Welcome to AikiWeb Aikido Information
AikiWeb: The Source for Aikido Information
AikiWeb's principal purpose is to serve the Internet community as a repository and dissemination point for aikido information.

Sections
home
aikido articles
columns

Discussions
forums
aikiblogs

Databases
dojo search
seminars
image gallery
supplies
links directory

Reviews
book reviews
video reviews
dvd reviews
equip. reviews

News
submit
archive

Miscellaneous
newsletter
rss feeds
polls
about

Follow us on



Home > AikiWeb Aikido Forums
Go Back   AikiWeb Aikido Forums > Techniques

Hello and thank you for visiting AikiWeb, the world's most active online Aikido community! This site is home to over 22,000 aikido practitioners from around the world and covers a wide range of aikido topics including techniques, philosophy, history, humor, beginner issues, the marketplace, and more.

If you wish to join in the discussions or use the other advanced features available, you will need to register first. Registration is absolutely free and takes only a few minutes to complete so sign up today!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 02-02-2012, 07:54 PM   #1
bob_stra
Location: Australia
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 641
Australia
Offline
Is this Koshi-nage?

I posted this in a previous thread but the discussion moved on before I had a chance to ask - would this Judo throw qualify as an example of koshi-nage?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSvoUBeoAaI#t=6m25s

(jump to 6:25 if that doesn't autolink)

Just a mild curiosity of mine ; the throw is actually not that common in judo (AFAIK, it doesn't even have a official name), but if it is koshi-nage per aikido, then all of my Aikido buddies have been joshing me for years.

EDIT: Pooh; the link seems to have been taken down - try here. Same time index

http://mmaweekly.com/ronda-rouseys-a...ck-of-the-show
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 12:23 AM   #2
robin_jet_alt
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 523
Australia
Offline
Re: Is this Koshi-nage?

Well it's definitely a koshi-nage, and I wouldn't be at all surprised to see that or something very similar in an aikido dojo. I don't think I have seen that particular variation before, but it's certainly within the envelope, so to speak. I like it!
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 01:45 AM   #3
bob_stra
Location: Australia
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 641
Australia
Offline
Re: Is this Koshi-nage?

Great; I wanted to clarify the envelop a little better for myself, as I wasn't quite sure what koshi-nage encompassed
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 02:28 AM   #4
Tyson Walters
 
Tyson Walters's Avatar
Location: Auckland
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 22
New Zealand
Offline
Re: Is this Koshi-nage?

That looked like it could have easily gone the wrong way for the host... in that he could have landed on his head!
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 03:05 AM   #5
niall
  AikiWeb Forums Contributing Member
 
niall's Avatar
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 394
Japan
Offline
Re: Is this Koshi-nage?

That looks like a sleeveless version of a judo hip throw called sode tsurikomi goshi usually done with a sleeve grip (sode is sleeve).

The animation is from the list of techniques on judoinfo.com

It is very common in competition judo. This is a compilation of former World and Olympic champion Toshihiko Koga. There are about 5 dynamic sode tsurikomi goshi throws in a row from 2.45. He used to do the throw as a complement to seoi nage so his execution for both is similar.

It is a common aikido koshi nage too although it might not look exactly like that.

we can make our minds so like still water, and so live for a moment with a clearer, perhaps even with a fiercer life
w b yeats


aikiweb blog|wordpress blog
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 04:45 AM   #6
grondahl
Dojo: Stockholms Aikidoklubb
Location: Stockholm
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 550
Sweden
Offline
Re: Is this Koshi-nage?

If I did that in class, I would get scolded. So where I come from it would be "a kind of koshinage" but not a proper koshinage.

Last edited by grondahl : 02-03-2012 at 05:00 AM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 07:06 AM   #7
tlk52
Dojo: Aikido of Park Slope/NY Aikikai
Location: NYC
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 83
United_States
Offline
Re: Is this Koshi-nage?

. the hip goes in like an ikkyo koshi but with a different grip... kind of like this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=amZH5gQuMHA

oyo waza not kihon waza
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 08:15 AM   #8
bob_stra
Location: Australia
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 641
Australia
Offline
Re: Is this Koshi-nage?

Quote:
Niall Matthews wrote: View Post
That looks like a sleeveless version of a judo hip throw called sode tsurikomi goshi usually done with a sleeve grip (sode is sleeve)
Hmmm...classically though, STG has both uke and tori with feet parellel to each other upon kake, whereas the throw I cited has tori perpendicular to uke; that's one ready difference

I'd be suprised if people had seen koshi nage (per Ronda Rousey clip) in judo circles that frequently; I've seen it perhaps half a dozen times in the last 13 years.

What I have more frequently is something like this -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbBx1PHi8K8

which is a technically a seoinage

In any case - I'm glad to know the 'oh god, oh god' technique has an *actual* name, so I can better track down variations etc. I think it's a nifty throw.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 08:42 AM   #9
chillzATL
Location: ATL
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 846
United_States
Offline
Re: Is this Koshi-nage?

we practice something similar as a koshinage out of a sankyo.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 10:40 AM   #10
bob_stra
Location: Australia
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 641
Australia
Offline
Re: Is this Koshi-nage?

