote: View Post
A big shift began for me when I studied Feldenkrais and he (his Method and writings) directed my attention toward smaller and smaller movements until I noticed a place between thought and movement where everything begins.
Just to clarify again, I'm not saying Feldenkrais teaches IP/IS.

To me, Feldenkrais is like WD40 for the mind/body connection.

It allows you to become more and more subtly aware of the mind's access to the body.

If you're a dancer, it will make you better.

If you're an actor, an athlete, a musician, or just an ordinary person, Feldenkrais helps you become more aware and thus, more able to enact your intentions within your body.

It does not, in itself, teach IP/IS, but it makes me more able to feel and understand the things said on these boards.

David

"That which has no substance can enter where there is no room."
Lao Tzu

"Eternity forever!"

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Old 09-29-2012, 09:17 AM   #96
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Quote:
David Orange wrote: View Post
Just to clarify again, I'm not saying Feldenkrais teaches IP/IS.

To me, Feldenkrais is like WD40 for the mind/body connection.

It allows you to become more and more subtly aware of the mind's access to the body.

If you're a dancer, it will make you better.

If you're an actor, an athlete, a musician, or just an ordinary person, Feldenkrais helps you become more aware and thus, more able to enact your intentions within your body.

It does not, in itself, teach IP/IS, but it makes me more able to feel and understand the things said on these boards.

David
True - to train the internal, you must first get your mind in the internal so it can lead the body; as in heart, mind, intent, ki, body....

Greg
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Old 09-29-2012, 12:47 PM   #97
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Quote:
Greg Steckel wrote: View Post
True - to train the internal, you must first get your mind in the internal so it can lead the body; as in heart, mind, intent, ki, body....
You still have to do the "concrete methods" to develop the skills and power, but even there, Feldenkrais can help in recognizing small differences. The smaller the difference you can recognize, the finer the effect you can produce. But you still have to do the "concrete methods."

David

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Lao Tzu

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Old 10-02-2012, 11:40 AM   #98
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Quote:
Eddy Wolput wrote: View Post
Can someone explain me why Chinese internal art principles have nothing to do with internal strenght. As I understand IS is based upon "principles" (=some knowledge) and "correct" training.
Or is did mere a typo mistake?

Just curious,
Eddy
Hello Eddy
No, not a typo.
Taken in steps - martial arts are typically taught as:
1. Lower level: taught as techniques
2. Mid level: discussed as principles of movement " behind" those techniques.
3. High level: Internal movement as a precursor to all movement

In reverse (and correct) order to learn high level budo-you start over and learn:
1. Motion, in stillness: control and management of forces within yourself to create a balance of ki within yourself ai-ki
then
2. Stillness in motion: how you carry that awareness and management into controlling forces that alight on you- from the outside and manage them in accord with your own control of forces within you, thus neutralizing and managing them again.
3. This, builds with a totally different means to manage your body with a new set of
"principles of movement" to further neutralize force enacted upon you yet again..aiki. But now in a different way that normal movement can only hope to mimic. this is the essense of real aiki that captured the attention of seasoned warriors. The aiki that controlled and impressed so many.

It is, simply put...a different way to move.

The "principles of movement" behind the waza we usually see are all based on external movement that every Tom, Dick and Harry does. This is beneficial for superior teachers, as it teaches virtually all of the participants in budo to move in a fashion that is easier to take apart. One small example is teaching people to move "one side weighted." This is the way humans move, budo can strengthen and deepen that movement in you in its teaching...thus you are primed...to be thrown or to have to fight back with muscle. Which is very good for the teachers isn't it? Teaching you to move from center and to have aiki in you...is to teach you to be extremely difficult to deal with-for that same teacher teaching you. Interestingly a significant source for this high level work in the Japanese arts said publicly "Only teach one or two people per generation."

Why principles don't work all the time and people cannot duplicate perceived movement:
You can see martial artists all over trying to duplicate the movement of more connected teachers they see-yet they cannot achieve the same results. The reason is that almost nobody in budo moves from or is connected to their center well. It only takes a few seconds to demonstrate that to them in person. Beyond all their hopes and statements to the contrary-they really don't know how to do something as simple as -move from their center. When you lack that connection, higher level principles (based on connected movement) fail to function. The foundational requirement is missing.

