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Old 03-26-2010, 09:05 AM   #1
seele
 
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Call-out for "I yield" in Japanese

I've heard "mai" "maimatsu" called out as a way of yielding to an opponent, either as an alternative to tap out of a pin or at the end/loss of a practice bout (I've heard it most often in sports such as kendo). However, I can't seem to find any translations to figure out what this means -- and perhaps I have the assumed translation and romaji incorrect. Any ideas?
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Old 03-26-2010, 09:22 AM   #2
Josh Reyer
 
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Re: Call-out for "I yield" in Japanese

Perhaps something got lost in translation. The only words I know for "I yield" in Japanese are "maitta" and it's politer equivalent "mairimashita".

Josh Reyer

The lyf so short, the crafte so longe to lerne,
Th'assay so harde, so sharpe the conquerynge...
- Chaucer
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Old 03-26-2010, 09:39 AM   #3
raul rodrigo
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Re: Call-out for "I yield" in Japanese

"Maitta" is the word used in judo matches.
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Old 03-26-2010, 10:39 AM   #4
Don_Modesto
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Re: Call-out for "I yield" in Japanese

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Raul Rodrigo wrote: View Post
"Maitta" is the word used in judo matches.
When is this used (vs the tap out?)

Don J. Modesto
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Old 03-26-2010, 10:56 AM   #5
raul rodrigo
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Re: Call-out for "I yield" in Japanese

The word "maitta" is used when for one reason or another the man pinned cannot tap, eg, one arm is in juji gatame, the other trapped underneath him or otherwise entangled. Or so my judo referee friend says.
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Old 03-26-2010, 12:10 PM   #6
Walter Martindale
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Re: Call-out for "I yield" in Japanese

both of my judo sensei said it is equivalent to saying "I'm beaten" when you can't tap out... "Maitta"
Walter
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Old 03-26-2010, 02:46 PM   #7
seele
 
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Re: Call-out for "I yield" in Japanese

Thank you everyone for your replies! I might have missed the last syllable when I actually heard maitta.

Is matte also used in judo? I remember hearing this but I thought matte means to wait, not to yield or stop.
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Old 03-26-2010, 05:08 PM   #8
Josh Reyer
 
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Re: Call-out for "I yield" in Japanese

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Celeste Lyn Paul wrote: View Post
Thank you everyone for your replies! I might have missed the last syllable when I actually heard maitta.

Is matte also used in judo? I remember hearing this but I thought matte means to wait, not to yield or stop.
Matte - "Wait."

Maitta - "I yield."

"Matte" wouldn't be used to indicate submission. An imperative form, "Mate" is used in judo as an instruction by the referee, generally meaning "Time (out)."

Josh Reyer

The lyf so short, the crafte so longe to lerne,
Th'assay so harde, so sharpe the conquerynge...
- Chaucer
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Old 03-28-2010, 03:12 AM   #9
seank
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Re: Call-out for "I yield" in Japanese

We used to use matte practicing kumite in Kyokushin when we were injured enough from a kick or punch that we couldn't continue...

I was construed as somewhere between wait and an "...I can't go on"
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Old 03-28-2010, 01:16 PM   #10
Stormcrow34
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Re: Call-out for "I yield" in Japanese

Sometimes, you just can't physically tap, or tap quickly enough, so we use "Maitta" in Yoseikan Budo as a way to verbally tap out. It's just like saying "uncle".
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Old 03-29-2010, 05:57 AM   #11
DonMagee
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Re: Call-out for "I yield" in Japanese

My judo coach has never made the distinction. We use "matte" for stop or tap. If the coach says it, you stop. If you can't tap and you say it, your partner stops.

- Don
"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough" - Albert Einstein
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Old 03-29-2010, 01:05 PM   #12
Walter Martindale
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Re: Call-out for "I yield" in Japanese

"Chotto matte kudasai" - please wait a moment.
Matte - in judo - pause or wait, or stop fighting (but the match isn't necessarily over yet).
Maitta - I'm beaten, or I give up, or....
Itai, Itai, Itai (ow, ow, ow or hurts, hurts, hurts)

my understanding, anyway..
Walter
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Old 03-29-2010, 01:30 PM   #13
phitruong
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Re: Call-out for "I yield" in Japanese

usually i slapped whatever available and screamed "MA MA!" worked in any language, well most languages.

