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Old 06-13-2010, 11:22 AM   #51
lbb
Location: Massachusetts
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,654
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Re: techniques to use against a front chest push?

Quote:
Charles David Henderson wrote: View Post
IME the above holds true irrespective of whether one is trying to find underlying principles through their training, as opposed to memorizing pat responses to particular situations.
Well said. Good post.
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Old 06-13-2010, 07:38 PM   #52
Carrie Campbell
Join Date: Oct 2009
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Re: techniques to use against a front chest push?

Quote:
Tim Evans wrote: View Post
Some type of ryotetori waza prehaps?
It seems like any of the ryokatatori techiniques may be appropriate.

More specifically, at an AHI seminar with Robert Kubo Shihan (Jeff Christianham sensei was actually teaching at the time), there was a technique against someone coming toward your chest with palms outstretched before them.

He started with a deflection exercise that ended up with partners switching places. Then, he ended with a technique that locked joints along the way- wrist, elbow, shoulder, etc.

Your forward arm will be in front of you with the hand down and elbow up, much like the sankyo stretch before practice. The exercise itself uses this to slide by with a tenkan.

The technique uses this as a shield of sorts and then your other hand comes over the top, thumb up, fingers to the side, palm forward to accept your partner's palm (the fingers on their hand were up, palms out toward you). The hand was turned backward to lock up the wrist, and then the elbow and other body structure, so that uke starts to go down to a knee. This was then rotated sideways in a circle to get to sankyo. He ended by rotating again in another circle, their hand to their shoulder, elbow up and pivot so their hand & shoulder are on the ground for a pin.

I think the main part of this "new" movement (new to me) was the initial block to protect yourself rather than your partner's attack so much, and then the connection with your partner's skeletal structure.

Just thoughts of a student
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Old 06-14-2010, 09:31 AM   #53
Basia Halliop
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 711
Canada
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Re: techniques to use against a front chest push?

Quote:
Sometimes there is nothing more off balancing than some one reacting to defuse a situation, when you were trying to incite the situation.(it takes two to fight anyways.)
I totally agree that this can often be true in my experience... obviously not always, but sometimes when someone is picking a fight or doing something very openly obnoxious, they are trying to get you mad or upset and generally trying to up the energy level in the situation, and when you kind of shrug if off or wave them away, they can be a bit nonplussed and suddenly realize that if they go on they'll look childish or out of control. Depending on the situation and the person, sometimes that's quite effective.

Also agree that what's most effective might depend among other things on who you are (and e.g. if they're massively bigger than you or near the same size, gender, etc).
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Old 06-14-2010, 11:57 PM   #54
Amir Krause
Dojo: Shirokan Dojo / Tel Aviv Israel
Join Date: Jan 2005
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Re: techniques to use against a front chest push?

The all practical issue seems very strange to me: How can you assure he will only shove you as he goes in?

Since you cannot be sure a shove is just a shove, and he does not have anything in his hands, or going for a punch ... You should not let him touch you and therefore you should do your tai-sabaki to stay out of the line of attack, this will also take you out of the line of the attackers main force.
At this point, you should connect with him and apply a technique appropriate to the situation. Depending on where you moved to, the circumstances (can you still de-escalate and stop the fight? Was the attack only a shove?) , the environment (can you make him block some friend of his? be with his back to your friend?)

I am not going to mention any techniques, since the tai-abaki & mai (including timing and position after the fact) are most important to determine your options to continue, and I know my (korindo's) Tai-Sabaki is smaller then most thus likely to give me different opportunities.

Amir
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Old 06-15-2010, 01:02 PM   #55
Greg Jennings
Dojo: None at the moment.
Location: Springboro, OH
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,078
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Re: techniques to use against a front chest push?

From my painful experience, please consider:

o Above all else, stay calm.

o Move to the side or the back to be able to reasonably claim that you were retreating. Try to maneuver to and keep a barrier between you and them.

o Make placating sounds and hand gestures that witnesses will, hopefully, remember. Ask someone, prefereably someone with some vested interest in keeping the peace, to mediate. Bartender, bouncer, etc.

o If you apply technique, make it something that doesn't look masterful. It's not aikido, per se, but if it's 1v1, pulling a closed guard and grabbing their hair or collar and keeping them pulled down while yelling "somebody get him off me!" is pretty defensible from a legal perspective. If you need to strike, vertical elbows to the top of their head might not draw too much attention.

o When the police report is made up:
oo You were afraid for your life.
oo Everything was a blur.
oo Don't volunteer that you study a martial art.
oo If you are placed under arrest, get a local lawyer before answering any questions.

Last edited by Greg Jennings : 06-15-2010 at 01:07 PM.

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