Beyond all of this, there is a totally new playground of moving and connecting with people; with different modes of moving and absorbing and redirecting forces previously not attainable by people who lacked centered movement. And this has it's own levels of movement. We can add significantly to that by an awakened dantian...moving.

These things continue to be debated on the internet...and then clearly demonstrated in person and all debate....ends.
In order to truly understand, you have to walk away from waza and many of the principles of movement we have all been taught- based on lower level external movement, and begin again...creating a bujutsu body.
Dan
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Old 10-02-2012, 12:08 PM   #99
Eric Joyce
Dojo: Budoshingikan
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 179
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Quote:
Dan Harden wrote: View Post
Hello Eddy
No, not a typo.
Taken in steps - martial arts are typically taught as:
1. Lower level: taught as techniques
2. Mid level: discussed as principles of movement " behind" those techniques.
3. High level: Internal movement as a precursor to all movement

In reverse (and correct) order to learn high level budo-you start over and learn:
1. Motion, in stillness: control and management of forces within yourself to create a balance of ki within yourself ai-ki
then
2. Stillness in motion: how you carry that awareness and management into controlling forces that alight on you- from the outside and manage them in accord with your own control of forces within you, thus neutralizing and managing them again.
3. This, builds with a totally different means to manage your body with a new set of
"principles of movement" to further neutralize force enacted upon you yet again..aiki. But now in a different way that normal movement can only hope to mimic. this is the essense of real aiki that captured the attention of seasoned warriors. The aiki that controlled and impressed so many.

It is, simply put...a different way to move.

The "principles of movement" behind the waza we usually see are all based on external movement that every Tom, Dick and Harry does. This is beneficial for superior teachers, as it teaches virtually all of the participants in budo to move in a fashion that is easier to take apart. One small example is teaching people to move "one side weighted." This is the way humans move, budo can strengthen and deepen that movement in you in its teaching...thus you are primed...to be thrown or to have to fight back with muscle. Which is very good for the teachers isn't it? Teaching you to move from center and to have aiki in you...is to teach you to be extremely difficult to deal with-for that same teacher teaching you. Interestingly a significant source for this high level work in the Japanese arts said publicly "Only teach one or two people per generation."

Why principles don't work all the time and people cannot duplicate perceived movement:
You can see martial artists all over trying to duplicate the movement of more connected teachers they see-yet they cannot achieve the same results. The reason is that almost nobody in budo moves from or is connected to their center well. It only takes a few seconds to demonstrate that to them in person. Beyond all their hopes and statements to the contrary-they really don't know how to do something as simple as -move from their center. When you lack that connection, higher level principles (based on connected movement) fail to function. The foundational requirement is missing.

Beyond all of this, there is a totally new playground of moving and connecting with people; with different modes of moving and absorbing and redirecting forces previously not attainable by people who lacked centered movement. And this has it's own levels of movement. We can add significantly to that by an awakened dantian...moving.

These things continue to be debated on the internet...and then clearly demonstrated in person and all debate....ends.
In order to truly understand, you have to walk away from waza and many of the principles of movement we have all been taught- based on lower level external movement, and begin again...creating a bujutsu body.
Dan
Nice post Dan. Very well said.

Eric Joyce
Otake Han Doshin Ryu Jujutsu
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Old 10-02-2012, 12:26 PM   #100
Marc Abrams
Dojo: Aikido Arts of Shin Budo Kai/ Bedford Hills, New York
Location: New York
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 1,302
United_States
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Re: Sumo: light vs heavy and IS?

Quote:
Dan Harden wrote: View Post
In order to truly understand, you have to walk away from waza and many of the principles of movement we have all been taught- based on lower level external movement, and begin again...creating a bujutsu body.
Dan
Dan:

I would strongly suggest that people spend A LOT of time learning how to create the bujutsu body. I would also suggest that as this is occurring, re-examine waza and experiment with allowing waza to be expressed through that body. I am experimenting with this approach and would encourage others to do so as well.

Cordially,

Marc Abrams
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