*wouldn't advise staining your gi for good affect. however, if it works go for it!*
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Old 03-30-2010, 08:52 AM   #14
David Orange
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Re: Call-out for "I yield" in Japanese

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Joshua Reyer wrote: View Post
Perhaps something got lost in translation. The only words I know for "I yield" in Japanese are "maitta" and it's politer equivalent "mairimashita".
I've been thinking this comes from "makeru," which is "to be beaten (in a sporting event)" or "to lose (in a sporting event)".

I understood "maeta" to be s shortened form of "maketa", meaning "I lost" (or "you won").

In fact, I think I remember one of the guys telling me that once, a long, long time ago...

Best wishes.

David

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Old 03-30-2010, 10:36 AM   #15
Josh Reyer
 
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Re: Call-out for "I yield" in Japanese

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David Orange wrote: View Post
I've been thinking this comes from "makeru," which is "to be beaten (in a sporting event)" or "to lose (in a sporting event)".

I understood "maeta" to be s shortened form of "maketa", meaning "I lost" (or "you won").

In fact, I think I remember one of the guys telling me that once, a long, long time ago...

Best wishes.

David
Linguistically, that seems very unlikely. The lost medial "k-" occurs preceding "-i", thus "kaku" -> "kakita" -> "kaita", but not preceding "-e".

From a classical Japanese perspective, "kaku" was called a "four degree verb" (yondan doushi). When attached to the perfective "ta(ri)", it changed to "kaki-ta(ri)", and then thus through linguistic shift became modern "kaita".

What I suspect someone suggested to you was that "makeru" originally came from a verb "maku". Perhaps they then conjectured that from "maku" came "maita", like "kaita" came from "kaku".

However, "maku" was a "shimo-nidan doushi" (lower two-level verb). Which means that when you added the perfective inflection to it, the "maku" changed to "make", thus "maketa(ri)".

What is more likely is that the "surrender, submission" meaning of "mairu" arose from it's use as a word indicating humility in the speaker in relation to the one being spoken to. E.g., if I speak to an equal I say, "Kita" - I came. Speaking to a superior, I say, "Maitta".

Corruption from "maketa" to "maeta" to "maitta" seems to me that it'd be some regional variation that achieved common use. I don't want to dismiss that theory out of hand, but I'll just say I've never seen such a theory in any of my references.

Josh Reyer

The lyf so short, the crafte so longe to lerne,
Th'assay so harde, so sharpe the conquerynge...
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Old 03-30-2010, 11:50 AM   #16
David Orange
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Re: Call-out for "I yield" in Japanese

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Joshua Reyer wrote: View Post
Linguistically, that seems very unlikely. The lost medial "k-" occurs preceding "-i", thus "kaku" -> "kakita" -> "kaita", but not preceding "-e"....
Corruption from "maketa" to "maeta" to "maitta" seems to me that it'd be some regional variation that achieved common use. I don't want to dismiss that theory out of hand, but I'll just say I've never seen such a theory in any of my references.
Thinkng more on it, my source was a Saito from Gifu who was uchi deshi at the yoseikan. Everyone was saying maetta! (or maita/maitta!) in practice and I had first learned it in Alabama, but it occurred to me that I didn't really know the meaning of the word and it came up as I conversed with the Gifu man.

And now as I recall, he said that the actual word was magetta, which was from maketta, pronounced magetta and shortened to ma'etta.

I would say it's Shizuoka ben but it seems to be used throughout judo and so would be likely the same word but maybe not the only form of it. I would guess it came to the yoseikan from judo, but whether Saito from Gifu was correct, I cannot guess.

Thanks.

David

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Old 03-30-2010, 07:10 PM   #17
David Orange
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Re: Call-out for "I yield" in Japanese

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David Orange wrote: View Post
...whether Saito from Gifu was correct, I cannot guess.
I finally got the word from my wife, who is from Nagano and teaches Japanese elementary students on Saturdays.

She said that makeru means to lose, but mairu means to admit that one has lost. So the correct form of the term we're discussing, according to her, is maitta.

Saito was a good guy, but he wasn't a linguist and maybe I misunderstood.

David

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Lao Tzu

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Old 04-05-2010, 06:12 AM   #18
WilliB
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Re: Call-out for "I yield" in Japanese

Quote:
David Orange wrote: View Post
I've been thinking this comes from "makeru," which is "to be beaten (in a sporting event)" or "to lose (in a sporting event)".

I understood "maeta" to be s shortened form of "maketa", meaning "I lost" (or "you won").

In fact, I think I remember one of the guys telling me that once, a long, long time ago...

Best wishes.

David
No, definitely not. "Maitta" has nothing to do with makeru; other than for tapping out on the judo mat, the verb maeru is also used for regretting a mistake or apologizing. Not the same as makeru at all.
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