Quote:
Jason Casteel wrote: View Post
we practice something similar as a koshinage out of a sankyo.
I'm always surprised that there aren't more aikidoka broken into itty bitty little pieces, like so many spent match-sticks.

You do those kinds of crazy things fluently...then develop phobias over breakfalls. It boggles my poor widdle mind
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 11:20 AM   #11
Rob Watson
Location: CA
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 698
United_States
Offline
Re: Is this Koshi-nage?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=V1ZsFnma8AA

Not basic form but looks like what Ms. Ronda did but more 'aikido' like. Bent over at the waist gets 'stink eye' but not so bad when Ms. Ronda does it ....

"In my opinion, the time of spreading aikido to the world is finished; now we have to focus on quality." Yamada Yoshimitsu

Ultracrepidarianism ... don't.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 12:16 PM   #12
chillzATL
Location: ATL
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 846
United_States
Offline
Re: Is this Koshi-nage?

Quote:
Bob Strahinjevich wrote: View Post
I'm always surprised that there aren't more aikidoka broken into itty bitty little pieces, like so many spent match-sticks.

You do those kinds of crazy things fluently...then develop phobias over breakfalls. It boggles my poor widdle mind
lol, no phobias here Bob, but I know what you mean. Without a confident nage, ukemi from that throw can be a little... blah. If they're tenative and don't get you stretched out good before things get a little sloppy and you end up falling off of them more than being thrown, but that's a problem you see in lots of places in aikido.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 06:58 PM   #13
Rob Watson
Location: CA
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 698
United_States
Offline
Re: Is this Koshi-nage?

Quote:
Jason Casteel wrote: View Post
we practice something similar as a koshinage out of a sankyo.
Like this perhaps? ~0:48 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRdiM...eature=related

"In my opinion, the time of spreading aikido to the world is finished; now we have to focus on quality." Yamada Yoshimitsu

Ultracrepidarianism ... don't.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2012, 09:39 AM   #14
CitoMaramba
 
CitoMaramba's Avatar
Dojo: Dangayan Singkaw Aikido Shinzui Group Philippines
Location: Plymouth, UK
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 492
Philippines
Offline
Re: Is this Koshi-nage?

Morihiro Saito Shihan demonstrating koshi-nage from Ushiro tekubitori kubi shime attack.. note the sankyo type grip he has on the left hand of uke
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...bPeUmTVs#t=33s

Shoji Nishio Shihan doing something similar from ai hanmi katatetori:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...Rr0uWeV0#t=62s

Inocencio Maramba, MD, MSc
Dangayan Singkaw Aikido Shinzui
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2012, 08:00 AM   #15
chillzATL
Location: ATL
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 846
United_States
Offline
Re: Is this Koshi-nage?

Quote:
Robert M Watson Jr wrote: View Post
same general vibe, but leading uke across the back/hips rather than on the same side as the sankyo.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2012, 09:28 AM   #16
Walter Martindale
  AikiWeb Forums Contributing Member
Location: Cambridge, ON
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 656
Canada
Offline
Re: Is this Koshi-nage?

Her throw looks a little more like a form of shoulder throw from judo, but these seem to be called hip throws in aikido. (Seoinage but from the outside of the arm rather than inside).
W
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2012, 12:26 PM   #17
philippe willaume
 
philippe willaume's Avatar
Location: windsor
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 317
United Kingdom
Offline
Re: Is this Koshi-nage?

Hello
Yes I would say that it is koshi nague of the hips under persuasion.

IMNSHO she is not doing any thing with his arm or is shoulders other than making sure that she has created the space to turn into and that he is somewhat extended and that she can more les make sure that the dude does not face plant.
Basically she was nice to him

Phil

One Ringeck to bring them all and in darkness bind them,
In the Land of Windsor where phlip phlop live.
  Reply With Quote

Please visit our sponsor:

Aikido DVDs and Video Downloads - by George Ledyard Sensei & other great teachers from AikidoDVDS.Com



Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Correlation of Aikido and Daito-Ryu Waza John Driscoll Columns 28 08-04-2013 05:01 PM
The Nage/Uke Dynamic - Guidelines senshincenter General 47 02-20-2006 05:20 PM
committed attack/sensitive ukemi paradox Janet Rosen Training 30 10-13-2005 07:18 PM
Randori Seminar with George Ledyard Sensei aikibaka131 Seminars 11 10-24-2003 12:30 AM
Koshi nage problems!! Liz Evans Techniques 4 04-15-2003 11:23 AM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:41 PM.



vBulletin Copyright © 2000-2014 Jelsoft Enterprises Limited
----------
Copyright 1997-2014 AikiWeb and its Authors, All Rights Reserved.
----------
For questions and comments about this website:
Send E-mail
plainlaid-picaresque outchasing-protistan explicantia-altarage seaford-stellionate